Prayers to Mary in concerning Matthew

[leothelioness]

Do you not realize that asking someone, anyone to pray for you is asking them to intercede? So I take you have never asked anyone to pray for you? I guess James told us to pray for one another for no reason..

I know what intercession is. I don't ask anyone to pray for me either. Why ask someone to pray for me when I can do it myself? I prefer to pray for myself. I feel it important enough that I go directly to God. Asking people to pray for you instead of doing it for yourself is laziness in my book. There is no excuse for it.

Even if I did ask someone to pray for me it certainly wouldn't be a spirit who cannot hear nor communicate with me. With the Lord and His Son as exceptions, of course.

This is your reply? Care to explain your view?

I have explained my view. I don't think intercession has anything to do with it. Maybe it was Mary's simple concern for the wedding party to have wine. Maybe it was Mary's personal attempt to show the people that Chirst was the Messiah through His turning water into wine.

 

[repentant]

I know what intercession is. I don't ask anyone to pray for me either. Why ask someone to pray for me when I can do it myself? I prefer to pray for myself. I feel it important enough that I go directly to God. Asking people to pray for you instead of doing it for yourself is laziness in my book. There is no excuse for it.
Even if I did ask someone to pray for me it certainly wouldn't be a spirit who cannot hear nor communicate with me. With the Lord and His Son as exceptions, of course.

That is your problem that you don't ask anyone to pray for you. It doesn't make it wrong.

Why ask someone to pray for you when you can do it yourself? Well excuse me. No one said that we don't pray for ourselves, or for other's for that matter. And just because we ask someone to pray for us, let's say for something specific, it doesn't mean we don't pray for ourself. But I guess you feel prideful enough to not need anyone to pray for you. But I see you are young, and are influenced by American culture. I remember when I was a kid, I didn't need anybody. How stupid I was..

Asking people to pray for you is laziness? Well never heard that one before. I guess James suggested we all be lazy when he said for us to pray for one another. I guess Paul was lazy when he asked the Churches he wrote his Epistles to, to pray for him. Poor lazy Paul. Asking people to pray for him, what laziness!!!

I feel it important enough that I go directly to God

I must reply to this by itself. Before you said that Jesus was the intercessor to God. So how is it you pray to God, and bypass Jesus?

I have explained my view. I don't think intercession has anything to do with it. Maybe it was Mary's simple concern for the wedding party to have wine. Maybe it was Mary's personal attempt to show the people that Chirst was the Messiah through His turning water into wine.

And when they wanted wine, the mother of Jesus saith unto him, They have no wine.

She obviously somehow knew they ran out of wine. Now if it was her concern for the wedding party, does that take away her intercession? This view of yours actually shows how special the Mother of the Lord is. They didn't even have to ask her to intercede, she did it herself!!

Also if it was her personal attempt to show the people Jesus was the Messiah, does that also take away her intercession? She still helped them when they needed it, by asking Jesus to perform His first miracle. Does it really matter why she did it? She still interceded, you can't take that away, regardless what her purpose was.

It's like an atheist trying to disprove God by citing evolution. Does it mean, even if we evolved from monkey's, that God didn't create the monkey's we evolved from?

 

[mysterychristian]

Why would Jesus say something, even if it was a parable, that couldn't be true? Why would He use references in a parable that could not happen? Also how do you know that this was really a parable? Maybe it really did happen, or was going to happen in the future. We don't know. But the fact remains that even in a parable, Jesus would not use references that were not true. Therefore when people die, and before the general judgement and the rerssurection of the dead, people are in hades, and people are in heaven. Jesus wouldn't say something untrue, even in a parable..

You need to slow down when you read, what I write and think about what I'm saying, he said what he said because of the pharisees beliefs to catch them in their own error read the immediate context also.

I explained what a parable is also.... and why he used it, if you don't believe me that's fine with me no big deal at all, just explaining and elucidating the scriptures, becasue you asked, I know what I explained you did not know, because most laymen or those who do not study thouroughly THE WORD, not secular teachings, or commentaries on the word, but THE WORD it self would not know what I shared. Look at all the parables Jesus Christ taught as see how he used them in all the different situations and against whom he used them also, it would be a good study and then slow down as you read and consider what is being said thoroughly.

You are Loved

 

[repentant]

You need to slow down when you read, what I write and think about what I'm saying, he said what he said because of the pharisees beliefs to catch them in their own error read the immediate context also.

I explained what a parable is also.... and why he used it, if you don't believe me that's fine with me no big deal at all, just explaining and elucidating the scriptures, becasue you asked, I know what I explained you did not know, because most laymen or those who do not study thouroughly THE WORD, not secular teachings, or commentaries on the word, but THE WORD it self would not know what I shared. Look at all the parables Jesus Christ taught as see how he used them in all the different situations and against whom he used them also, it would be a good study and then slow down as you read and consider what is being said thoroughly.

