A re-examination of nothing

[EnemyPartyII]

The Bible does indeed explain why there is no such thing as same-sex marriage, as it defines marriage as man and woman. Man and woman is not a same-sex union

The bible never defines marriage as only occuring between a man, and a woman. Indeed, there are many examples in the Bible that do not conform to your "1 man, one woman" view.

The Bible defines marriage between man and woman about 180 times! See a couple of early examples.
Genesis 4:19 “Lamech married two women, one named Adah and the other Zillah. “
Genesis 19:14 “So Lot went out and spoke to his sons-in-law, who were pledged to marry his daughters. He said, "Hurry and get out of this place, because the LORD is about to destroy the city!" But his sons-in-law thought he was joking. “
Do you think Lot was joking

The Bible might MENTION, or REFER TO marriage about 180 times. Thats not the same as DEFINING marriage.

Lamech married two women, one named Adah and the other Zillah

thats not a definition.

Rubbish, Same-sex unions are condemned in the Bible, see Gen 19, Lev 18:22, 1 Cor 6, Romans 1 etc.

Gen 19 doesn't mention same sex unions, actually, none of those verses do. so fail.

The Bible does make such a claim, in several places. For example Jesus says to the Pharisees have you not read that in the beginning God made them male and female, for this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be untied with his wife and the two shall become one flesh. That’s in the Bible Matt 19 and refers to Genesis 2 which is also in the Bible.

Again, maybe if you actually read what people were posting instead of what you WISHED they posted... I was saying that not even the Bible claims that the Bible is the word of God.

I'll ask again, is English a second language for you? If so, you're English is exceptionally good, and I can understand why you have some difficulty parsing some of our more ambiguous gramatical structures. But if English IS your first language... you need to practice your comprehension a bit more. You seem to take people's meanings the wrong way quite frequently.

 

[Chaplain David]

Sanctification is a work not of the flesh but of the Holy Spirit in a person.

I know that you have a fundamental idea of biblical truth but let's take sanctification and illuminate it. I will partially list some attributes of sanctification, where it comes from, how to get it, and whether you know if you have it. This is not the complete study but a part. I will be happy to list the other portions if you would like to learn more. Your one liner:

"Sanctification is a work not of the flesh but of the Holy Spirit in a person, "is not as inclusive as it needs to be because there are other ways of being sanctified according to the Holy Bible. New convenant scripture does place a major emphasis on the Holy Spirit and in that your statement is correct. I want you to be able to understand this better, so I will write about sanctification for you. There are others here that debate/discuss/argue back and forth in the homosexual forum that use "sanctification" in some of their posts. I pray that they benefit from what I write as well.

Sanctification is the process of God's grace by which the believer is separated from sin and becomes dedicated to God's righteousness.

It is accomplished by the Word of God (John 17:7): Now they know that everything you have given me comes from you, and the Holy Spirit (Rom 8:3-4): For what the law was powerless to do in that it was weakened by the sinful nature, God did by sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful man to be a sin offering. And so he condemned sin in sinful man, in order that the righteous requirements of the law might be fully met in us, who do not live according to the sinful nature but according to the Spirit. sanctification results in holiness, or purification from the guilt and power of sin.

Sanctification as separation from the world and setting apart for God's service is a concept found throughout the Bible. Spoken of as "holy" or "set apart" in the Old Testament were the land of Canaan, the city of Jerusalem, the tabernacle, the Temple, the Sabbath, the feasts, the prophets, the priests, and the garments of the priests.

God is sanctified by the witness of believers (1 Peter 3:15): But in your hearts set apart Christ as Lord. Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect, and by His judgments upon sin (Ezek 38:16): You will advance against my people Israel like a cloud that covers the land. In days to come, O Gog, I will bring you against my land, so that the nations may know me when I show myself holy through you before their eyes.

Jesus also was "sanctified and sent into the world" (John 10:36): what about the one whom the Father set apart as his very own and sent into the world? Why then do you accuse me of blasphemy because I said, 'I am God's Son'?

Also included in this subject is Sanctification in the Atonement. As the process by which God purifies the believer, sanctification is based on the sacrificial death of Christ. In his letters to the churches, the apostle Paul noted that God has "chosen" and "reconciled" us to Himself in Christ for the purpose of sanctification.

