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Dinosaurs on a boat cruise

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Doveaman

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The six days of the creation account in Genesis chapter one began from verse 3 when God said: “Let there be light…” These six days of creation week were completed in verse 31 when God saw that “it was very good.”

Before these six days of creation week began – verses 3 to 31 – we see an earth already existing in verse 2. It was an earth that was formless, empty, dark, and buried in water. It was an earth in a chaotic state, but it was an earth, nevertheless. It was a pre-existing empty earth composed of pre-existing land buried in pre-existing water and shrouded in pre-existing darkness.

Darkness, water, and land, all existing before the six days of creation week began. God then used these three pre-existing elements to create the new conditions on earth in six days. He used the pre-existing darkness for night on the first day, the pre-existing waters for the seas on the third day, and the pre-existing land for vegetation on the third day also.

These three pre-existing elements - darkness, water, and land - all existed before the six days of creation week, suggesting that everything God made was not made during the six days of creation week, but that they were pre-existing chaotic conditions on a pre-existing earth preceding our modern earth. It was from these pre-existing chaotic conditions of a pre-existing earth that God went about creating, in six days, the orderly earth we now live on today.

One might theorize that these chaotic conditions on earth, in verse 2, really occurred on day one, which began in verse 3, but since the scriptures do not say this, for us to say this is to take verse 2 out of its biblical context: “Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters” (Gen.1:2).

These chaotic conditions is the way the earth “was” before God went about creating the earth’s in six days as it is.
God created light and separated it from “darkness” that already “was”.
God created land and separated it from “waters” that already “was”.
God created form from a “formless” condition that already “was”.
And God created inhabitants from an “empty” condition that already “was”.

These pre-existing conditions that already “was” suggest a history of two different conditions of earth existing on the same planet, one set of conditions preceding the other – chaos preceding order.

I venture to propose that these chaotic conditions were not always this way, but that at some point in ancient time this ancient earth was orderly, and then became chaotic. I’m sure this idea is not new, it is base on the view that God does not create chaos, he creates order. Isa 45:18 seems to indicate this:

“For this is what the LORD says — he who created the heavens...he who fashioned and made the earth...he did not create it to be empty, but formed it to be inhabited…”

But, yet, we see an earth, in verse 2, that is empty and uninhabited, suggesting that God did not create these conditions, but that they occurred sometime after His initial orderly creation of the ancient earth.

Chaos is caused by sin, not by God. God executes the judgment, but sin causes the judgment. God brings the earth and its inhabitants into judgment because of sin (2 Pet.3:7).

The existence of ancient conditions on planet earth that were, perhaps, billions of years old, preceding the present modern conditions on earth that are, perhaps, six to ten thousand years old, could explain the existence of fossils of pre-historic life forms that are now extinct.

This extinction might have been caused by some catastrophic disaster that could have been a result of God’s judgment on some pre-historic sin, rendering this ancient earth uninhabitable and in the state of chaos found in verse 2.

The fact that there are many ancient fossils of pre-historic dead animals piled high on top of each other in their death throes, appearing to have died suddenly, suggest this possibility.

This chaotic state of ancient earth might have resembled the chaotic state that existed on earth after Noah’s flood, as is the case in verse 2 – an earth buried in water.

That the earth buried in water in Noah’s flood was a result of sin suggest the possibility that the ancient earth buried in ancient water could have been a result of some ancient sin. After all, Satan was around since ancient times (1 Joh.3:8), long before modern man was formed.

It was from this ancient chaotic earth, that appears to be dead and buried in pre-historic water, verse 2, that God then created, or re-created, our modern orderly earth in six days. Perhaps, it was some kind of geological resurrection of a dead earth from its watery grave, having died as a result of some pre-historic sin?

This is just a suggested possibility that, in my opinion, is not farfetched. But I guess one opinion is as valid as another if no one really knows for sure. But its fun to speculate, just as long as it does not cause any “division in the body…” (1 Cor 12:25).