You are Loved

You said it was a parable, therefore wasn't a true story. I said that Jesus wouldn't say something that couldn't happen, even in a parable. I read what you said, and I replied accordingly. And I know no more than you think. If you think Jesus would use falseness in a parable, then you are the one who does not know anything..maybe you should study the Word more, or better yet, study what those learned have to say, instead of your own personal false interpretations..

 

[warriorforJesus]

You said it was a parable, therefore wasn't a true story. I said that Jesus wouldn't say something that couldn't happen, even in a parable. I read what you said, and I replied accordingly. And I know no more than you think. If you think Jesus would use falseness in a parable, then you are the one who does not know anything..maybe you should study the Word more, or better yet, study what those learned have to say, instead of your own personal false interpretations..

Once again, here is an Orthodox telling someone that they interpret the scriptures falsely.Seems that someone who needs someone else to tell them what the scriptures mean just does not have a close relationship with God. They depend on someone else for their truth and salvation. The Holy spirit can give anyone He choses divine inspiration and interpretation. Thank God I do not depend on someone else. I will even tell the Pastor if he is wrong or not right on in his interpretation. The scriptures say we should do this.

 

[leothelioness]

You asked me if I have ever asked anyone to pray for me and I gave you my answer. Why are you jumping down my throat?

That is your problem that you don't ask anyone to pray for you.

Whoever said it was a problem? It's not a problem to me.

It doesn't make it wrong.

I never said it was.

But I guess you feel prideful enough to not need anyone to pray for you.

You really stepped over the line with that one. Why are you persecuting me and calling me 'prideful' because I pray for myself? How is that prideful?

In the meantime, I would appreciate it if you would cease to pass judgement (although you seem to have a very hard time doing so).

Right now you're the one who's sounding prideful. You're putting me down in an attempt to make yourself feel superior. What Christian constantly puts down other Christians?

But I see you are young, and are influenced by American culture.

What does American culture have to do with it?

I remember when I was a kid, I didn't need anybody. How stupid I was..

Now you're insinuating that I'm stupid.

Asking people to pray for you is laziness? Well never heard that one before. I guess James suggested we all be lazy when he said for us to pray for one another. I guess Paul was lazy when he asked the Churches he wrote his Epistles to, to pray for him. Poor lazy Paul. Asking people to pray for him, what laziness!!!

I said it was laziness to me. It would be laziness on my part. Not on the part of others.

I must reply to this by itself. Before you said that Jesus was the intercessor to God. So how is it you pray to God, and bypass Jesus?

Of course the implication there is that I go to God through Jesus. I can't believe I have to spell that out.

And when they wanted wine, the mother of Jesus saith unto him, They have no wine.

She obviously somehow knew they ran out of wine.

Yeah, it said they wanted wine. I think if someone wanted something badly enough they would make it known. Or did Mary just have mental telepathy?

Now if it was her concern for the wedding party, does that take away her intercession? This view of yours actually shows how special the Mother of the Lord is. They didn't even have to ask her to intercede, she did it herself!!

Also if it was her personal attempt to show the people Jesus was the Messiah, does that also take away her intercession? She still helped them when they needed it, by asking Jesus to perform His first miracle. Does it really matter why she did it? She still interceded, you can't take that away, regardless what her purpose was.

It's like an atheist trying to disprove God by citing evolution. Does it mean, even if we evolved from monkey's, that God didn't create the monkey's we evolved from?

 

[repentant]

Once again, here is an Orthodox telling someone that they interpret the scriptures falsely.Seems that someone who needs someone else to tell them what the scriptures mean just does not have a close relationship with God. They depend on someone else for their truth and salvation. The Holy spirit can give anyone He choses divine inspiration and interpretation. Thank God I do not depend on someone else. I will even tell the Pastor if he is wrong or not right on in his interpretation. The scriptures say we should do this.

So do you agree with the other poster that Jesus would use something that wasn't possibly true, even in a parable?

And if the Holy Spirit gives everyone Divine Inspiration, why is there so many differences? Why do you believe something, that Joe, doesn't, and Tom thinks something completely different? Why these divisions? Who is being Divinly Inspired by the Holy Spirit? And also why has for 2000 years, the Orthodox Church has agreed on Biblical interpretations?

 

[repentant]

You asked me if I have ever asked anyone to pray for me and I gave you my answer. Why are you jumping down my throat?


Whoever said it was a problem? It's not a problem to me.


I never said it was.


You really stepped over the line with that one. Why are you persecuting me and calling me 'prideful' because I pray for myself? How is that prideful?

Persecuting? That's a good one. Honey, you have no idea what persecution is.

In the meantime, I would appreciate it if you would cease to pass judgement (although you seem to have a very hard time doing so).

