What is your end times view on the rapture?

[Goatee]

I do believe what John Said. Which is why I posted Scriptures to prove Babylon and the Harlot are TWO SEPARATE ENTITIES. Now as to what John is saying in Revelation 17:18. These past BEAST GOVERNMENTS have always been COMBINED hence the Harlot rode the BEAST. Hence that great city is what ? What did the Angel tell John or show John n the Vision ? That the Harlot had BABYLON THE GREAT imprinted on her head. In other words she was ONE WITH the Babylonian type Governments that came against Israel. In other words every one of he BEASTS that came against Israel had FALSE/EVIL RELIGION at is core, none of them served the REAL/TRUE God !! They served DEVILS.

That GREAT CITY Represents all the Beasts, God called it the HEAD OF GOLD, so it was the purest form of Anti-God Government, pro Demonic worship. We know via the bible, which I quoted, Babylon will never be inhabited again, it is a METAPHOR. Babylon represents all the WICKED KINGDOMS, and the Harlot represents ALL THE DEVIL WORSHIP. Both go hand and hand until the end, when the Anti-Christ will DESTROY the Harlot, because there can be no Harlot ( Islam, Witchcraft, Buddhism. etc. etc. ) she has to be DESTROYED.....Thus Rev. 17:16, she is destroyed by the Kings. The same Kings Cry and Lament when BABYLON is Destroyed, because Babylon is the ONE WORLD GOV. SYSTEM, and the peoples that come against Israel. Get off of Babylon being a City, the Holy Bible say she will never be inhabited again. ITS METAPHORIC, like much of Revelation, you have to figure out the code.

Looks like you figured it out wrongly then!

 

[BABerean2]

What did Daniel write?

27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease...

I hope you understand the "he" as the Beast of Rev. 13.

There is no antecedent in Daniel 9 that could make the word "he" the antichrist, because there is no antichrist in the chapter.

The "he" could only be the Messiah or the Romans, because they are the only antecedents given.


Who Confirmed The Covenant?
James Lloyd
Who Confirmed The Covenant? | Christian Media Research

The covenant with the many in Daniel 9:27 is the same covenant with the many in Matthew 26:28.
The scriptural reference beside of Daniel 9:27 in my NKJV is Matthew 26:28.

Jeremiah had already been given the promise of the New Covenant to Israel and Judah in Jeremiah 31:31-34. Daniel was reading from the Book of Jeremiah when Gabriel appeared. Gabriel was sent to Daniel to reveal the timeline of the New Covenant Messiah.

Christ commanded that the Gospel was to be taken "first" to Daniel's people.

The 70th week began below with the public announcement by God of the Gospel of His Son.

Mat 3:16 When He had been baptized, Jesus came up immediately from the water; and behold, the heavens were opened to Him, and He saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove and alighting upon Him.
Mat 3:17 And suddenly a voice came from heaven, saying, "This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased."


Christ was cut off after a ministry of 1/2 week.
God ripped the temple veil in half showing that the animal sacrifices were no longer required.

Almost all of the first members of the New Covenant Church were Israelites, who were Daniel's people.

The Gospel continued to be taken to Daniel's people up until the time Stephen reviewed the whole history of Israel and was then stoned.

After that period of time the Gospel was taken to the Gentiles.

Based on Hebrews 8:13 the New Covenant has made the Old Covenant "obsolete". In Hebrews 13:20 the New Covenant is "everlasting". We find the New Covenant promised to Israel and Judah fulfilled in Hebrews 8:6-13 and specifically applied to the Church in Hebrews 12:18-24 and 2 Corinthians 3:6-8.

Therefore, God is not going back to the now obsolete Sinai covenant during a future time period.
The 70th week was fulfilled during the time that Christ commanded the Gospel to be taken "first" to Daniel's people during the first century.

Based on Romans chapter 11, Paul provided no path to salvation outside of being grafted into the Olive Tree, which is a symbol of the New Covenant Church made up of Israelites and Gentiles grafted together. There is no Plan B in the chapter.

The limbs broken off of the tree will wither and die without being grafted back into the tree, through faith in Christ.

.

 

[Revealing Times]

Looks like you figured it out wrongly then!

I doubt you have a clue what I think. I think the RCC is NOT THE HARLOT but the Harlot is all False Religion.

You have nothing that you can say against what I stated, that's for sure.