However, I find it hard to imagine modern man co-existing with ancient predatory dinosaurs. I think we would have been the ones who are extinct today.

I also find it hard to imagine how a sixty foot tall dinosaur and his equally tall mate could fit into Noah’s forty-five foot Ark. Perhaps the Ark had a retractable sunroof. Who knows?

I any case, where are the dinosaurs today? Wasn’t Noah supposed to save at least two? :confused:
 
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He just saved one.

jesus_dinosaur.jpg


Dick Cheney.
 
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hiscosmicgoldfish

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The dinosaurs became extinct because of flatulence. The plants had evolved by then into fibrousious nodes. These were consumed in great quantities, and led to flatulence, which was always fatal. The anthropoid dinosaurs had not evolved a means of expelling the excess gases, but the mammals had already evolved the relief mechanisms, which gave them a huge evolutionary advantage.
 
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Doveaman

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The dinosaurs became extinct because of flatulence. The plants had evolved by then into fibrousious nodes. These were consumed in great quantities, and led to flatulence, which was always fatal. The anthropoid dinosaurs had not evolved a means of expelling the excess gases, but the mammals had already evolved the relief mechanisms, which gave them a huge evolutionary advantage.

Where were you when Darwin was trying to figure that out? He would have been glad to meet you. Your intimate knowledge of the evolutionary process leads one to believe you were present in the guts of the dinosaurs to view, with your own eyes, this evolutionary process taking place. I'm impressed. [FONT=&quot]:)
[/FONT]
 
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hiscosmicgoldfish

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Where were you when Darwin was trying to figure that out? He would have been glad to meet you. Your intimate knowledge of the evolutionary process leads one to believe you were present in the guts of the dinosaurs to view, with your own eyes, this evolutionary process taking place. I'm impressed. [FONT=&quot]:)[/FONT]

what, dont you agree with my theory?
 
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OldWiseGuy

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The six days of the creation account in Genesis chapter one began from verse 3 when God said: “Let there be light…” These six days of creation week were completed in verse 31 when God saw that “it was very good.”

Before these six days of creation week began – verses 3 to 31 – we see an earth already existing in verse 2. It was an earth that was formless, empty, dark, and buried in water. It was an earth in a chaotic state, but it was an earth, nevertheless. It was a pre-existing empty earth composed of pre-existing land buried in pre-existing water and shrouded in pre-existing darkness.

Darkness, water, and land, all existing before the six days of creation week began. God then used these three pre-existing elements to create the new conditions on earth in six days. He used the pre-existing darkness for night on the first day, the pre-existing waters for the seas on the third day, and the pre-existing land for vegetation on the third day also.

These three pre-existing elements - darkness, water, and land - all existed before the six days of creation week, suggesting that everything God made was not made during the six days of creation week, but that they were pre-existing chaotic conditions on a pre-existing earth preceding our modern earth. It was from these pre-existing chaotic conditions of a pre-existing earth that God went about creating, in six days, the orderly earth we now live on today.

One might theorize that these chaotic conditions on earth, in verse 2, really occurred on day one, which began in verse 3, but since the scriptures do not say this, for us to say this is to take verse 2 out of its biblical context: “Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters” (Gen.1:2).

These chaotic conditions is the way the earth “was” before God went about creating the earth’s in six days as it is.
God created light and separated it from “darkness” that already “was”.
God created land and separated it from “waters” that already “was”.
God created form from a “formless” condition that already “was”.
And God created inhabitants from an “empty” condition that already “was”.

These pre-existing conditions that already “was” suggest a history of two different conditions of earth existing on the same planet, one set of conditions preceding the other – chaos preceding order.

I venture to propose that these chaotic conditions were not always this way, but that at some point in ancient time this ancient earth was orderly, and then became chaotic. I’m sure this idea is not new, it is base on the view that God does not create chaos, he creates order. Isa 45:18 seems to indicate this:

“For this is what the LORD says — he who created the heavens...he who fashioned and made the earth...he did not create it to be empty, but formed it to be inhabited…”

But, yet, we see an earth, in verse 2, that is empty and uninhabited, suggesting that God did not create these conditions, but that they occurred sometime after His initial orderly creation of the ancient earth.

