Is a creationist a creationist because they feel it makes sense?

[automan]

I am an atheist not because I want to be but because my brain tells me atheism makes sense,
if I tried to think any other way I would be going against everything my brain tells me is true,
it's a bit like knowing a thing is black but trying to tell yourself it's white, it wont work,
and I can only think it's the same for a creationist, they think the way they do because it
makes sense for them, the bible must be taken literally and that's that.

We think the way we do because of the way we were brought up, all of us have been influenced
by our upbringing, the reason we speak the language we do, our manners, our respect or lack of for
other people and a host of other things make us think and behave the way we do because of how
we were raised and trained, we are what we were made to be.

And that influence is still going on now, we are learning about and changing our minds about a lot
of things every day, be they people, politics or a hundred other things we don't even think about,
anyone who keeps a diary will tell you, they think differently today than they did five years ago, in
fact some of the things they thought then might even seem childish today.

I am sure you will tell me if you think I am wrong but I maintain that if the argument makes sense,
you will change your mind, if you are shown a better way of doing something you will do it that way,
if something you have thought to be true all of your life is shown to be false it is crazy to think you
would not change your mind, you would be mad to think otherwise.

If there was even a shred of evidence that pointed to the existence of a God I would believe instantly,
my brain would tell me to believe and I would be unable to think any other way, because it would
make sense, but until that happens I would be a fool to think a God exists, because it makes
no sense, no sense at all.

 

[Mavros]

Is a creationist a creationist because they feel it makes sense?

 

[Gottservant]

I am an atheist not because I want to be but because my brain tells me atheism makes sense,
if I tried to think any other way I would be going against everything my brain tells me is true,

[...]

If there was even a shred of evidence that pointed to the existence of a God I would believe instantly,
my brain would tell me to believe and I would be unable to think any other way,

Do you think that it is an accident that your brain works so well? I do not think it is.

 

[extremespacebadger]

Do you think that it is an accident that your brain works so well? I do not think it is.

Why?

I don't think it was an accident either - it is the way it is via the process of evolution.

 

[moogoob]

I don't think the intelligent human brain was an accident either Gottservant- however the argument doesn't go “either it's a Mistake or it's Creationism”.

 

[Merlin]

Hmmm...
Evolution: lightning struck a pond, or some such, and eventually things started walking about
Creation: some entity (we call Him God) applied laws of physics and designed biological organisms.

Creationism seems more reasonable to me.

 

[Nitron]

Hmmm...
Evolution: lightning struck a pond, or some such, and eventually things started walking about
Creation: some entity (we call Him God) applied laws of physics and designed biological organisms.

Creationism seems more reasonable to me.

Way to go Ms. Strawman!

 

[lemmings]

Hmmm...
Evolution: lightning struck a pond, or some such, and eventually things started walking about
Creation: some entity (we call Him God) applied laws of physics and designed biological organisms.

Creationism seems more reasonable to me.

Evolution does not say anything about abiogenesis, just as gravity does not say anything about how matter came into being. Abiogenesis says that over time varies chemical reactions present on the early earth created a structure capable of self replication and overtime this structure got more and more complex and mutations began to form in its design.

Creationism assumes that a being, God, roughly of infinite complexity has always existed and that one day he decided to create a Universe.



Which is easier to create by random chance? God, or a phospholipid bilayer with a few primitive proteins inside?

 

[Wiccan_Child]

Hmmm...
Evolution: lightning struck a pond, or some such, and eventually things started walking about
Creation: some entity (we call Him God) applied laws of physics and designed biological organisms.

Creationism seems more reasonable to me.

Either you are ignorant as to what scientists mean by Evolution, or you are deliberately lying.
Either way, stop making a fool out of yourself.

 

[Oncedeceived]

I am an atheist not because I want to be but because my brain tells me atheism makes sense,

Being an atheist doesn't make sense at all. There is a possibility that God exists no matter how small you feel that is, you can't know that there is no God. So reasonably you could be an agnostic, which then is a somewhat more reasonable stance.

if I tried to think any other way I would be going against everything my brain tells me is true,

In a purely evolutionary world view you can't rely on what your brain tells you is true, what does truth mean to a purely naturalistic viewpoint?

Why would you believe that everything your brain tells you is true and believe that others do not have the same ability?

it's a bit like knowing a thing is black but trying to tell yourself it's white, it wont work,
and I can only think it's the same for a creationist, they think the way they do because it
makes sense for them, the bible must be taken literally and that's that.

The Bible makes sense when you realize that God is real. It is very easy to dismiss it as mythical and fictional when you have no reason to believe that God exists. When you find that God is real then the Bible takes on a whole new emphasis.