 

[Goatee]

I doubt you have a clue what I think. I think the RCC is NOT THE HARLOT but the Harlot is all False Religion.

You have nothing that you can say against what I stated, that's for sure.

True, i cant say much about how you interpret end times. I believe in the Preterist view of end times. It all fits together logically. If you look into that view properly you will see so much evidence for it all having already passed by 70AD. I still believe that Jesus is returning.

 

[iamlamad]

I do believe what John Said. Which is why I posted Scriptures to prove Babylon and the Harlot are TWO SEPARATE ENTITIES. Now as to what John is saying in Revelation 17:18. These past BEAST GOVERNMENTS have always been COMBINED hence the Harlot rode the BEAST. Hence that great city is what ? What did the Angel tell John or show John n the Vision ? That the Harlot had BABYLON THE GREAT imprinted on her head. In other words she was ONE WITH the Babylonian type Governments that came against Israel. In other words every one of he BEASTS that came against Israel had FALSE/EVIL RELIGION at is core, none of them served the REAL/TRUE God !! They served DEVILS.

That GREAT CITY Represents all the Beasts, God called it the HEAD OF GOLD, so it was the purest form of Anti-God Government, pro Demonic worship. We know via the bible, which I quoted, Babylon will never be inhabited again, it is a METAPHOR. Babylon represents all the WICKED KINGDOMS, and the Harlot represents ALL THE DEVIL WORSHIP. Both go hand and hand until the end, when the Anti-Christ will DESTROY the Harlot, because there can be no Harlot ( Islam, Witchcraft, Buddhism. etc. etc. ) she has to be DESTROYED.....Thus Rev. 17:16, she is destroyed by the Kings. The same Kings Cry and Lament when BABYLON is Destroyed, because Babylon is the ONE WORLD GOV. SYSTEM, and the peoples that come against Israel. Get off of Babylon being a City, the Holy Bible say she will never be inhabited again. ITS METAPHORIC, like much of Revelation, you have to figure out the code.

I choose to believe what John wrote:

3 So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns.

4 And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication:

5 And upon her forehead was a name written, Mystery, Babylon The Great, The Mother Of Harlots And Abominations Of The Earth.

6 And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration.

There you have it: John saw a woman riding the beast. The title of the woman is "Babylon The Great, The Mother Of Harlots And Abominations Of The Earth."

She is ONE ENTITY, not two. Note that she is "drunken" on the blood of the saints. John told us she was the "great City." In another verse he told us the great city was Jerusalem.

Why is this so difficult to believe? You can come up with human reasoning but you will be wrong. Mystery Babylon is the city of Jerusalem while the Beast and False Prophet reside there deceiving the world. I agree in this: "Mystery Babylon" is a metaphor referring to Jerusalem, because "mystery Babylon" will not exist anymore after the Beast is destoyed, while Jerusalem will continue.

I don't think we will ever agree on this.

 

[iamlamad]

Actually that's a picture of Daniel chapter 5, GO READ IT.....The Cups and the Kings of Babylon defiling Gods HOLY TEMPLE CUPS....Then God says MENE, MENE, TEKEL, your Kingdom has been taken from you this day.

Chapters 17 and 18 are talking about the destruction of the kingdom of the Beast, who used Jerusalem as his capitol. I can see we will never agree on this.

 

[iamlamad]

He is the Anti-Christ. What point was I making ? That Israel was SERVING JESUS by the time the Abomination of Desolation happens. Him putting a stop to the Sacrifices doesn't have to mean Animal Sacrifices, and notice, Daniel adds the word OBLATION, as in a TRIBUTE to someone. We offer up Jesus as our Sacrifice DAILY for our sins. My point was/is, Israel accepts Jesus as their Messiah before the Anti-Christ takes over Jerusalem, that is why they HEED Jesus' words and FLEE to the Wilderness and why God protects them in the Wilderness. Thus they never, never serve a FALSE MESSIAH !!


If they were sacrificing Animals, that would be an ABOMINATION. That's the POINT...... Jesus is accepted as the Messiah before the Anti-Christ defiles the TEMPLE, thus it goes from Jesus being worshiped in the TEMPLE to the Anti-Christ placing an IMAGE of Himself in the TEMPLE. Thus the TEMPLE is DEFILED. You can't defile that which is already defiled, id SACRIFICES were being offered when Jesus has already paid the price, that would be a defilement in itself.

Malachi 4:5-6 and all of Zechariah 12 and 13. I have only posted it here 100 times.

