Can a Christian be a Freemason???

[morningstar2651]

I can't comment on FM specifically, but I recall that in Boyscouts, we keep pretty quiet about the OA because it ruins the fun of becoming a member if you already know everything about it. If you take that mystery away, it loses its sense of wonder and becomes mundane.

 

[Rev Wayne]

I can't comment on FM specifically, but I recall that in Boyscouts, we keep pretty quiet about the OA because it ruins the fun of becoming a member if you already know everything about it.

EXACTLY!!!

In fact, there is one such event during the EA degree that I would not even think about telling a candidate beforehand, because it would TOTALLY ruin the moment.

As one who has taken part in many a snipe hunt, I understand the value of keeping mum about the details.

But there is really a lot more to it than that, I would consider it superficial if that's all there were to it. In the first degree, the candidate is taken through a series of steps in which he has to ask, seek, and knock before certain information is revealed. Here are some explanations of its meaning:

A certain Masonic ceremony used during the process of initiation refers to the Scriptural triad of Ask-Seek-Knock; because every one that asketh with a sincere faith receiveth; he that diligently seeketh is sure to find; and to him that earnestly and with steady perseverance knocketh, without being discouraged because the first report or even the second remains unanswered, shall be admitted at the open door. Thus any one who wishes to participate in the secrets of the Craft must, as a preliminary preparation, seek in his mind, or in other words, examine himself carefully, that he may correctly ascertain whether his desire proceeds merely from some volatile and hastily-formed whim, which is likely to be evanescent and vanish at the first moment of trial, should any trifling difficulty intervene to cast a damp upon his hopes and expectations. If such be the slight and feeble grounds of his determination, he would act wisely to abandon it at once, for his admission under such circumstances would neither be gratifying to himself nor beneficial to the Order (Oliver, The Freemason’s Treasury, p. 116-17).

In Sherer’s Masonic Ladder, the further explanation of “ask-seek-knock” is in the form of a poem:

ASK, and ye shall receive;
SEEK, ye shall surely find;
KNOCK, ye shall no resistance meet,
If come with ready mind;
For all that ASK, and ask aright,
Are welcome to our Lodge to-night.

Lay down the bow and spear;
Resign the sword and shield:
Forget the arts of warfare here,
The arms of peace to wield;
For all that SEEK, and seek aright,
Are welcome to our Lodge to-night.

Bring hither thoughts of peace;
Bring hither words of love:
Diffuse the pure and holy joy,
That cometh from above;
For all that KNOCK, and knock aright,
Are welcome to our Lodge to-night.

ASK help of Him that 's high;
SEEK grace of Him that's true:
KNOCK patiently, the hand is nigh,
Will open unto you;
For all that ASK, SEEK, KNOCK aright,
Are welcome to our Lodge to-night. (p. 10)

And then there are these words of explanation also:

Freemasonry contains another beautiful illustration of the number three, which ought not to be overlooked. It alludes to an ancient and venerable exhortation in the Sacred Scriptures — "Ask, and you shall have — Seek, and you shall find — Knock, and it shall be opened unto you." These words were uttered by Him who spake as never man spake; and as He has thus constituted a passport into an earthly Lodge, so also must He be our passport into a Lodge not made with hands, eternal in the heavens. (Oliver, The Pythagorean Triangle, p. 90)

It must be remembered that Masonry is a symbolic system. The key to a symbolic system is, an assumed willingness and/or desire on the part of the candidate to delve deeper into what is taught, for the lessons are not direct. As stated above, the candidate who is not actively "asking, seeking, and knocking," has little to gain and may just as well not join.

 

[Jester4kicks]

markesmen: You know they actually are, the info is all over the net about just such affliations. Your going have to try alot harder than that to prevent so many anti FM sentiments when there is so much anti FM material out there for public consumption.I for one dont believe all of it, however definately over 50% of it.There is simply too many diverse but agreed claims for FM not to be anti christ.

Just so I understand that... because there's a lot of wild claims out there... some of them must be true? I'm curious... at what arbitrary point do you determine that the number of rediculous claims suddenly lends any amount of truth to any of the the claims themselves?

Or, to make it easier... how many accusations do I have to make about something before you'll start to believe me?

Even if you could turn the tide on public perceptions of FM the fact that it is so exclusive and elitist will always build suspicion against FM for the same reason the too common majority dont like any secret cliquey grouping.

Exclusive and elitist? How so?

Also is it still official FM membership policy to exlcude catholics and certain other categories thus getting their backs up.

Ummm... small problem, there is not "official Freemasonry membership policy" that excludes catholics. Freemasons would welcome a catholic just as we would welcome any other eligible member. However, there IS a restriction from the catholic church which prohibits catholics to be masons.

As for "certain other categories"... the only people excluded from Freemasonry are:
-atheists
-women (although they have a counterpart they can join)

Yeah... guess that's a really selective list.

wy: Above info is typical FM history however its all pretty stock standard nothing new, nothing I for one havent seen hundreds of times before in official history on FM. I think what these posters want here is your fraternal secrets. Will you divulge them to the profane I doubt it!.

