The Unforgiveable Sin

[1whirlwind]

There is an unforgiveable sin! As there is an unforgiveable sin we must know exactly what that sin is.

• 1 John 5:16-17 If any man see his brother sin a sin which is not unto death, he shall ask, and He shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it. All unrighteousness is sin: and there is a sin not unto death.
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  • 1 John 1:7 But if we walk in the light, as He is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanseth us from all sin.

Understand what is being said there. John, I believe, is addressing the elect. We are told that if we are of the elect, we may ask for a brother to be given life and....He shall give him life!

As long as the brother has not committed the unforgiveable sin, the "sin unto death," as we cannot even pray for a brother that commits that sin.

"All unrighteousness is sin" but that is not the "unforgiveable sin," for He will not cleanse us of that sin.....

• Luke 12:8-10 Also I say unto you, Whosoever shall confess Me before men, him shall the Son of man also confess before the angels of God: But he that denieth Me before men shall be denied before the angels of God. And whosoever shall speak a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but unto him that blasphemeth against the Holy Ghost it shall not be forgiven.

That is very interesting to me. Not to get into the Trinity debate but...Father, Son and Holy Spirit are One. So, what does it mean that a word can be spoken against the Son of man and be forgiven but not against the Holy Spirit? I believe that is showing us that the "Son of man" there means Christ in us, in His elect, in His body. That body can be spoken against and it shall be forgiven. Why would anyone, or how could anyone...blasphemeth against the Holy Ghost?

• 12:11-12 And when they bring you unto the synagogues, and unto magistrates, and powers, take ye no thought how or what thing ye shall answer, or what ye shall say: For the Holy Ghost shall teach you in the same hour what ye ought to say."

Now, this could be at any time we, as children of God, are confronted with questions or opportunities to share knowledge of Christ with others. We are, or can be, taken before religious leaders, rulers and powers today, even on forums such as this but this event appears to be a very specific time. Going before rulers reminds me of....

• Ephesians 6:12 (666) For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.
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  6:13 Wherefore take unto you the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand.

When is "the hour," or the "evil day," when some will be delivered for a testimony? I'm not sure any more. I used to believe it was only during Satan's tribulation, during his "hour of temptation." [Revelation 3:10] But, perhaps that hour is different for us all and our hour is whenever we are tested. However, it is written....

• Mark 13:9-11 But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you up to councils; and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten: and ye shall be brought before rulers and kings for My sake, for a testimony against them. And the gospel must first be published among all nations. But when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost.

Perhaps we can commit that one sin, at any time when we are led by the Holy Spirit and refuse Him. But, I believe a specific time is being taught when this one sin can be committed, and it is at the end of days.

As written, some of us will be delivered for a testimony. We are not to premeditate what we will say for the Holy Spirit will speak through us. To premeditate or not allow the Spirit would be to committ the unpardonable sin! Is this the event we were given an example of in Acts....

• Acts 2:1 And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place. And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting. And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them. And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.
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  2:6 Now when this was noised aboad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because that every man heard them speak in his own language.

We must be ready and watch!

 

[squint]

The 'sin unto death?'

Blasphemy against the Holy Spirit?

Matthew 12:31
Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.

When Satan spoke through Peter, who commited the SIN? Only Peter? Only Satan? Both?

When Satan 'entered' Judas and then betrayal came from Judas, same question set.

When 'any' of us sin, same question set.

Sin should never be viewed apart from ALL the parties involved. We know the DEVIL is connected to EVERY SIN per 1 John 3:8. WE also know that the DEVIL was not, is not and will NEVER be forgiven.

So why look at only MANKIND in these various views? To do that doesn't make sense.

When the DEVIL is factored in, the question becomes much easier to answer.

enjoy!

squint

 

[Giver]

1wirlwind you asked: Why would anyone, or how could anyone...blasphemeth against the Holy Ghost?

You ask many questions and most can only be answered by God.

I will answer one of your questions, but you will not understand my answer until God explains it to you.

When a person has the Holy Spirit guiding him or her, that person tells the Holy Spirit that they will be obedient. The Holy Spirit tells the person not to lie. The person ignores the Holy Spirit and goes a head and lies. That is an unforgivable sin.