Did you not know the Jews have been working hard to get a red heifer without spot of blemish? They have been getting read with sheep and goats also.

Here is a headline:
“Jews” to Re-Institute Animal Sacrifices on Temple Mount
OF COURSE they are going to begin the daily sacrifices again. That is one reason they want to rebuild the temple.

WHY would it be an abomination? It is the 70th week of DANIEL, a time for JEWS and Daniel's people.
Did you not read Ezekiel and the new temple, where they will hold Animal sacrifices during the millennial reign? Will it be an abomination then? I guess not!

I can see one thing very clearly: you are I are never going to agree on much.

If you wish to think the Jews will be Christians at the midpoint of the week, go ahead: but it will not happen. They will know HIM when they SEE Him and see the nail holes in his hands.

 

[iamlamad]

Actually that's a picture of Daniel chapter 5, GO READ IT.....The Cups and the Kings of Babylon defiling Gods HOLY TEMPLE CUPS....Then God says MENE, MENE, TEKEL, your Kingdom has been taken from you this day.

Sorry, no sequitur: All through the Old Covenant, worshiping idols has been called "fornication. The cup filled with fornication is talking about deceiving the entire world into worshiping Satan and thinking they are worshiping God.

I will give you this much credit: you did find another cup!

 

[iamlamad]

Revealing Times wrote,
He is the Anti-Christ. What point was I making ? That Israel was SERVING JESUS by the time the Abomination of Desolation happens. Him putting a stop to the Sacrifices doesn't have to mean Animal Sacrifices, and notice, Daniel adds the word OBLATION, as in a TRIBUTE to someone. We offer up Jesus as our Sacrifice DAILY for our sins. My point was/is, Israel accepts Jesus as their Messiah before the Anti-Christ takes over Jerusalem, that is why they HEED Jesus' words and FLEE to the Wilderness and why God protects them in the Wilderness. Thus they never, never serve a FALSE MESSIAH !!

This is only a theory that Israel accepts Jesus before the Antichrist take over. Can you find some scripture to prove it?

When he is revealed by saying he is God, they will know then he is NOT their Messiah and not anyone they want to listen to. But this will not point them to Jesus. They still think He is an impostor.

I will agree that 144,000 will turn to Jesus before the midpoint of the week.

 

[iamlamad]

Revealing Times wrote:
Daniel 7
20 And of the ten horns that were in his head, and of the other which came up, and before whom three fell; even of that horn that had eyes, and a mouth that spake very great things, whose look was more stout than his fellows.

Iamlamad wrote:
These ten have nothing to do with the 10 that throw in with the Beast for one hour, in my opinion.

WHAT ? The Little Horn and 10 Horns in Daniel is the 10 Horns and the Anti-Christ. COME ON. That's elementary.

If three of the ten are taken out, how many are left? Definately not ten!

 

[iamlamad]

You can not separate the TRIBULATION/TROUBLES from Jesus' coming back

iamlamad said: ↑
I CAN separate the tribulation troubles from Christ's return, because THE BIBLE does. After all, are we not suppose to be following the bible?

NOT SO......The bible says Jesus comes and DESTROYS THE BEAST....The BEAST doesn't just stop destroying and killing, that makes NO SENSE, and you know it, Jesus has to com back to keep mankind from destroying himself. Time to admit that was a bad DEBATE POINT .

I think this went right over your head! You said "tribulation." Did you by that mean the 70th week tribulation troubles? If you did, the bible separates them, for Jesus does NOT RETURN at the 7th vial that ends the week. Jesus Himself said He will come AFTER......

Well, do you believe Jesus?

If, on the other hand, you just meant trouble outside of the 70th week, we are in agreement: The Beast is still the Beast will will continue acting like the Beast (as much as is possible after the vials have been poured out) right up to when Jesus takes him out.

If you still believe Jesus returns at the 7th vial that ends the week, then you are rejoicing over error. Anybody can count 1260 days from the abomination, and know when the 7th vial will be poured out. But NO ONE will know the day Jesus will come.

 

[iamlamad]

iamlamad said: ↑
Jesus does NOT shorten those days by His early return! He will shorten those days by pouring out the vials of His wrath. And yes, people WILL be being murdered right up until Jesus returns in chapter 19 - AFTER the 70th week has finished.

I don't get technical! I just follow what John tells us, with proper understanding.

