Jesus vs Today's Science

[AV1611VET]

What if Jesus came back today and performed every single miracle that He performed when He was here before --- and more?

1. healed the sick --- cleared out any hospital He went into
2. raised the dead --- cleared out any funeral home and graveyard He went into
3. increased lunches 5000-fold ex materia
4. told you everything about yourself without hesitation, even stuff you didn't know
5. walked through solid objects
6. walked on water
7. halted an earthquake in progress
8. held interviews
9. walked through hostile crowds untouched
10. died and resurrected

If, just before He ascended back to Heaven, He held one last interview for scientists, and told them:

What more can I do, so that you will conclude that I am God, and not someone from another planet?

What would be your question and/or challenge for Him?

The point of this thread is to show that there is NOTHING within science today that can be presented as either proof, or sufficient evidence, that Jesus is God, and that He created this earth ex nihilo. If you are going to accept Him, it will have to be by faith --- not sight.

 

[Matthewj1985]

The point of this thread is to show that there is NOTHING within science today that can be presented as either proof, or sufficient evidence, that Jesus is God, and that He created this earth ex nihilo. If you are going to accept Him, it will have to be by faith --- not sight.

Which is why your creation story is just as true as any other religion's. Why you can't understand this is beyond me.

 

[ragarth]

Having Jesus in the flesh to perform these miracles would indeed be definitive proof that such acts are possible, ergo, my question would be 'what took you so long?' in a joking manner. At this point, I'd need to weight the context of the message as to why he's here and see if there's some evil, sinister alien plot to eat my brain. Void of alien plots to eat my brain, I'd probably end up a Christian.

 

[TemperateSeaIsland]

Personally I'd be convinced of his claim after the 10 you posted.

I'd like to ask you a question - what if he did all those things and more but then told you the bible isn't a 100% true and large portions are the result of man's tampering and imagination?

 

[Matthewj1985]

Personally I'd be convinced of his claim after the 10 you posted.

I'd like to ask you a question - what if he did all those things and more but then told you the bible isn't a 100% true and large portions are the result of man's tampering and imagination?

He would promptly be told to take a hike.

 

[70x7]

Personally I'd be convinced of his claim after the 10 you posted.

I'd like to ask you a question - what if he did all those things and more but then told you the bible isn't a 100% true and large portions are the result of man's tampering and imagination?

But even if there were parts that were not true, what would they be? They couldnt be the parts where Jesus did the miracles because He again would have proved that He was who He said He was. Jesus IS Truth.
God couldn't have told a lie, so anything that He said or did is not even something that would be in question.

I guess I am saying what do you think He would say is not accurate?

 

[Nathan Poe]

What if Jesus came back today and performed every single miracle that He performed when He was here before --- and more?

1. healed the sick --- cleared out any hospital He went into
2. raised the dead --- cleared out any funeral home and graveyard He went into
3. increased lunches 5000-fold ex materia
4. told you everything about yourself without hesitation, even stuff you didn't know
5. walked through solid objects
6. walked on water
7. halted an earthquake in progress
8. held interviews
9. walked through hostile crowds untouched
10. died and resurrected

If, just before He ascended back to Heaven, He held one last interview for scientists, and told them:What would be your question and/or challenge for Him?

1. "So, do I get reimbursed on my insurance, or what?"
2. "AHHH! ZOMBIES! Quick, Jesus, can you whip up a shotgun ex nihilo?"
3. "Loaves and fishes again? Can't you conjure up a pizza?"
4. "Have you ever considered taking that act to Vegas?"
5. "So, why'd they have to roll back the stone on that tomb, anyway?"
6. "when the waves break, does it tickle?"
7. "Would you consider a cabinet position from Governor Schwarzenegger?"
8. "So, who's your pick for the Superbowl?"
9. "Who're those big men standing besides you with the dark suits and automatic weapons?"
10. "You didn't see Elvis on the Other Side, did you?"

All kidding aside, I suppose I could boil it down to one simple question:

"What took you so long?"

 

[Tinker Grey]

But even if there were parts that were not true, what would they be?

God killing the Egyptians. God wiping out the Earth, i.e. Noah's flood. God ordering genocide of the Canaanites. God ordaining laws ordering the stoning of children, adulterers, or anyone really. The list goes on ...

 

[gaara4158]

Personally I'd be 100% convinced of his divinity. I'd have a lot of questions for him, and it would still take a lot more to make him worthy of praise. The Native Americans worshiped Hernando Cortez because he seemed pretty godly, and look what happened to them...

Also, this would prove that the Bible is not 100% correct, because it warns specifically against people performing miracles claiming to be Jesus. I'd ask him to explain that passage. But ultimately, I don't see there being any way short of mind control in which he could convince me that he's the good guy and not just selling me something.

The point of this thread is to show that there is NOTHING within science today that can be presented as either proof, or sufficient evidence, that Jesus is God, and that He created this earth ex nihilo. If you are going to accept Him, it will have to be by faith --- not sight.

So why do you accept him? There's absolutely no reason no, other than because you want to. You admitted it yourself.

