Why isn't Eve made together with Adam?

[juvenissun]

I fi9xed the title for you

Thanks.

 

[juvenissun]

Yet the command to be fruitful and multiply and fill the earth in Gen 1:28 predates the fall, it comes before Gen 1:31 And God saw everything that he had made, and behold, it was very good.

But Gen 2 does show that men and women are meant for much more than simply reproduction, it shows us Gods plan for a wife to be a help meet for her husband and gives us beautiful allegorical image of the union and unity of man and wife with Eve being taken from Adam's rib and being bone of his bone and flesh of his flesh. The account itself draws the allegorical conclusion that this is about every man leaving his parents and being united one flesh with his wife. So in a way I agree with you the story of Adam and Eve does emphasis the importance of other aspects of marriage rather than just reproduction, but not by excluding reproduction, that command was there from the beginning too, but we see it in chapter 1 instead.

So, would you say human reproduction is fundamentally different from animal reproduction in nature? Because the process and the purpose are different from the beginning.

 

[billwald]

You all missing a critical issue. Every Sunday we sing ditties in church about "all we need is Jesus" and such. Genesis states that all Adam had was an eyeball to eyeball relationship with God and while Adam was still sinless this relationship was insufficient.

 

[Assyrian]

So, would you say human reproduction is fundamentally different from animal reproduction in nature? Because the process and the purpose are different from the beginning.

They are? Because on the wildlife documentaries the process looks pretty similar, bonobos even do it missionary position. We are not the only species to pair for life and some species are better at it than we are. Don't you get species where the animal pairs help each other, finding food, minding the young, defending against predators? (Mind you there are also supposedly bonded for life species that indulge in cheating and even prostitution. A female penguin may cheat when her mate is away and sell her favours for a nice looking stone for the nest.) Genesis is not saying animals don't have their mates, lots of animals have God created help meet for them. It is saying only helper suitable for Adam was another human being. I think what the passage is about is telling selfish and arrogant men their wives are not just a convenient way of getting their needs gratified and giving them babies, but a life partner and companion chosen for them by God.

There are differences, at least in degree, between us and animal pairs. We are capable of a greater depth of emotional commitment. They don't write love songs, and they just eat roses.

 

[pastorkevin73]

It's a plot device. Genesis is not a record of historical events, but a story about man's relationship with God and one another.

Sooooo, Abraham, Issac, Jacob or the entire Hebrew race never existed?

 

[busterdog]

They are? Because on the wildlife documentaries the process looks pretty similar, bonobos even do it missionary position. We are not the only species to pair for life and some species are better at it than we are. Don't you get species where the animal pairs help each other, finding food, minding the young, defending against predators? (Mind you there are also supposedly bonded for life species that indulge in cheating and even prostitution. A female penguin may cheat when her mate is away and sell her favours for a nice looking stone for the nest.) Genesis is not saying animals don't have their mates, lots of animals have God created help meet for them.

If you take 1,000 species and if in the aggregate you find some repetition of most human traits in some form and to some limited degree, that does not by a long stretch make humans and animals similar in sexuality, except in the most superficial way.

Is there an animal that realizes it is naked and makes clothes for itself?

 

[busterdog]

You all missing a critical issue. Every Sunday we sing ditties in church about "all we need is Jesus" and such. Genesis states that all Adam had was an eyeball to eyeball relationship with God and while Adam was still sinless this relationship was insufficient.

How was it insufficient? We have nothing to suggest that it was insufficient.

I do think the Gospel might suggest that the relationship of the Church to Jesus is a better deal in some respects, perhaps God is glorified more as redeemer than the King of paradise.

 

[gluadys]

How was it insufficient? We have nothing to suggest that it was insufficient.

What about Genesis 2:18? If his relationship with God was all sufficient, in what way was it not good for the man to be alone?

 

[Assyrian]

If you take 1,000 species and if in the aggregate you find some repetition of most human traits in some form and to some limited degree, that does not by a long stretch make humans and animals similar in sexuality, except in the most superficial way.

I was talking about very common traits in animals, (apart from the bonobo preference for the missionary position). How is a pair of gannets bonding for life only a 'superficially' similar to husband and wife joined for life? The fact that they are better at staying faithful than us?

Is there an animal that realizes it is naked and makes clothes for itself?

Hermit crabs and caddis fly larvae. But I thought the clothes thing was to do with sin and the fall, not God's original purpose for marriage shown in the creation account as Juv asked in the OP.

 

[busterdog]

I was talking about very common traits in animals, (apart from the bonobo preference for the missionary position). How is a pair of gannets bonding for life only a 'superficially' similar to husband and wife joined for life? The fact that they are better at staying faithful than us?

Hermit crabs and caddis fly larvae. But I thought the clothes thing was to do with sin and the fall, not God's original purpose for marriage shown in the creation account as Juv asked in the OP.