We think the way we do because of the way we were brought up, all of us have been influenced
by our upbringing, the reason we speak the language we do, our manners, our respect or lack of for
other people and a host of other things make us think and behave the way we do because of how
we were raised and trained, we are what we were made to be.

This does not hold true very often, more often than not people who were raised Christian turn away (sometimes they come back and sometimes they do not) and those raised in Christian families become agnostics. Manners and language yes, but for things that we believe, we must have reason to believe and that we were taught to believe is not reason enough for most.

I personally was not brought up a Christian and religion was not part of my upbringing.

And that influence is still going on now, we are learning about and changing our minds about a lot
of things every day, be they people, politics or a hundred other things we don't even think about,
anyone who keeps a diary will tell you, they think differently today than they did five years ago, in
fact some of the things they thought then might even seem childish today.

Very true. Belief is a stepping stone, it either brings culmination in either knowing the belief is true or whether or not it is false. Belief is an area where doubt still exists.

I am sure you will tell me if you think I am wrong but I maintain that if the argument makes sense,
you will change your mind, if you are shown a better way of doing something you will do it that way,
if something you have thought to be true all of your life is shown to be false it is crazy to think you
would not change your mind, you would be mad to think otherwise.

It depends on what information is available to make you feel the argument makes sense. For me it makes sense that God created the universe because I know that God exists. For you it makes sense that evolution alone must have because you the arguments you have seen are not sufficient to change your mind and vice versa.

If there was even a shred of evidence that pointed to the existence of a God I would believe instantly,

There is evidence but you choose to dismiss it. It is a choice and you have made that choice. You come up with other reasons for the evidence that is available.

my brain would tell me to believe and I would be unable to think any other way, because it would
make sense, but until that happens I would be a fool to think a God exists, because it makes
no sense, no sense at all.

So on the other hand when someone says that they are unable to think any other way because it doesn't make sense you claim they are deluding themselves. What if you are deluding yourself?

 

[Oncedeceived]

Hmmm...
Evolution: lightning struck a pond, or some such, and eventually things started walking about
Creation: some entity (we call Him God) applied laws of physics and designed biological organisms.

Creationism seems more reasonable to me.

There you go, sounds more reasonable to me.

 

[Merlin]

Either you are ignorant as to what scientists mean by Evolution, or you are deliberately lying.
Either way, stop making a fool out of yourself.

No, just simplifying.
Either things happened on their own, or something caused it all.
I find it easier to believe something caused it all.

 

[Merlin]

Creationism assumes that a being, God, roughly of infinite complexity has always existed and that one day he decided to create a Universe.

Which is easier to create by random chance? God, or a phospholipid bilayer with a few primitive proteins inside?

I see it as easier to think God created.

 

[Oncedeceived]

Either you are ignorant as to what scientists mean by Evolution, or you are deliberately lying.
Either way, stop making a fool out of yourself.

Deliberately lying about what?

 

[Wiccan_Child]

No, just simplifying.

There is simplification, and then there is a catagorically false statement. Evolution is a change in the frequency of alleles of a given population. Show me where, in that definition, you got the notion of lightning, ponds, n-pedal locomotion, etc.

Either things happened on their own, or something caused it all.
I find it easier to believe something caused it all.

Why? Occams Razor tells us that the simpler explanation is to be preferred (i.e., is more likely to be true). So what's simpler: "a few acids in a pool of chemicals", or "a few acids in a pool of chemicals and a deity"?

 

[Wiccan_Child]

Deliberately lying about what?

About what Evolution is.

 

[EastChief]

Why? Occams Razor tells us that the simpler explanation is to be preferred (i.e., is more likely to be true). So what's simpler: "a few acids in a pool of chemicals", or "a few acids in a pool of chemicals and a deity"?

I think creationism also includes the creation of the entire universe, so where did those acids and chemicals come from in the first place? Either you have to believe that matter always existed, or there was nothing and some instability caused an explosion which created all matter. Either way, it is easier for me to believe (and simpler) that God created the universe to begin with.

 

[Oncedeceived]

About what Evolution is.

Abiogenesis is not evolution, you know that.

 

[Oncedeceived]

I think creationism also includes the creation of the entire universe, so where did those acids and chemicals come from in the first place? Either you have to believe that matter always existed, or there was nothing and some instability caused an explosion which created all matter. Either way, it is easier for me to believe (and simpler) that God created the universe to begin with.

Couldn't have said it better myself.

 

[Wiccan_Child]

Abiogenesis is not evolution, you know that.

Indeed I do. That is why I objected to her equating the abiogenesis event with Evolution. With all due respect, do you have a point?