You just need to admit that the Trouble isn't over until Jesus comes back. When Jesus comes back he stops the troubles once he destroys the trouble makers. I will not even debate this point further, it is baseless.

Why do you persist in debate when we agree on this? I agree that the Beast will still be the beast right up until the moment Jesus returns. And at that time, the Beast is NO MORE! We agree on this.

Did you ever imagine you were alive when the vials and plagues were poured out? Did you imagine if you were in the Beast's army what you could do in terrible pain, in darkness, no water, terrible heat, etc?

In my mind, the Beast and his armies will be rendered almost helpless. At least enough the days of great tribulation will stop.

What do you think Jesus meant when He said they would be "cut short?" I am sure He did NOT mean that the Beast's 42 months will be cut short.

 

[iamlamad]

iamlamad said: ↑
This is complete nonsense and you will not be able to prove it with scripture. It is at best human reasoning. The fact is, Revelation is in the proper order and you keep trying to rearrange it, showing us you don't understand John's chronology.

If you can't see the obvious, that's on you.

No, unless you offer scriptural proof that stands the test, your theory is only a theory. John shows us the WEEK ends at the 7th vial. John shows us His coming three chapters away, in chapter 19. John shows us TIME in between.

Jesus said He would come AFTER the days of GT. John fits what Jesus said.

John shows us the marriage and supper IN HEAVEN before jesus descends.

 

[iamlamad]

iamlamad said: ↑
Get this straight: Rev 16 ends the 70th week! But time goes on and Jesus will soon after return. People are still alive in the world - even in Jerusalem which city will be burned.
Revelation 17 happens after the 7th vial had ended the week. But the first part of the chapter does describe the Beast's empire, which will probably be set up by the midpoint of the week. Revelation 18 is Jerusalem being destroyed. Many nations will descend on Israel for the battle of Armageddon. Chapter 18 shows us Jerusalem's destruction.

Rev. 17, 18 and 19 all happen before the ending of the 16th Chapter, except where Jesus throws the Anti-Christ and False Prophet into HELL. You arguing the same point over and over doesn't change it. If that's your view, that's your view, you know mine, why rehash it ?

You have offered a theory. That is all it is: a theory that is different than the way John wrote it. Until you can offer proof, it will remain a theory. My point is, your theory is not what is written!

I have a novel idea: why don't you offer some good scriptural proof with good exegesis?

 

[BABerean2]

If you wish to think the Jews will be Christians at the midpoint of the week, go ahead: but it will not happen. They will know HIM when they SEE Him and see the nail holes in his hands.

Mat 25:10 And while they went to buy, the bridegroom came, and those who were ready went in with him to the wedding; and the door was shut.
Mat 25:11 "Afterward the other virgins came also, saying, 'Lord, Lord, open to us!'
Mat 25:12 But he answered and said, 'Assuredly, I say to you, I do not know you.'
Mat 25:13 "Watch therefore, for you know neither the day nor the hour in which the Son of Man is coming.


Act 2:36 "Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly that God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, both Lord and Christ."

Act 2:37 Now when they heard this, they were cut to the heart, and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles, "Men and brethren, what shall we do?"

Act 2:38 Then Peter said to them, "Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.


Rev 12:11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of their testimony, and they did not love their lives to the death.



Heb 8:13 In that He says, "A NEW COVENANT," He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.



Heb 12:18 For you have not come to the mountain that may be touched and that burned with fire, and to blackness and darkness and tempest,

Heb 12:19 and the sound of a trumpet and the voice of words, so that those who heard it begged that the word should not be spoken to them
anymore.


Heb 12:22 But you have come to Mount Zion and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, to an innumerable company of angels,

Heb 12:23 to the general assembly and church of the firstborn who are registered in heaven, to God the Judge of all, to the spirits of just men made perfect,

Heb 12:24 to Jesus the Mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling that speaks better things than that of Abel.



Heb 13:20 Now may the God of peace who brought up our Lord Jesus from the dead, that great Shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,

.

 

[iamlamad]

iamlamad said: ↑
I CAN separate the tribulation troubles from Christ's return, because THE BIBLE does. After all, are we not suppose to be following the bible?

NOT SO......The bible says Jesus comes and DESTROYS THE BEAST....The BEAST doesn't just stop destroying and killing, that makes NO SENSE, and you know it, Jesus has to com back to keep mankind from destroying himself. Time to admit that was a bad DEBATE POINT .

Sorry, duplicate post.