Juv's point was that they are fundamentally different. Your comparison of position is obviously not the issue.

Larvae? You are making my point by the extreme comparison.

If the awareness of nakedness has nothing to do with sex, then I guess we not going to find common ground.

 

[busterdog]

What about Genesis 2:18? If his relationship with God was all sufficient, in what way was it not good for the man to be alone?

Insufficient means less than sufficient.

Something good is usually more than sufficient, or a blessing on top of sufficiency. The absence of particular blessing is not "insufficient."

I went back to look at Billwald's post, and now I think I dont understand what he is saying about "insufficiency".

 

[juvenissun]

They are? Because on the wildlife documentaries the process looks pretty similar, bonobos even do it missionary position. We are not the only species to pair for life and some species are better at it than we are. Don't you get species where the animal pairs help each other, finding food, minding the young, defending against predators? (Mind you there are also supposedly bonded for life species that indulge in cheating and even prostitution. A female penguin may cheat when her mate is away and sell her favours for a nice looking stone for the nest.) Genesis is not saying animals don't have their mates, lots of animals have God created help meet for them. It is saying only helper suitable for Adam was another human being. I think what the passage is about is telling selfish and arrogant men their wives are not just a convenient way of getting their needs gratified and giving them babies, but a life partner and companion chosen for them by God.

There are differences, at least in degree, between us and animal pairs. We are capable of a greater depth of emotional commitment. They don't write love songs, and they just eat roses.

If so, then my question in the OP applied AGAIN. Why do we run in circles. Woman is uniquely made from the flesh of Adam and is made much later than Adam MUST have greater significance than animal creation, pair or not paired.

 

[juvenissun]

What about Genesis 2:18? If his relationship with God was all sufficient, in what way was it not good for the man to be alone?

I like what Busterdog said: Because Adam would become even better if he could extend his love someone else other than God. I don't think Adam is dumb. He followed Eve to eat the forbidden fruit is a genuine show of human love (I wonder why isn't there more discussion on this issue from Adam's point of view).

 

[juvenissun]

If the awareness of nakedness has nothing to do with sex, then I guess we not going to find common ground.

Ha ha ha.. Thanks for a crack.

 

[Beauty4Ashes]

First of all, when God says it is not good for man to be alone, I don't believe he was just referring to a companion, as after Eve is created they are instructed to be fruitful and multiply. Therefore, another purpose in Eve was so that they could reproduce and have more people around to be in relationship with (not just romantic relationship)

The creation story is a little iffy when taken completely literally. Regardless, obviously God intended to create Eve right after Adam or why would he have sexual organs in the first place? Therefore it's inconsequential whether or not adam and eve were created one after another or simultaneously.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

If so, then my question in the OP applied AGAIN. Why do we run in circles. Woman is uniquely made from the flesh of Adam and is made much later than Adam MUST have greater significance than animal creation, pair or not paired.

Actually Eve was made on the same 'day' as Adam. God finished all his work of making stuff by the end of the sixth day.

Your question brings you close to the most incredible truth of all. I'm amazed that no one gets it. You are close to the answer, because you are asking the question.

I like the word unique as it really encompasses a lot of meaning regarding Eve's creation.

Here's a clue for you. Notice that after Eve was made the flesh of Adam was closed up. Whyzzat? It should go without saying that his side was closed up. What is the deeper meaning of this? And what is the significance of the rib in all this?

owg

 

[OldWiseGuy]

See next post.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

I like what Busterdog said: Because Adam would become even better if he could extend his love someone else other than God. I don't think Adam is dumb. He followed Eve to eat the forbidden fruit is a genuine show of human love (I wonder why isn't there more discussion on this issue from Adam's point of view).

No one wants to know Adams point of view. It is Eve's that is important.
A recent sitcom had this funny bit:

A guy was complaining to his friend:

"My wife wanted a cat, and I didn't.
So we compromised............and got a cat."

owg

 

[juvenissun]

The creation story is a little iffy when taken completely literally. Regardless, obviously God intended to create Eve right after Adam or why would he have sexual organs in the first place? Therefore it's inconsequential whether or not adam and eve were created one after another or simultaneously.

That is indeed something to think about. Thanks.

 

[juvenissun]

Actually Eve was made on the same 'day' as Adam. God finished all his work of making stuff by the end of the sixth day.


Here's a clue for you. Notice that after Eve was made the flesh of Adam was closed up. Whyzzat? It should go without saying that his side was closed up. What is the deeper meaning of this? And what is the significance of the rib in all this?

Another few very good questions. I have no clue on what to say (at least for now). The time restriction of one Day is a very good reminder.

Yes, I always wonder about why should it be the rib, a bone, instead of a piece of (important) meat somewhere like the heart or the brain. Yes, the function of rib is to protect. Right, OWG? But, who protects who?