(Acts 5:1-11) “There was another man, however, called Ananias. He and his wife, Sapphira, agreed to sell a property; but with his wife’s connivance he kept back part of the proceeds, and brought the rest and presented it to the apostles. Ananias, Peter said ‘now can Satan have so possessed you that you should lie to the Holy Spirit and keep back part of the money from the land? While you still owned the land, wasn’t it yours to keep, and after you had sold it wasn’t the money yours to do with as you liked? What put this scheme into your mind? It is not to men that you have lied, but to God. When he heard this Ananias fell down dead. This made a profound impression on everyone present. The younger men got up, wrapped the body in a sheet, carried it out and buried it.

About three hours later his wife came in, not knowing what had taken place. Peter challenged her, ‘Tell me was this the price you sold the land for? ‘Yes,’ she said ‘that was the price.’ Peter then said, ‘So you and your husband have agreed to put the Spirit of the Lord to the test! What made you do it? You hear those footsteps? They have just been to bury your husband; they will carry you out, too.’ Instantly she dropped dead at his feet. When the young men came in they found she was dead, and they carried her out and buried her by the side of her husband. This made a profound impression on the whole Church and on all who heard it.”

 

[squint]

1wirlwind you asked: Why would anyone, or how could anyone...blasphemeth against the Holy Ghost?

You ask many questions and most can only be answered by God.

I will answer one of your questions, but you will not understand my answer until God explains it to you.

When a person has the Holy Spirit guiding him or her, that person tells the Holy Spirit that they will be obedient. The Holy Spirit tells the person not to lie. The person ignores the Holy Spirit and goes a head and lies. That is an unforgivable sin.

(Acts 5:1-11) “There was another man, however, called Ananias. He and his wife, Sapphira, agreed to sell a property; but with his wife’s connivance he kept back part of the proceeds, and brought the rest and presented it to the apostles. Ananias, Peter said ‘now can Satan have so possessed you that you should lie to the Holy Spirit and keep back part of the money from the land? While you still owned the land, wasn’t it yours to keep, and after you had sold it wasn’t the money yours to do with as you liked? What put this scheme into your mind? It is not to men that you have lied, but to God. When he heard this Ananias fell down dead. This made a profound impression on everyone present. The younger men got up, wrapped the body in a sheet, carried it out and buried it.

About three hours later his wife came in, not knowing what had taken place. Peter challenged her, ‘Tell me was this the price you sold the land for? ‘Yes,’ she said ‘that was the price.’ Peter then said, ‘So you and your husband have agreed to put the Spirit of the Lord to the test! What made you do it? You hear those footsteps? They have just been to bury your husband; they will carry you out, too.’ Instantly she dropped dead at his feet. When the young men came in they found she was dead, and they carried her out and buried her by the side of her husband. This made a profound impression on the whole Church and on all who heard it.”

Have you EVER considered that God was MERCIFUL to Ananias and Saphira in REAPING THEM out of their flesh where the DEVIL/SATAN had entered?

And that SATAN remains CONDEMNED for CAUSING that blasphemy IN THEIR FLESH?

If you did see things that way, I'd probably fall over dead...in surprise.

 

[Hentenza]

Presently there is only one unforgivable sin and that is dieing not believing.

 

[1whirlwind]

Presently there is only one unforgivable sin and that is dieing not believing.

That is forgiveable. Those doing so will not be of the first resurrection but they will be taught during the millennium. At the end of that time they will again be tested and then....eternity or...not.

 

[Hentenza]

That is forgiveable. Those doing so will not be of the first resurrection but they will be taught during the millennium. At the end of that time they will again be tested and then....eternity or...not.

Can you please cite biblical evidence?

 

[1whirlwind]

The 'sin unto death?'

Blasphemy against the Holy Spirit?

Matthew 12:31
Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.

When Satan spoke through Peter, who commited the SIN? Only Peter? Only Satan? Both?

When Satan 'entered' Judas and then betrayal came from Judas, same question set.

When 'any' of us sin, same question set.

Sin should never be viewed apart from ALL the parties involved. We know the DEVIL is connected to EVERY SIN per 1 John 3:8. WE also know that the DEVIL was not, is not and will NEVER be forgiven.

So why look at only MANKIND in these various views? To do that doesn't make sense.

When the DEVIL is factored in, the question becomes much easier to answer.

enjoy!

squint

Actually...the question is answered. The way the devil is factored in is that he, or his men, are those the elect are delivered to.

Mark 13:9-11 But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you up to councils; and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten: and ye shall be brought before rulers and kings for My sake, for a testimony against them. And the gospel must first be published among all nations. But when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost.
​

To not allow the Spirit to speak through us or to premeditate is....the unforgiveable sin. Only the elect can committ it.