Chaos is caused by sin, not by God. God executes the judgment, but sin causes the judgment. God brings the earth and its inhabitants into judgment because of sin (2 Pet.3:7).

The existence of ancient conditions on planet earth that were, perhaps, billions of years old, preceding the present modern conditions on earth that are, perhaps, six to ten thousand years old, could explain the existence of fossils of pre-historic life forms that are now extinct.

This extinction might have been caused by some catastrophic disaster that could have been a result of God’s judgment on some pre-historic sin, rendering this ancient earth uninhabitable and in the state of chaos found in verse 2.

The fact that there are many ancient fossils of pre-historic dead animals piled high on top of each other in their death throes, appearing to have died suddenly, suggest this possibility.

This chaotic state of ancient earth might have resembled the chaotic state that existed on earth after Noah’s flood, as is the case in verse 2 – an earth buried in water.

That the earth buried in water in Noah’s flood was a result of sin suggest the possibility that the ancient earth buried in ancient water could have been a result of some ancient sin. After all, Satan was around since ancient times (1 Joh.3:8), long before modern man was formed.

It was from this ancient chaotic earth, that appears to be dead and buried in pre-historic water, verse 2, that God then created, or re-created, our modern orderly earth in six days. Perhaps, it was some kind of geological resurrection of a dead earth from its watery grave, having died as a result of some pre-historic sin?

This is just a suggested possibility that, in my opinion, is not farfetched. But I guess one opinion is as valid as another if no one really knows for sure. But its fun to speculate, just as long as it does not cause any “division in the body…” (1 Cor 12:25).

However, I find it hard to imagine modern man co-existing with ancient predatory dinosaurs. I think we would have been the ones who are extinct today.

I also find it hard to imagine how a sixty foot tall dinosaur and his equally tall mate could fit into Noah’s forty-five foot Ark. Perhaps the Ark had a retractable sunroof. Who knows?

I any case, where are the dinosaurs today? Wasn’t Noah supposed to save at least two? :confused:

Great brief account of gap theory, which is the only reasonable reconciliation of bible and geological history of the earth. Sadly, like the 'stone rejected by the builders' this theory has been rejected as well. Perhaps because it does make sense.

owg
 
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shernren

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I venture to propose that these chaotic conditions were not always this way, but that at some point in ancient time this ancient earth was orderly, and then became chaotic. I’m sure this idea is not new, it is base on the view that God does not create chaos, he creates order. Isa 45:18 seems to indicate this:

“For this is what the LORD says — he who created the heavens...he who fashioned and made the earth...he did not create it to be empty, but formed it to be inhabited…”

But, yet, we see an earth, in verse 2, that is empty and uninhabited, suggesting that God did not create these conditions, but that they occurred sometime after His initial orderly creation of the ancient earth.

I would suggest that you study the rest of Isaiah 45 as well, including verse 7:

I form light and create darkness,
I make well-being and create calamity,
I am the LORD, who does all these things.

[Isa 45:7 ESV]
 
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hiscosmicgoldfish

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I'm a young - earth creationist. Literal 6 days creation. I am also a geocentrist. 'Reading a fascinating book now.. it's by two catholic PHD's .. Galileo was wrong, the church was right. I suppose it's the ultimate scientific heresy these days, to even mention if Copernicus was wrong, and if or no he proved his theory. This is the most interesting thing i can think of really.. finding out the truth about everything.
 
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Doveaman

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I would suggest that you study the rest of Isaiah 45 as well, including verse 7:

I form light and create darkness,
I make well-being and create calamity,
I am the LORD, who does all these things.

[Isa 45:7 ESV]

My proposal that God does not create chaos was only in reference to His creating the heavens and the earth, as is specifically mentioned in Isa.45:18, the verse I specifically quoted. It was not in reference to the calamity God brings on the earth as an expression of His judgment on sin, as is the case in Isa.45, including verse 7.