(Eph 1:4) states For he chose us in him before the creation of the world to be holy and blameless in his sight. (Eph 5:25-27): Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her 26 to make her holy, cleansing her by the washing with water through the word, and to present her to himself as a radiant church, without stain or wrinkle or any other blemish, but holy and blameless, and (Titus 2:14): who gave himself for us to redeem us from all wickedness and to purify for himself a people that are his very own, eager to do what is good.

Old Testament sacrifices did not take away sin, but they were able to sanctify "for the purifying of the flesh" (Heb 9:13): The blood of goats and bulls and the ashes of a heifer sprinkled on those who are ceremonially unclean sanctify them so that they are outwardly clean.

***The blood of the new covenant (Heb 10:29): "How much more severely do you think a man deserves to be punished who has trampled the Son of God under foot, who has treated as an unholy thing the blood of the covenant that sanctified him, and who has insulted the Spirit of grace", however, goes far beyond this ritual purification of the body...part 1.

 

[Moriah_Conquering_Wind]

Hey Sacerdote that post bes wasted on this thread it thinks. You should reproduce it over in Theology or something where it can be focused on & discussed!

(not a criticism just a suggestion)

 

[savedandhappy1]

I havn't sold all my goods and given the proceeds to the poor because I'm not a Biblical literalist.

And if I "harp" on an issue, its only for want of a satisfactory answer.

I'm still waiting for you to present any actual evidence that evolution is false, or that there is a "gay agenda", amongst other things.

If you were a Biblical literalist you wouldn't sell all your goods and give to the poor either, because that wasn't/isn't what it says.

The man was told to sell everything because his goods were to important to him. They were his idol.

 

[Chaplain David]

Hey Sacerdote that post bes wasted on this thread it thinks. You should reproduce it over in Theology or something where it can be focused on & discussed!

(not a criticism just a suggestion)

Well, participants keep throwing around spiritual terms like sanctification, filled with the spirit, etc.) and my sense is that some illumination might help them better understand the one liners and single sentences of scripture that seem to explain all, are usually in a context and do not contain all the facts. Nor do one liners in many cases explain what scripture means. With regards to scripture, it is much better if one understands it or at least does some research on the passages one uses as quotes for or against something in the discusion/debate. Anyway, that's my take.

Thanks Moriah.

 

[davedjy]

Rubbish, Same-sex unions are condemned in the Bible, see Gen 19, Lev 18:22, 1 Cor 6, Romans 1 etc.

None of those passages talk about monogamous, same sex unions!

 

[Moriah_Conquering_Wind]

Well, participants keep throwing around spiritual terms like sanctification, filled with the spirit, etc.) and my sense is that some illumination might help them better understand the one liners and single sentences of scripture that seem to explain all, are usually in a context and do not contain all the facts. Nor do one liners in many cases explain what scripture means. With regards to scripture, it is much better if one understands it or at least does some research on the passages one uses as quotes for or against something in the discusion/debate. Anyway, that's my take.

Thanks Moriah.

Oh no, it bes not saying you should not have put it here. It bes saying it would be a good meaty discussion by itself and should have its own thread to do that as well. Sorry if it bes not clear. hmmm "wasted" = bad wording selectsies. "wasted" as in cannot discuss in depth wihtout going way off topic. not wasted as in useless.

It thinks your input bes good!

 

[Chaplain David]

Oh no, it bes not saying you should not have put it here. It bes saying it would be a good meaty discussion by itself and should have its own thread to do that as well. Sorry if it bes not clear. hmmm "wasted" = bad wording selectsies. "wasted" as in cannot discuss in depth wihtout going way off topic. not wasted as in useless.

It thinks your input bes good!

I know. It's ok. i learn a lot from you too. Messages aren't the best medium for communication. God bless you.

 

[MercyBurst]

When you puts down ppls, it sucks.

Could you please enlighten me about a ppls? It does not mean pretty please does it?

 

[MercyBurst]

Well written, diplomatic reply, thank you. I will admit to having backslid. How about you?