 

[Giver]

Have you EVER considered that God was MERCIFUL to Ananias and Saphira in REAPING THEM out of their flesh where the DEVIL/SATAN had entered?

And that SATAN remains CONDEMNED for CAUSING that blasphemy IN THEIR FLESH?

If you did see things that way, I'd probably fall over dead...in surprise.

Look you believe what ever it is you need to believe. People sin and they need an excuse to justify their sinning.

Being told that if one commits sin they don’t know God, is much more than someone who believes they know God, can understand and accept.

(1 John 3: 3 - 9) “Surely everyone who entertains this hope must purify himself, must try to be as pure as Christ. Any one who sins at all breaks the law, because to sin is to break the law. Now you know that He appeared in order to abolish sin, and that in Him there is no sin; anyone who lives in God does not sin, and anyone who sins has never seen Him or known Him. My children do not let anyone lead you astray; to live a holy life is to be holy just as He is holy; to lead a sinful life is to belong to the Devil, since the Devil was a sinner from the beginning. It was to undo all that the Devil has done that the Son of God appeared. No one who has been begotten by God sins: because God’s seed remains inside him, he cannot sin when he has been begotten by God.”

All a person who believes they know God, and still sins, can do is try to prove John didn’t mean what he wrote. Well there is something else a sinner could do. A sinner could go to God and find out how to live a sinless life.

I will be willing to venture a guess that most people who read this will tell me I am all wrong, and spend much time trying to prove that to themselves.

Jesus gave us a very easy way to defeat Satan/sin. Life is so much better after one finds that answer.

 

[squint]

Look you believe what ever it is you need to believe. People sin and they need an excuse to justify their sinning.

I certainly don't have ANY use for not bringing ALL the parties to the table of judgment. YOU? No earthly judge would even consider such a thing. But 'christian judges' overlook the FACTS constantly.

So what else new in the world of VOID OF FACT 'christian' judgments?

All a person who believes they know God, and still sins, can do is try to prove John didn’t mean what he wrote. Well there is something else a sinner could do. A sinner could go to God and find out how to live a sinless life.

Good luck with that one too. I see ZERO presentations of sinless flesh or mind in the text available for ANY but Jesus. Only the opposite. In order to be IN TRUTH we have to deal with our 'infirmities,' even BOASTING of them (2 Cor. 12-6-10)

Jesus gave us a very easy way to defeat Satan/sin. Life is so much better after one finds that answer.

The 'evil present' will ALL MANKIND is not about to change it's stripes on the basis of what 'we' might think. I'm sure you believe your 'evil present' is responsible and law abiding.

 

[squint]

Actually...the question is answered. The way the devil is factored in is that he, or his men, are those the elect are delivered to.

Mark 13:9-11 But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you up to councils; and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten: and ye shall be brought before rulers and kings for My sake, for a testimony against them. And the gospel must first be published among all nations. But when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost.
​

To not allow the Spirit to speak through us or to premeditate is....the unforgiveable sin. Only the elect can committ it.

Only if you VIEW THAT POWER from an external basis.

The fact is that EVIL PRESENT has been delivered INTO our flesh and minds already.

Romans 7:17-21/Romans 9:19-21/Romans 11:8/2 Tim. 2:20-21

Read 'em and tell me you don't have a 'vessel of dishonor' IN YOUR LUMP...that is NOT YOU as a VESSEL OF MERCY/AN ELECT.

Always thinking it is the OUTSIDE enemies in OTHER PEOPLE is a very very false measure of HONESTY within ourselves.

s

 

[1whirlwind]

Can you please cite biblical evidence?

Revelation 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

At the end of this age there are the spiritually living and the spiritually dead. Those living in Christ are of the first resurrection and they will be immortal, for concerning them...."the second death hath no power." The others are the spiritually dead but they are not destroyed.
​

20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with Him a thousand years.

As priests they will teach the others (from the millennial chapter)....."And they shall teach My People the difference between the holy and profane, and cause them to discern between the unclean and the clean." [Ezekiel 44:23]
​

20:7-8 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison, And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.

Who does he deceive? Not the spiritually living. Rather it is some of those considered the dead...quite a few of those! They weren't literally dead.
​

20:9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.