That God created the earth to be inhabited and not empty is undeniable. That God brings calamity on that same earth as a judgment on sin is also undeniable. There is no conflict here.

In fact, your reference seem to support my theory rather than deny it: that God created the ancient earth to be inhabited and not empty, but because of some pre-historic sin God brought calamity on that ancient earth as an expression of his judgment on that sin, resulting in the chaotic conditions found in Gen.1:2.
 
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OldWiseGuy

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I'm a young - earth creationist. Literal 6 days creation. I am also a geocentrist. 'Reading a fascinating book now.. it's by two catholic PHD's .. Galileo was wrong, the church was right. I suppose it's the ultimate scientific heresy these days, to even mention if Copernicus was wrong, and if or no he proved his theory. This is the most interesting thing i can think of really.. finding out the truth about everything.

I have heard the theory that the universe actually revolves around the earth. However, this is impossible to prove (at the present time). But what if it were 'kinda' true in that the universe actually revolves around the throne of God, which is close to the earth (which God calls his "footstool". This would mean that the universe is really God-centered, wouldn't it?

Also isn't geocentrism, being earth-centered, 'worshipping' the creation rather than the creator (kindasorta)?

Young earth creationism also assumes that the earth, as well as the universe, was made exclusively for man. Bible evidence indicates that it was first made for the pleasure of the angels, who rebelled and lost it. This gives the universe all sorts of ancient history, and fits well with the apparent age of the earth.

owg (gapper)
 
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theFijian

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Young earth creatism also assumes that the earth, as well as the universe, was made exclusively for man. Bible evidence indicates that it was first made for the pleasure of the angels, who rebelled and lost it.

On the contrary, biblical evidence shows that Creation was a gift from the Father to the Son. See Romans 11:36.
 
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mark kennedy

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On the contrary, biblical evidence shows that Creation was a gift from the Father to the Son. See Romans 11:36.

Really? I was under the impression that God created the heavens and the earth because he wanted to and does things according to the council of his own will.
 
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Assyrian

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On the contrary, biblical evidence shows that Creation was a gift from the Father to the Son. See Romans 11:36.
Really? I was under the impression that God created the heavens and the earth because he wanted to and does things according to the council of his own will.
Doesn't "wanted to do things according to the council of his own will" simply mean he wanted to do what he wanted? It still leaves the question of what God wanted in the first place. Which I think theFijian answered very well. What's that old saying? "The prospect of a wedding concentrates the mind wonderfully."
 
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OldWiseGuy

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On the contrary, biblical evidence shows that Creation was a gift from the Father to the Son. See Romans 11:36.

Romans 11 is all about the redemption of the chosen, concluding with the "all things" reference, which means all that God has chosen to redeem from the world.

owg
 
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OldWiseGuy

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Doesn't "wanted to do things according to the council of his own will" simply mean he wanted to do what he wanted? It still leaves the question of what God wanted in the first place. Which I think theFijian answered very well.

We probably don't know what God really wants i.e. these verses just before vs 36:

:33 O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out!

:34 For who hath known the mind of the Lord? or who hath been his counsellor?

What's that old saying? "The prospect of a wedding concentrates the mind wonderfully."

I think that was a 'hanging' (although............) :D

owg
 
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icamewithasword

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Doveaman,

How long did it take you to come up with this? If your going to state that God only improved upon an Earth that was already formed..... It would have taken much less time for you to just type "god is a liar" and been done with it.

You can't work backwards in Genesis and expect to see truth.
Verse three is the creation of light. Verse two talks of the formless earth, just like you stated.....
NOW......wait for it, because the timeclock hasn't started yet......
Verse ONE: IN THE BEGINNING (now you can start your stopwatch) God created the heavens and earth.
START at the first verse.
FINISH at the end of verse five.
Your stopwatch should read 24hrs. If it doesn't, then your watch lies; not God!
 
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