 

[Revealing Times]

True, i cant say much about how you interpret end times. I believe in the Preterist view of end times. It all fits together logically. If you look into that view properly you will see so much evidence for it all having already passed by 70AD. I still believe that Jesus is returning.

I have already proven in this thread that the 70 AD timeline being the abomination of desolation as a falsity....I can get back to it later.

 

[Revealing Times]

I choose to believe what John wrote:

You are confused and I can prove my POV.

There you have it: John saw a woman riding the beast. The title of the woman is "Babylon The Great, The Mother Of Harlots And Abominations Of The Earth."

She is ONE ENTITY, not two. Note that she is "drunken" on the blood of the saints. John told us she was the "great City." In another verse he told us the great city was Jerusalem.

The Title or Descriptors is actually four, one more than you Described, it says MYSTERY (Musterion which means SECRET by Gods Silence) plus Babylon the Great, etc. etc. She is NOT ONE ENTITY, and hopefully after I prove it you will quit saying she is, but I doubt it. Men's traditions get rooted very deep. The very scriptures you cited, plus scriptures you left out say otherwise.

Rev.17:3.......and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, THIS IS TWO ENTITIES !!

Rev. 17:7 And the angel said unto me, Wherefore didst thou marvel? I will tell thee the mystery of the woman, and of the beast that carrieth her, which hath the seven heads and ten horns. AGAIN, THIS DESCRIBES TWO ENTITIES !!

Now please explain why the Kings (Rev. 17:16) hate the HARLOT and DESTROY HER and why the Kings Rev. 18:9) Cry and Lament Babylons Destruction ? YOU CAN'T EXPLAIN IT....Unless they are DIFFERENT ENTITIES. Just admit it. You are trying to use the DESCRIPTION OF THE WOMAN as being who she is, and those four descriptors, ONLY DESCRIBE HER, she is a MYSTERY....Well that doesn't mean anything, it only means God had yet to reveal the Secret of the Woman to us, but in Rev. 17:7 the Angel via Gods order revealed the SECRET/MYSTERY unto us, so it is NO LONGER A MYSTERY !! She is seen as Babylon the Great because she SITS ON THE BEAST, who is BABYLON in Gods eyes. THAT'S CALLED A CLUE MAN !!

She is the MOTHER OF HARLOTS ,Meaning she gave birth to many FALSE RELIGIONS, go research how many gods Babylon had, and since the Harlot is FALSE RELIGION, this fits to a tee, there were 100's of false gods and false demi-gods.

She is THE ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH, which only means the Harlot puts forth the worship of FALSE GODS which is an ABOMINATION TO GOD, So we see the four descriptors, and none of them have ANYTHING TO DO WITH WHO SHE IS..........She is still the HARLOT, these four things only describe her. MYSTERY...Until the Angel told who she was in Rev. 17:8-18, BABYLON THE GREAT describes where she was birthed and who she was co-mingled with, FALSE GOVERNMENT in Babylon, this has nothing to do with the Harlot being BABYLON, its only a DESCRIPTION MAN !! One of four descriptions. The Harlot is not BABYLON. She rides the BEAST which is BABYLON.

Why is this so difficult to believe? You can come up with human reasoning but you will be wrong. Mystery Babylon is the city of Jerusalem while the Beast and False Prophet reside there deceiving the world. I agree in this: "Mystery Babylon" is a metaphor referring to Jerusalem, because "mystery Babylon" will not exist anymore after the Beast is destoyed, while Jerusalem will continue.

I don't think we will ever agree on this.

You are correct we will not, because it is not Jerusalem. It is Babylon, like it says, and God tells you what he sees as Babylon in Rev. chapter 16.

 

[Revealing Times]

Chapters 17 and 18 are talking about the destruction of the kingdom of the Beast, who used Jerusalem as his capitol. I can see we will never agree on this.

Rev. 17 is about the Harlot, which is False Religion. Not Jerusalem, that makes absolutely no sense. Go reread Chapter 17 and think FALSE RELIGION and see how it fits.

I am going to go through this whole chapter and inform you why I see this as I do. It is just not that hard to see imho. You just want it to be Jerusalem, but the facts just don't back it up brother.