God "devoured" those that followed Satan so who are these "dead" being judged?
​

20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

There are many in the world that never had a chance to love our Father. They will be given that chance.
​

 

[CalmRon]

squint, please clarify, should man be punished for their participation in sin? or just satan and the fallen angels. because I glean from every post you make related to this subject that you are laying sole blame on the evil within. no disrespect meant just need clarification.

 

[1whirlwind]

Only if you VIEW THAT POWER from an external basis.

The fact is that EVIL PRESENT has been delivered INTO our flesh and minds already.

Romans 7:17-21/Romans 9:19-21/Romans 11:8/2 Tim. 2:20-21

Read 'em and tell me you don't have a 'vessel of dishonor' IN YOUR LUMP...that is NOT YOU as a VESSEL OF MERCY/AN ELECT.

Always thinking it is the OUTSIDE enemies in OTHER PEOPLE is a very very false measure of HONESTY within ourselves.

s

Squint, there is a difference in the sin in all of us...for it is certainly there...and in the sin mentioned in this thread. There is one specific unpardonable sin. All others can be forgiven. One cannot. The one that cannot is taught in the Olivet prophecies....when the elect are delivered.

 

[squint]

Squint, there is a difference in the sin in all of us...for it is certainly there...and in the sin mentioned in this thread. There is one specific unpardonable sin. All others can be forgiven. One cannot. The one that cannot is taught in the Olivet prophecies....when the elect are delivered.

And I don't believe that ANY SIN is ever forgiven of THE DEVIL. There is the unforgiveable SIN and the SINNER all in ONE PACKAGE.

I do NOT have to smear my fellow man with that view either. Scripture has provided us a REASONABLE place to lay the blame without looking upon our fellow man WITH ETERNAL DEATH to them painted all over our innards...

sorry if this offends you...but WE all have been commanded to LOVE all our fellow man.

I cannot SEE THAT while painting the other PEOPLE with ETERNAL DEATH. That methodology to me will remain FALSE, VOID, DEAD and UNFORGIVEABLE all coming from the POWER OF DEATH/the DEVIL within those whom it OPENLY operates WITHIN.

s

 

[CalmRon]

the unforgivable sins are presumptuous living and not asking for forgiveness any sin. for the most part the unpardonable sin is one which isn't brought forward to Christ

 

[squint]

squint, please clarify, should man be punished for their participation in sin? or just satan and the fallen angels. because I glean from every post you make related to this subject that you are laying sole blame on the evil within. no disrespect meant just need clarification.

There is no doubt to me that the DEVIL is involved in EVERY SIN. 1 John 3:8 makes this very clear. So it is quite pointless to judge ANY matter of sin APART from THE DEVIL.

I have no use to believe that PAUL was the EVIL PRESENT that he openly stated HE HAD. No, Paul admitted the sin that indwelt him WAS NOT HIM...just as I believe the EVIL PRESENT with Paul was not him. Gods children whom PAUL WAS are not the 'same as' that working. It's not possible. Saul was BLINDED UNDER THAT POWER OF SATAN/SIN. In that way he was A CARNAL SLAVE...and that slaveship as it pertained to the reactions of EVIL PRESENT with THE LAW OF SIN did not change after his conversion. He still FOUND LIFE in the midst of that FACT.

Some see it. Most are NOT slated to SEE it.

Mankind as it pertains to our flesh IS PUNISHED by physical death because of the occupancy of SIN therein. That however is not enough for many of you, who INSIST that sin transpiring in the flesh of ALL must be carried past the GRAVE unto those in whom it was carried.

Paul tells us this about SIN and when 'anyone' is 'freed' from same:

Romans 6:7
because anyone who has died has been freed from sin.

The devil and his messengers WILL BE PERMANENTLY punished for ALL of their actions within mankind.

Mankind will be FORGIVEN of every sin including BLASPHEMY because of the involvement of the DEVIL AND HIS MESSENGERS in every one of those matters.

In this way it is ENTIRELY POSSIBLE to actually LOVE all our neighbors as ourselves AND to abide in understandings of ETERNAL JUDGMENTS.

But in order to 'do this' we MUST come to the TRUTH of these facts which ONLY God can lead any person INTO. If not, then that is where God wants that person...it is HE who has raised up that OTHER POWER in the flesh of that person and THAT POWER cannot stand IN THE LIGHT. It's NOT POSSIBLE for the DEVIL to speak the TRUTH of these matters.