Right now you're the one who's sounding prideful. You're putting me down in an attempt to make yourself feel superior. What Christian constantly puts down other Christians?

Yes I am superior admitting that we all need, including me neeed help from those more Holier than us. Yes I am prideful..

What does American culture have to do with it?

Alot. Look at a European family, and look at an American family. Big difference.

Now you're insinuating that I'm stupid.

No I said I was stupid..

I said it was laziness to me. It would be laziness on my part. Not on the part of others.

That's not what you said. You said that asking people to pray for you was laziness. SO now that I made the comment that Paul must have been lazy, when he asked people to pray for him, that he was lazy...you change your story..

Of course the implication there is that I go to God through Jesus. I can't believe I have to spell that out.

You said you can pray directly to God. Do I need to define directly for you?

Yeah, it said they wanted wine. I think if someone wanted something badly enough they would make it known. Or did Mary just have mental telepathy?

All I said was somehow she knew. Either someone mentioned something, she overheard it, or yes she had mental telepathy. Whatever the case was, she knew.

No matter what you say, your theory's on why she she told Jesus to do the miracle, still doesn't take away the fact how she interceded. So yes, let's put this to sleep, since you obviously can't say anything here.

 

[GratiaCorpusChristi]

Persecuting? That's a good one. Honey, you have no idea what persecution is.

I know, right?

Persecution does not consist in perceived insults or disagreements or impolite arguing.

Trust the Orthodox guy. They've suffered more persecution than most any other church on earth.

 

[mysterychristian]

I know, right?

Persecution does not consist in perceived insults or disagreements or impolite arguing.

Trust the Orthodox guy. They've suffered more persecution than most any other church on earth.

Persecution does,nt gaurantee truth, many poeple on the face of the earth are persecuted and have no truth at all, that's the problem, those with the truth know how to rise above and conquer the persecutions, those who do not have the truth and know not how to apply it sit around and complain about it, Jesus Christ taught how to be a conqueror and overcome difficult situations and so did Paul, it's definatly not belonging to any particular denomination that will do that, it's having truth in your heart to the point that you act and believe on it releases spiritual power into the world therefore backing off the advesary and all his evilness, granted it's not the less difficult road to travel, but it is the most rewarding and exhilarating, and fullfilling.

 

[IamAdopted]

The fact that she asked her Son to do something for the wedding pary does not signify she is the mediator beteween us and Jesus.. She simple asked.. He simply did.. What does this have to do with her being able to intercess for us in heaven? The bible tells us that Jesus intercesses for us..

 

[IamAdopted]

mediator
nouna negotiator who acts as a link between parties

 

[Benedicta00]

The fact that she asked her Son to do something for the wedding pary does not signify she is the mediator beteween us and Jesus.. She simple asked.. He simply did.. What does this have to do with her being able to intercess for us in heaven? The bible tells us that Jesus intercesses for us..

mediator and intercessor are not one in the same thing.

She does what your friends do when they pray to God for you. They are interceding- not mediating.

 

[leothelioness]

Persecuting? That's a good one. Honey, you have no idea what persecution is.

And you have no idea what "love one another as I have loved you" is apparently.

Now answer my question. Why are you saying I'm prideful for praying for myself and jumping on me because I answered your question?

Yes I am superior admitting that we all need, including me neeed help from those more Holier than us. Yes I am prideful..

At least you admit that. You've made a good first step towards changing your attitude into a Christian one.

Alot. Look at a European family, and look at an American family. Big difference.

That has NOTHING to do with the topic at hand.

What makes a European family better that an American family anyway? If you hate Americans so much why do you have an American flag?

No I said I was stupid..

That's probably the first truthful thing you've said so far.

That's not what you said. You said that asking people to pray for you was laziness. SO now that I made the comment that Paul must have been lazy, when he asked people to pray for him, that he was lazy...you change your story..

No. That is what I said. I said it was laziness in my book. Not anyone else's. And no I did not change my story. You perceive it to be that way.

You said you can pray directly to God. Do I need to define directly for you?

Stop telling me what I mean and what I believe. Anyone with a brain in their head would know that there is the implication there that we go to God through Jesus. And yes I do go directly to God. Jesus is God isn't He?

All I said was somehow she knew. Either someone mentioned something, she overheard it, or yes she had mental telepathy. Whatever the case was, she knew.

Now that was a good one.

No matter what you say, your theory's on why she she told Jesus to do the miracle, still doesn't take away the fact how she interceded. So yes, let's put this to sleep, since you obviously can't say anything here.

I have said something about it it's just not something you wanted to hear. I'll leave the ear tickling to someone else.