Rev. 17:1 And there came one of the seven angels which had the seven vials, and talked with me, saying unto me, Come hither; I will shew unto thee the judgment of the great harlot that sitteth upon many waters:

{{ OK, The Harlot is being JUDGED and she sits on MANY WATERS, now what does the Angel EXPLAIN to us that the MANY WATERS is later on in the chapter in his DESCRIPTIONS of the Harlot and the Beast ? MANY WATERS is Nations, Peoples, Places and Tongues so we see that this Harlot can not be Jerusalem with just this first verse alone, she has to be a WORLD WIDE ENTITY. }}

2 With whom the kings of the earth have committed fornication, and the inhabitants of the earth have been made drunk with the wine of her fornication.

{{ Babylon is a KINGDOM/KING, this Harlot has has FORNICATED with the Kings, she is NOT A KING she is a HARLOT, Jerusalem has fornicated with the Kings of the earth ? GET OUT !! Jerusalem has been conquered by the Kings of the Earth, time and again. Who are the INHABITANTS OF THE EARTH ? We the people, and how does the Harlot make us drunk with the wine of Fornication ? Well that was easy, the Holy Spirit was seen as WINE that made the Apostles appear to be DRUNK, and John takes from this and says the Harlot has made the inhabitants (of course the ones that partook in her FALSE GODS) of the Earth, drunk with her Fornication's. This means drunken via the worship of FALSE GODS or FALSE RELIGIONS. Lets see, we have two clues. She is WORLD WIDE and she makes all inhabitants of the Earth DRUNK WITH FORNICATION which means being ONE WITH......The Jerusalem angle is falling apart man, FALSE RELIGION is standing up to the test. }}

3 So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns.

{{ This is easy, the Harlot (False Religion) is riding the Back of everyone of the BEASTS that Conquered Israel, Jerusalem can surely not be this Harlot, she was not CO-MINGLED with these BEASTS, she was Conquered by these BEASTS. }}

4 And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication:

{{ The Biggest clue here is in Daniel chapter 5, a chapter I asked you to look at. We can see exactly what John is referring to in these first few verses here, who exactly the Harlot is and why. She is FALSE RELIGION that has disrespected God, and she is an ABOMINATION unto God, and God is going to DESTROY her in Rev. 17:16, and NO it is not nor can it be Jerusalem, God is going to destroy ALL FALSE RELIGION: Daniel 5:

Daniel 5:1 Belshazzar the king made a great feast to a thousand of his lords, and drank wine before the thousand.

2 Belshazzar, whiles he tasted the wine, commanded to bring the golden and silver vessels which his father Nebuchadnezzar had taken out of the temple which was in Jerusalem; that the king, and his princes, his wives, and his concubines, might drink therein.

3 Then they brought the golden vessels that were taken out of the temple of the house of God which was at Jerusalem; and the king, and his princes, his wives, and his concubines, drank in them.

4 They drank wine, and praised the gods of gold, and of silver, of brass, of iron, of wood, and of stone.

5 In the same hour came forth fingers of a man's hand, and wrote over against the candlestick upon the plaister of the wall of the king's palace: and the king saw the part of the hand that wrote.

6 Then the king's countenance was changed, and his thoughts troubled him, so that the joints of his loins were loosed, and his knees smote one against another.

Then Belshazzar sent for Daniel, to find out what this writing meant !!

Daniel 5:23 But hast lifted up thyself against the Lord of heaven; and they have brought the vessels of his house before thee, and thou, and thy lords, thy wives, and thy concubines, have drunk wine in them; and thou hast praised the gods of silver, and gold, of brass, iron, wood, and stone, which see not, nor hear, nor know: and the God in whose hand thy breath is, and whose are all thy ways, hast thou not glorified:

24 Then was the part of the hand sent from him; and this writing was written. 25 And this is the writing that was written, Mene, Mene, Tekel, Upharsin. 26 This is the interpretation of the thing: Mene; God hath numbered thy kingdom, and finished it. 27 Tekel; Thou art weighed in the balances, and art found wanting.

28 Peres; Thy kingdom is divided, and given to the Medes and Persians.

John is showing you exactly who the Harlot is, anyone that worships the gods of silver, gold, iron, brass, wood and stone is worshiping FALSE RELIGION, or the Harlot. There is a CUP in her hand in Rev. 17 just like in Daniel 5, its the cup of Abominations. Those that worship FALSE GODS drink from this SAME CUP. }}

5 And upon her forehead was a name written, Mystery, Babylon The Great, The Mother Of Harlots And Abominations Of The Earth.