Yes I have slidden in my faith at times. I have not slidden back into sin though. The longer I stay away from sin the easier it is to say no..

While our growth in Christ continues and we continue to mature as new creatures (new creations), I do not see us becoming perfect and without sin in behavior or thought in this life. Yes we are saved, yes we are born again, but yes, we will, despite our best efforts, struggle with sin until we are called home. Naturally we will improve but that, like everything else that is good, is by and from the grace of God.

Since your background is Baptist, I can agree with all of it. Jesus can not be perfectly Lord of us until we go to be with Him. Until then we have our imperfections that we surrender to Him.

Anybody that holds onto anything can not pass through the straight gate. He who gives up his life finds it. He that holds to sin can not pass. Few are they that can pass through the straight gate, and there is no other gate.

 

[tulc]

Could you please enlighten me about a ppls

"ppls" is another way of saying peoples.
tulc(think of it as reducing a word to it's component sounds in letters)

 

[Chaplain David]

Yes I have slidden in my fauth at times. I have not slidden back into sin though. It gets easier and easier to say no to sin through the sanctification process.



Since your background is Baptist, I can agree with all of it. Jesus can not be perfectly Lord of us until we go to be with Him. Until then we have our imperfections that we surrender to Him.

Anybody that holds onto anything can not pass through the straight gate. He who gives up his life finds it. He that holds to sin can not pass. Few are they that can pass through the straight gate, and there is no other gate.

It is absolutely amazing what the Lord does in our lives. This one thing happened the other day then resolved impossibly quick. It took me about two seconds to say, God, you are something else, thankyou.

 

[Moriah_Conquering_Wind]

Could you please enlighten me about a ppls? It does not mean pretty please does it?

sorry, just shorthand for "peoples" (ppls)

 

[Floatingaxe]

Well, participants keep throwing around spiritual terms like sanctification, filled with the spirit, etc.) and my sense is that some illumination might help them better understand the one liners and single sentences of scripture that seem to explain all, are usually in a context and do not contain all the facts. Nor do one liners in many cases explain what scripture means. With regards to scripture, it is much better if one understands it or at least does some research on the passages one uses as quotes for or against something in the discusion/debate. Anyway, that's my take.

Thanks Moriah.

Who do you think you're illuminating? I know what sanctification is...it appears many here don't.

 

[Floatingaxe]

None of those passages talk about monogamous, same sex unions!

They don't talk about being married to your dog, either. You know it's wrong!

 

[tulc]

Who do you think you're illuminating? I know what sanctification is...it appears many here don't.

...wouldn't those many be who he was illuminating it for?
tulc(just a thought)

 

[Chaplain David]

Who do you think you're illuminating? I know what sanctification is...it appears many here don't.

It does not appear from your messages that you grasp the full depth and breadth of sanctification and I will offer more about sanctification later. Besides, we all learn something from scripture, myself included. Of course the message is for you and everyone who cares to listen. For this reason:

(2 Tim 3:17) All scripture is inspired by God and is useful for teaching, for refutation, for correction, and for training in righteousness,so that one who belongs to God may be competent, equipped for every good work.

 

[MercyBurst]

Quote:
Originally Posted by davedjy
None of those passages talk about monogamous, same sex unions!


It just looks hypocritical when somebody says the Bible translations aren't credible on the one hand, and then they use the Bible to justify their position on the other.

That's why I can't take you seriously.

Besides, the argument from silence is a logical fallacy anyway. It's an argument for ignorance, where if I could make everyone else ignorant, then I can make any claim I want to make.

To be perfectly honest, I see a lot of this coming from you when you muff up the Bible translations for everyone else, and then make an illogical claim.

 

[Floatingaxe]

It does not appear from your messages that you grasp the full depth and breadth of sanctification and I will offer more about sanctification later. Besides, we all learn something from scripture, myself included. Of course the message is for you and everyone who cares to listen. For this reason:

(2 Tim 3:17) All scripture is inspired by God and is useful for teaching, for refutation, for correction, and for training in righteousness,so that one who belongs to God may be competent, equipped for every good work.

Well, you have the wrong idea about me.

 

[Chaplain David]

Well, you have the wrong idea about me.

We can all learn. It is a lifelong process.