 

[NailsII]

If, just before He ascended back to Heaven, He held one last interview for scientists, and told them:What would be your question and/or challenge for Him?

I'd ask if he could put someone with half a brain in charge of the world's banks....
Then I'd believe.

 

[billwald]

Every miracle was done to make a theological point. Jesus could have poofed every person into health but didn't.

 

[Athrond]

What if Jesus came back today and performed every single miracle that He performed when He was here before --- and more?

1. healed the sick --- cleared out any hospital He went into
2. raised the dead --- cleared out any funeral home and graveyard He went into
3. increased lunches 5000-fold ex materia
4. told you everything about yourself without hesitation, even stuff you didn't know
5. walked through solid objects
6. walked on water
7. halted an earthquake in progress
8. held interviews
9. walked through hostile crowds untouched
10. died and resurrected

If, just before He ascended back to Heaven, He held one last interview for scientists, and told them:What would be your question and/or challenge for Him?

hmmmmmm, "You can see what I'm thinking, right? Please, can you tell them that?"

The point of this thread is to show that there is NOTHING within science today that can be presented as either proof, or sufficient evidence, that Jesus is God, and that He created this earth ex nihilo. If you are going to accept Him, it will have to be by faith --- not sight.

Is this a double edged sword?

 

[ranmaonehalf]

All kidding aside, I suppose I could boil it down to one simple question:

"What took you so long?"

No kidding!!
Do you know how much trouble you caused by not doing your work better?

 

[MrGoodBytes]

I'd convert to Christianity immediately. Then I'd ask him why he didn't do all that earlier.

 

[thaumaturgy]

Actually that's a pretty good question, AV!

But here's the back-story:

I don't see miracles, ever, in my daily life. Never. Not one. I see some unexplained stuff, and I hear stories about people who think they saw a miracle or occasional stories like Peter Popoff and his scam, and I've gotten ads in the mail for a "miracle Jesus Prayer Sheet" which was little more than a "printers trick" related to half-toning.

So miracles don't "mean" anything to me except that I don't believe in them.

Which brings us back to your story. YOU, to my knowledge, didn't see Jesus perform all those miracles, you have what is called a written account. The written account is anonymous and written at an unknown time (depending on the Gospel in question, most are thought to have been written well after Jesus was gone back to heaven.)

So, compared to your anonymous sources written at unknown times, telling you various miracles occured, I am afraid I would assume it as likely (perhaps moreso considering I've never seen a miracle) that they were stories written by someone for a religious reason, not necessarily fact.

Of course, that doesn't say the stories cannot be fact. Even if they were, I'd require at least a bit more "proof" that the stories were contemporary and by witnesses.

But all that aside, if JC were stading in front of me now and did all those things under strict, scientifically controlled circumstances, I am afraid I would have to assume that he was, indeed, something special.

Of course all the miracles in the world may not mean he is God or the son thereof, just that he can do "miracles" (whatever they are).

So, I guess, in a sense, you're right. It is an "Empirical" matter I suppose.

I am pretty sure, though, if that event were transpire as described with me witnessing it and all variables as accounted for as possible, I too would definitely err on the side of assuming Jesus is God.

It is only reasonable and fair. It would certainly provide far more reason to believe than I currently have. Remember, I am an atheist not because I think "God doesn't exist", but rather because I fail to see sufficient reason to believe God exists. That's a very different concept. More proof would assist in shifting that.

 

[AV1611VET]

Actually that's a pretty good question, AV!

But here's the back-story:

I don't see miracles, ever, in my daily life. Never. Not one.

That's because you believe they are magic --- not miracles.

(Unless I've got the wrong person --- if so --- kindly disregard.)

Which brings us back to your story. YOU, to my knowledge, didn't see Jesus perform all those miracles, you have what is called a written account. The written account is anonymous and written at an unknown time (depending on the Gospel in question, most are thought to have been written well after Jesus was gone back to heaven.)

Stopping here --- I don't need this --- thanks, anyway.

 

[Nathan Poe]

Stopping here --- I don't need this --- thanks, anyway.

Should've known you'd tell the truth to take a hike.

 

[kangitanka]

Every miracle was done to make a theological point. Jesus could have poofed every person into health but didn't.

Point made, by a Christian
Im guessing AV wont debate billwald's thread killing point.
Because he can't.

 

[thaumaturgy]

(Unless I've got the wrong person --- if so --- kindly disregard.)Stopping here --- I don't need this --- thanks, anyway.

ACtually if you hadn't "stopped there" you'd see that I would be more likely to believe in Jesus as God.

But you are too busy "shutting down" other people's concepts.

Too bad for you, I actually almost agreed with your OP's premise.

But you, in your "Christian-ness" came around to making me regret that decision.

 

[thaumaturgy]

Should've known you'd tell the truth to take a hike.

Ya know, the ironic thing is, I actually kind of liked the premise of the OP and was willing to give an honest answer that if I saw all those things under controlled scientific circumstances I would be more likely to believe in Jesus as God!

So much for the "Great Commission".

He whines that people don't like him for because he's "Christian", and then he treats my post like that? Irony doesn't seem to be a strong enough word.