{{ Again, these are only descriptors of the Harlot. }}

6 And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration.

{{ The Harlot (False Religion) has the blood of the Saints and the Martyrs of Jesus on her hands. That would be False Religion, that would cover every Saint and Martyr ever killed, no doubt. }}

7 And the angel said unto me, Wherefore didst thou marvel? I will tell thee the mystery of the woman, and of the beast that carrieth her, which hath the seven heads and ten horns.

{{ So the Angel clearly says I WILL SHOW YOU THE SECRET of the Woman AND the Beast, TWO DIFFERENT ENTITIES, and then the Angel does just that, IF YOU LISTEN !! }}

8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.

{{ The Angel explains the BEAST FIRST, it seems John via the Angel here is telling everyone that all these Beast are ruled by the Dark Kingdom of Satan in some manner. NO DOUBT. }}

9 And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth. 10 And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space.

{{ The Seven Heads on the Seven Headed Beast is SEVEN MOUNTAINS on which the WOMEN SITS and they are ALSO SEVEN KINGS, Five have Fallen, ONE IS, and one is YET TO COME. and of course he will not last long like the other Six Kings/Kingdoms, who were a part of LARGE KINGDOMS that lasted years. God needed to show us this LAST BEAST or the Seventh Head of the Beast will a MERE MAN not a Kingdom which goes on and on and on like the others, that is why the Angel created a TRANSFER POINT, to change the Seven Headed Beast into SEVEN KINGS....They went from Seven Beasts (Kingdoms) to SEVEN RULERS (Mountains) which are also SEVEN KINGS and of the Seven, FIVE HAVE FALLEN (Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, Persia and Greece).......... and ONE IS (Rome was the Beast over Israel at the time John wrote Revelation)....... and one is YET TO COME (The Anti-Christ his 10 Kings are FUTURISTIC) So God got the Angel to transfer this for a REASON, he wanted us to know the LAST BEAST would be the MAN OF SIN, or Anti-Christ and would be ALL POWERFUL, and he will be the ONLY KING of this Kingdom, once he dies, its ALL OVER, Jesus will be his destroyer, once he is defeated he will be cast straight into HELL along with the False Prophet. }}

11 And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition.

{{ This tells us basically what verse 8 tells us, that the 8th King is OVER THE SEVEN BEASTS/Kings/Kingdoms. Its the Dark Kingdom of Satan that has been RULING all of these Evil Kingdoms that have tried to destroy Gods chosen peoples (Israel) at various times. But it can't work, because after all, God is God, and He is ALL POWERFUL. Amen. }}

12 And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast. 13 These have one mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the beast. 14 These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.

{{ The 10 Horns of Daniel 7 are 10 Kings, they will come to power with the BEAST/Little Horn/Anti-Christ, who is called a BEAST only because he CONQUERS ISRAEL, their reigns will be SHORT, not an HOUR of course, but VERY SHORT as per Kingdoms go, Seven Years. They of course give their power unto the Anti-Christ. But Jesus will destroy the BEAST and all his Kings, along with all of their Armies. }}

THUS THE ANGEL REVEALS WHO THE BEAST IS, DID YOU GET IT ? Now on to the Harlot and who she is and what the Kings (in league with the BEAST of Course) actions vs. the Harlot are going to be !!

16 And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall hate the harlot, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire.

{{ OK, so these Kings hate the Harlot and BURN her or lets say they DESTROY HER, but why would they want to Destroy the Harlot or FALSE RELIGION ? Because of course the BEAST understands that in order to rule the world and be worshiped as GOD, he has to Destroy Islam and their 2 Billion worshipers, along with all other worshiping of any other gods. THIS HAS TO HAPPEN...............................Thus God uses the Anti-Christs OWN HEARTS DESIRES to destroy or JUDGE the Harlot !! The very next verse tells us this is true. The Harlot is FALSE RELIGION, not Jerusalem. }}

17 For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled.

{{ For God placed this in THEIR HEARTS to fulfill His will !! AND to give their Powers/Kingdoms unto the BEAST so Gods words can be fulfilled.}}

18 And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth.

{{ Look to Babylon, that is what is WRITTEN on her forehead. WHAT DID YOU SEE ? Babylon Written on her forehead. She is co-mingled with that CITY, she is the FALSE RELIGION side of Babylon. There is a FALSE GOVERNMENT side to this CITY Also. }}

Jerusalem is not the Harlot NOR CAN IT BE.