Most of it is nothing new because there really isn't that much that is so interesting about Freemasonry. As usual, the truth is really much more boring than the conspiracy theories.

As Wayseer said, the only real secrets in Freemasonry are the methods by which a person identifies themselves to be a Freemason. But even with those things, they're out there. I've seen them all in various books... although many of them are not presented in a way that would actually get you into a lodge if you were a complete stranger.

So I guess the question is... what "secrets" are you really asking for here?

 

[Trelawrence]

As to the original question, I honestly believe arguing the merits is a waste of time. The easy answer is if the one is in conflict with the other, there might be a problem.

On a more severe scale, does the one glorify God?

These are answers best left for the adherents to both, but I do not think it is my place to state my opinion from outside looking in.

 

[wayseer]

However, there IS a restriction from the catholic church which prohibits catholics to be masons.

I have been told that this is no longer in the line of the Vatican - although individual priests may still find certain objections.

 

[Jester4kicks]

I have been told that this is no longer in the line of the Vatican - although individual priests may still find certain objections.

It's a little ambiguous. The catholic church hasn't actually come out and said "ok, you can all be masons now"... but they have become significantly less vocal about their position against Freemasonry.

 

[wayseer]

I think what these posters want here is your fraternal secrets. Will you divulge them to the profane I doubt it!.

Please re-read my posts. The only secrets are to do with the sign, token or word - there are no other secrets.

Will I divulge them? No. Not because of 'the profane' (whatever you might mean). But because I have given a commitment that I would not do so. It is that simple. If you really want to know them you will find them without too much trouble on the web.

Of course, even knowing these signs, token and words will not gain you access to a Lodge. There is a procedure of testing which basically entails having to memorise all the ritual - and if you're willing to go to such lengths one might ask - why not join the fraternity yourself?

 

[wayseer]

It's a little ambiguous....

Thank you for that - sounds more politics than anything else.

 

[Jester4kicks]

Thank you for that - sounds more politics than anything else.

The catholic church playing politics?! Nooo.... never!

 

[NavyGuy7]

Can a Christian be a Freemason?

Can a man serve two masters?

 

[NavyGuy7]

The catholic church playing politics?! Nooo.... never!

Yah, that would NEVER happen.

 

[Rev Wayne]

Can a Christian be a Freemason?

Can a man serve two masters?

 

[NavyGuy7]

Think about it. Why would I say "two" masters?

 

[Rev Wayne]

Think about it. Why would I say "two" masters?

I'm thinking more about why you dodge the question.

 

[wayseer]

Can a Christian be a Freemason?

Can a man serve two masters?

Interesting - but what is your point?

You obviously have something in mind otherwise there is no point to your question.

 

[Jester4kicks]

Think about it. Why would I say "two" masters?

Still not understanding the question....

 

[Diane_Windsor]

Yes, one can be a Mason and a Christian.

I concur. There have been many Masons in my mother's Baptist family.

 

[wayseer]

I think what NavyGuy7 is not saying is something like - no one can serve two masters.

What he does not understand is that his assumption is that by belonging to a LOdge, or a club, or a political party, of the local football club, one is somehow therefore deemed as 'serving two masters' and one's loyalty to God is therefore compromised.

 

[NavyGuy7]

I think what NavyGuy7 is not saying is something like - no one can serve two masters.

What he does not understand is that his assumption is that by belonging to a LOdge, or a club, or a political party, of the local football club, one is somehow therefore deemed as 'serving two masters' and one's loyalty to God is therefore compromised.

You almost had it. Oh, and me not saying it... well, I had to go to bed, so all those posts after my last one on here... well, I was sleeping, and then I had to go to work. So now I'm back.
*coffee mug slides into hand, smug smile on face*
I mean merely this. Just as one can't drink tea and coffee simultaneously without ruining the flavor, it is also that one cannot serve God and... well, the verse says "Money" but I think in this case it would be much more accurate to say "Lucifer"; without the truth being distorted, in any case.
Basically... one can't serve God and his enemy, Satan, simultaneously. Because attempting to do both would be a deadly contradiction.

 

[marksman315]

The primary method of accusation against Freemasonry is the unsubstantiated insinuendo:

IMHO, such claims are completely unsubstantiated and deserve to be ignored. There have been more than the usual share of them for several pages now. There seem to be a number of claims on this thread lately which repeat what they have heard, or what somebody else has heard and repeated, or what they have read somewhere and conveniently forgot to mention where. The whole approach on which the claims are based is devoid of merit, or logic, or truth.

I'm glad that some people, like wayseer, chose not to ignore what I wrote. I prefaced everything I said because I was not 100% sure, and I wanted to make it very clear that I was only going by hearsay or what I have watched on tv (you can blame the history channel and WVCY if you like).