When I say this: I HAVE EVIL PRESENT WITH ME THAT IS OF THE DEVIL I am speaking the TRUTH. Devils in men cannot stand to make that statement NOR will they 'allow' their SLAVES that much TRUTH.

enjoy!

squint

 

[Tonks]

Presently there is only one unforgivable sin and that is dieing not believing.

To extend this...the belief that there is a sin so bad that it cannot / will not be forgiven. Perhaps a better way to think of it is more along the lines of impenitence...either the obstinate refusal / continual perserverance in sin until death along with my above remarks.

The idea that it is merely death without beliving is a interpretation that is strongly influenced by baptist and reformed theology and it lacks some of the nuance and understanding necessary, i think.

 

[Giver]

(Hebrews 10:26-31) “If, after we have been given knowledge of the truth, we should deliberately commit any sins, then there is no longer any sacrifice for them. There is left only the dreadful prospect of judgment and of the fiery wrath that is to devour your enemies. Anyone who disregards the Law of Moses is ruthlessly put to death on the word of two witnesses or three; and you may be sure that anyone who tramples on the Son of God, and who treats the blood of the covenant which sanctified him as if it were not holy, and who insults the Spirit of grace, will be condemned to a far severer punishment. We are all aware who it was that said: Vengeance is mine; I will vindicate his people. It is a dreadful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.”

(Hebrews 6: 4) “As for those people who were once brought into the light, and tasted the gift from heaven, and received a share of the Holy Spirit, and appreciated the good message of God and the powers of the world to come and yet in spite of this have fallen away it is impossible for that to be renewed a second time. They cannot be repentant if they have willfully crucified the Son of God and openly mocked Him.”​

 

[CalmRon]

There is no doubt to me that the DEVIL is involved in EVERY SIN. 1 John 3:8 makes this very clear. So it is quite pointless to judge ANY matter of sin APART from THE DEVIL.

I have no use to believe that PAUL was the EVIL PRESENT that he openly stated HE HAD. No, Paul admitted the sin that indwelt him WAS NOT HIM...just as I believe the EVIL PRESENT with Paul was not him. Gods children whom PAUL WAS are not the 'same as' that working. It's not possible. Saul was BLINDED UNDER THAT POWER OF SATAN/SIN. In that way he was A CARNAL SLAVE...and that slaveship as it pertained to the reactions of EVIL PRESENT with THE LAW OF SIN did not change after his conversion. He still FOUND LIFE in the midst of that FACT.

Some see it. Most are NOT slated to SEE it.

Mankind as it pertains to our flesh IS PUNISHED by physical death because of the occupancy of SIN therein. That however is not enough for many of you, who INSIST that sin transpiring in the flesh of ALL must be carried past the GRAVE unto those in whom it was carried.

Paul tells us this about SIN and when 'anyone' is 'freed' from same:

Romans 6:7
because anyone who has died has been freed from sin.

The devil and his messengers WILL BE PERMANENTLY punished for ALL of their actions within mankind.

Mankind will be FORGIVEN of every sin including BLASPHEMY because of the involvement of the DEVIL AND HIS MESSENGERS in every one of those matters.

In this way it is ENTIRELY POSSIBLE to actually LOVE all our neighbors as ourselves AND to abide in understandings of ETERNAL JUDGMENTS.

But in order to 'do this' we MUST come to the TRUTH of these facts which ONLY God can lead any person INTO. If not, then that is where God wants that person...it is HE who has raised up that OTHER POWER in the flesh of that person and THAT POWER cannot stand IN THE LIGHT. It's NOT POSSIBLE for the DEVIL to speak the TRUTH of these matters.

When I say this: I HAVE EVIL PRESENT WITH ME THAT IS OF THE DEVIL I am speaking the TRUTH. Devils in men cannot stand to make that statement NOR will they 'allow' their SLAVES that much TRUTH.

enjoy!

squint

but does this mean that only satan is punished for his sin and involvement in other's sin? or is man, especially when is involved in the sin and will not repent, slated for the same fate? part of your argument seems to a sophisticated 'the devil made me do it' argument ultimately satan is the father of lies and other sin, but isn't man's responsibility for his own sin? obviously one is saved by christ when we come in faith and repentance ao we don't have to worry about paying the penalty if we abide in him, but recognition that satan dwells in us alone and that is why we sin doesn't say much and contributes to the 'devil made me do' argument; I understand that satan works within us but he also resonates with the evil that originated within us in the first place.
when adam sinned not the devil he brought death into the world. adam acted as a free agent and chose evil the deveil didn't make him or eve to sin.