 

[Revealing Times]

Did you not know the Jews have been working hard to get a red heifer without spot of blemish? They have been getting read with sheep and goats also.

WHY WOULD I CARE ? I have told you they Reinstitute Animal Sacrifice into the Temple when they FIRST BUILD IT...........They then REPENT when Elijah preaches Jesus as their Savior and Messiah. They then start worshiping Jesus Christ as their Savior. So what does one have to do with the other ? I ADMIT they build the Temple and start Animal sacrifices in it. But when they ACCEPT JESUS, the Temple is then CLEANSED. Then
the Anti-Christ DEFILES THE TEMPLE.

WHY would it be an abomination? It is the 70th week of DANIEL, a time for JEWS and Daniel's people.
Did you not read Ezekiel and the new temple, where they will hold Animal sacrifices during the millennial reign? Will it be an abomination then? I guess not!

I can see one thing very clearly: you are I are never going to agree on much.

If you wish to think the Jews will be Christians at the midpoint of the week, go ahead: but it will not happen. They will know HIM when they SEE Him and see the nail holes in his hands.

And if you think God is going to allow Jesus Christ to be mocked by Animal Sacrifices you have it all wrong. There will be no millennial Sacrifices save the worshiping of the SACRIFICE JESUS CHRIST.

Sorry, no sequitur: All through the Old Covenant, worshiping idols has been called "fornication. The cup filled with fornication is talking about deceiving the entire world into worshiping Satan and thinking they are worshiping God.

I will give you this much credit: you did find another cup!

That's cute and all, but it brings no facts to the table. Out of 404 verses in Revelation 289 are rooted in Old Testament VERBIAGE. This just in, everyone knows that Revelation is ENCODED with the Old Testament. Or should I say it seems everyone but you. Maybe that is why you seem to be having trouble uraveling the book of Revelation.

This is only a theory that Israel accepts Jesus before the Antichrist take over. Can you find some scripture to prove it?

When he is revealed by saying he is God, they will know then he is NOT their Messiah and not anyone they want to listen to. But this will not point them to Jesus. They still think He is an impostor.

I will agree that 144,000 will turn to Jesus before the midpoint of the week.

A theory to those who do not understand the bible. I have posted the scriptures, and won't to it again.

If three of the ten are taken out, how many are left? Definately not ten!

Yes you still have 10 KINGDOMS ruled by SEVEN KINGS. In Revelation chapter 12 it tells you this, you have to use ALL THE SCRIPTURES !!

Revelation 12:3 And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.

{ So there were 10 KINGDOMS but only SEVEN KINGS (CROWNS) because of course THREE were Destroyed by the Anti-Christ. So we have 10 that turns into 7. Frankly, I have never seen anyone that didn't understand that the Little Horn and 10 Kings which turn into 7 Kings of Daniel Chapter 7 is the Anti-Christ and his 10 Kings. }

I think this went right over your head! You said "tribulation." Did you by that mean the 70th week tribulation troubles? If you did, the bible separates them, for Jesus does NOT RETURN at the 7th vial that ends the week. Jesus Himself said He will come AFTER......

{Again, you are way out in left field. There will be no stopping of troubles before Jesus comes back, that is silly and not worth discussing further.}

No, unless you offer scriptural proof that stands the test, your theory is only a theory. John shows us the WEEK ends at the 7th vial. John shows us His coming three chapters away, in chapter 19. John shows us TIME in between.

Jesus said He would come AFTER the days of GT. John fits what Jesus said.

John shows us the marriage and supper IN HEAVEN before jesus descends.

Once again, it is not even worthy of debate. If you cant understand the scriptures then its pointless.

You have offered a theory. That is all it is: a theory that is different than the way John wrote it. Until you can offer proof, it will remain a theory. My point is, your theory is not what is written!

I have a novel idea: why don't you offer some good scriptural proof with good exegesis?

By you keeping on repeating everything you disagree with is A THEORY makes you look silly sir, sorry to point that out, but I see these types all the time. Everything is A THEORY........... Get real. Just because you say that, that means NOTHING. But you think it makes you right, frankly, you are the most confused poster I have met on this site save a few, you have some FAR OUT LEFT-FIELD Ideas.

You wouldn't understand if God Himself told you brother. You seem to have tunnel vision on everything. And its not worthy of me wasting my time further, because I can tell by you same questions you just skim of others posts and then repost the same old stuff, that I have yet to make any sense of.