 

[repentant]

Persecution does,nt gaurantee truth, many poeple on the face of the earth are persecuted and have no truth at all, that's the problem, those with the truth know how to rise above and conquer the persecutions, those who do not have the truth and know not how to apply it sit around and complain about it, Jesus Christ taught how to be a conqueror and overcome difficult situations and so did Paul, it's definatly not belonging to any particular denomination that will do that, it's having truth in your heart to the point that you act and believe on it releases spiritual power into the world therefore backing off the advesary and all his evilness, granted it's not the less difficult road to travel, but it is the most rewarding and exhilarating, and fullfilling.

That wasn't even what he was saying..

But I think the Greeks, Serbians, Russians, Armenians, etc, did a pretty good job rising above persecutions and difficult situations..

 

[repentant]

The fact that she asked her Son to do something for the wedding pary does not signify she is the mediator beteween us and Jesus.. She simple asked.. He simply did.. What does this have to do with her being able to intercess for us in heaven? The bible tells us that Jesus intercesses for us..

No she didn't mediate a confrontation between Jesus and the wedding party, she interceded to her Son so that He may give the wedding party wine, in which they needed...

mediator
nouna negotiator who acts as a link between parties

 

[repentant]

And you have no idea what "love one another as I have loved you" is apparently.

If I didn't love you, I wouldn't be argueing with you so that you may see the Truth in your errors.

Now answer my question. Why are you saying I'm prideful for praying for myself and jumping on me because I answered your question?

It's the way you said it. That you didn't need anybody, and asking someone to pray for you is laziness.

At least you admit that. You've made a good first step towards changing your attitude into a Christian one.

Actually that was sarcasm. Saying I was prideful because I need as many prayer's as I can get.

That has NOTHING to do with the topic at hand.

What makes a European family better that an American family anyway? If you hate Americans so much why do you have an American flag?

Family values. Closenes of families. I don't hate Americans, did my words say that?

That's probably the first truthful thing you've said so far.

So you're calling me stupid?

No. That is what I said. I said it was laziness in my book. Not anyone else's. And no I did not change my story. You perceive it to be that way.

This is what you said.

Asking people to pray for you instead of doing it for yourself is laziness in my book

This implies that asking someone to pray for you is laziness, in your OPINION. This does not mean it only applies to you, but to everyone. Just because you said my book doesn't mean that you were talking about yourself..

Stop telling me what I mean and what I believe. Anyone with a brain in their head would know that there is the implication there that we go to God through Jesus. And yes I do go directly to God. Jesus is God isn't He?

...I am telling you what you said..

Now that was a good one.

Again, sarcasm..

I have said something about it it's just not something you wanted to hear. I'll leave the ear tickling to someone else.

And what you said doesn't take away the fact she interceded for the wedding party. Regardless of her intentions, she still interceded..

 

[leothelioness]

If I didn't love you, I wouldn't be argueing with you so that you may see the Truth in your errors.

There's truth in my errors? Did you really mean to say that?

It's the way you said it. That you didn't need anybody, and asking someone to pray for you is laziness.

I guess my words didn't convey my meaning properly. Forgive me.

Actually that was sarcasm. Saying I was prideful because I need as many prayer's as I can get.

My sarcasm detector is boinked today.

Family values. Closenes of families.

My family is American and we are EXTREMELY close. We also have wonderful family values. I know of may more American families like that. It's the non-Christian American families that are disfunctional.

I don't hate Americans, did my words say that?

Well, it's sort of what I gathered. A sort of disgust almost.

So you're calling me stupid?

It was said in jest. No harm intended.

This implies that asking someone to pray for you is laziness, in your OPINION. This does not mean it only applies to you, but to everyone. Just because you said my book doesn't mean that you were talking about yourself..

Again, my words must not have conveyed my meaning properly.

And what you said doesn't take away the fact she interceded for the wedding party. Regardless of her intentions, she still interceded..

Just because she did this for the wedding party doesn't mean she does the same for us in heaven. But that's just my belief and I'm entitled to that. Just as you are to yours. Let's just agree to disagree, okay?

 

[repentant]

There's truth in my errors? Did you really mean to say that?

Hmm...nope said that wrong.

I guess my words didn't convey my meaning properly. Forgive me.

Forgiven

My family is American and we are EXTREMELY close. We also have wonderful family values. I know of may more American families like that. It's the non-Christian American families that are disfunctional.

That's great to hear. Most I have seen are not.

Well, it's sort of what I gathered. A sort of disgust almost.

Nope I don't.

It was said in jest. No harm intended.

Ok.

Again, my words must not have conveyed my meaning properly.

No they really didn't. Also you said yourself as opposed to myself, which would say you were talking about yourself..

Just because she did this for the wedding party doesn't mean she does the same for us in heaven. But that's just my belief and I'm entitled to that. Just as you are to yours. Let's just agree to disagree, okay?

But can you say that she did intercede in this situation?

 

[leothelioness]

But can you say that she did intercede in this situation?

Well, in all fairness I reckon I can.

However, I don't think that that alludes to her also interceding for us in heaven.