The Unforgiveable Sin

[Giver]

I do not know any christian who has not sinned since knowing the truth including myself by comission and or omission.
We are Not doomed
We are forgiven and cleansed by the blood of Jesus from all unrighteousness
backsliders are also restored and forgiven just like the prodigal
by Jesus our Lord and Saviour.
Our righteousness is of God saith the Lord.

15And it came to pass, that, as Jesus sat at meat in his house, many publicans and sinners sat also together with Jesus and his disciples: for there were many, and they followed him.

16And when the scribes and Pharisees saw him eat with publicans and sinners, they said unto his disciples, How is it that he eateth and drinketh with publicans and sinners? 17When Jesus heard it, he saith unto them, They that are whole have no need of the physician, but they that are sick: I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

I told you that my sharing would not help you understand. The only way to understand is to let God teach you. Ask yourself, have you ever asked the Holy Spirit/Jesus a question and heard an answer from God?

The only way to defeat sin is spiritually. It is entirely possible that you have never met a truly spiritual person.

People just can’t understand the following verse. (1 John 3: 3 - 9) “Surely everyone who entertains this hope must purify himself, must try to be as pure as Christ. Any one who sins at all breaks the law, because to sin is to break the law. Now you know that He appeared in order to abolish sin, and that in Him there is no sin; anyone who lives in God does not sin, and anyone who sins has never seen Him or known Him. My children do not let anyone lead you astray; to live a holy life is to be holy just as He is holy; to lead a sinful life is to belong to the Devil, since the Devil was a sinner from the beginning. It was to undo all that the Devil has done that the Son of God appeared. No one who has been begotten by God sins: because God’s seed remains inside him, he cannot sin when he has been begotten by God.”

Paul told people the same thing in the following verse. (1 Corinthians 3:1-3) “Brothers, I myself was unable to speak to you as people of the Spirit; I treated you as sensual men, still infants in Christ. What I fed you with was milk, not solid food, for you were not ready for it; and indeed, you are still not ready for it since you are still unspiritual. Isn’t that obvious from all the jealousy and wrangling that there is among you, from the way that you go on behaving like ordinary people? “

 

[squint]

I told you that my sharing would not help you understand. The only way to understand is to let God teach you. Ask yourself, have you ever asked the Holy Spirit/Jesus a question and heard an answer from God?

The only way to defeat sin is spiritually. It is entirely possible that you have never met a truly spiritual person.

People who claim to be sinless and listen to little voices in their heads that claim to be Jesus talking to them should perhaps be tested for...?

 

[1whirlwind]

Oh really?

Jesus called PETER SATAN right to his face. So, what are we to make of THAT? Was PETER then SATAN?

You either are going to make PETER SATAN in this matter or you are going to make SATAN satan in this matter. It can't be played BOTH WAYS.

Matthew 16:23
But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men.


Mark 8:33
But when he had turned about and looked on his disciples, he rebuked Peter, saying, Get thee behind me, Satan:for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but the things that be of men.

So, you have so far and again said that Peter was NOT Satan, but that SATAN was not 'in' Peter.

That's called ON THE FENCE....

Do you believe Jesus thought Peter was literally Satan as you do or that he was simply a man, a human, that needed to be rebuked..."He rebuked Peter."

Please humor me with the simple math here.

IF all have sin (they do) and if all have sinned (they do) and if those who commit sin are OF THE DEVIL ....(they are)

The DEVIL is and remains connected to EVERY SIN.

IF you see any kind of logical reasonable way around these facts, please advise. I haven't found any way to avoid the conclusions here.



As stated prior, I have not been able to successfully extract the DEVIL from the SIN equations.

Is it the devil that repents for what we do? No...it is us, the one that sinned.

So says who? You? What makes me think you are not deceived in not bringing the OTHER PARTY to the table in these matters?

1 John 3:8
He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning.

IF you find a way to DISCONNECT the DEVIL in that equation, by all means let me know. As stated, I haven't found any way to logically DO THAT.

Those of us that sin are doing the works of the devil but that doesn't make us...the devil.

The point remains that the EVIL PRESENT with Paul did not evaporate, disappear or change. EVIL present remained WITH Paul no matter 'what' happened to Paul.


A. Sin cannot be logically disconnected from the DEVIL
B. The sin that transpires IN our minds and bodies IS OURS as it is IN US that it transpires. That still doesn't eradicate point A
C. Evil present remains with us at all times and is NOT changed one single WHIT by 'your' responsibility, whether active or passive EVIL. We have no way of 'measuring' INTERNAL ACTIONS OF EVIL in the MIND.



Read your own words. You openly promote that for that PARTICULAR SIN that your FATHER is going to burn you alive forever (or insert your favorite form of FEAR.) That is from YOUR MOUTH...your BRAIN. I'm just observing what YOU are saying and YOU ARE SAYING that you or 'other people' CAN AND/OR WILL be eternally condemned by that UNforgivable sin.

What? Please read what is written...and, not written by me.

Luke 12:10 And whosoever shall speak a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but unto him that blasphemeth against the Holy Ghost it shall not be forgiven.

That is something all of us need to deal with.

Well, you just got done spinning the story BOTH WAYS again. On one hand you say 'but I'm not condemning anyone' and in the very next statement you go on to present THE CONDEMNATION.

Is it me saying that I will not forgive someone?

But that is what EVERYONE claims. NOT me but GOD.

I say it is merely YOUR subjective reflections that are very very void of the FACTS OF THE DEVILS involvment in SIN.

You are led to see only the ELECT in these equations when in fact the ELECT do have EVIL PRESENT with them, that being of the DEVIL.

I know these facts do throw a wrench in the brain but they are the FACTS.


It will very much seem off kilter because DEALING with the FACTS will require you to MOVE your brain into TRUTH rather than that bizarre fantasy that God, your FATHER is going to burn you alive forever. You are in fact TRAPPED in that darkness. You may well NOT get out while in this present life. Even me sharing this with you WILL CAUSE EVIL PRESENT to tighten it's hold like the SNAKE that it is.

enjoy yer wrestling match...he is a worthy adversary!

squint

Where have you seen me say anyone will "burn alive forever?"

You have taken this topic into some strange realm. If you want to see Satan in everyone then be my guest. I don't.

The topic is the unforgiveable sin. There is one. I would imagine Satan would just love for us not to understand that sin....wouldn't you?

 

[squint]

Do you believe Jesus thought Peter was literally Satan as you do or that he was simply a man, a human, that needed to be rebuked..."He rebuked Peter."

I already said that Peter was not satan. And that Satan, an ENTIRELY DIFFERENT ENTITY than Peter was both IN Peter and SPEAKING THROUGH Peter.

Are you going to weigh in with an opinion here one way or another in the near future? The question set is very simple:

Peter was Satan
Peter was NOT Satan

Is it the devil that repents for what we do? No...it is us, the one that sinned.

So, PETER was SATAN...? And then SATAN was turned back into PETER upon repentence (insert your favorite formula of changing Satan back to Peter.)

Those of us that sin are doing the works of the devil but that doesn't make us...the devil.

So, there IS or IS NOT---> A DEVIL OTHER THAN you involved with SIN?

What? Please read what is written...and, not written by me.

And I'd ask you to spare me the 'not me but God' equation. What you claim is what you THINK you see, nothing more. It is YOUR reflection on the matter. Obviously your reflection may not contain the full summary of the entirety of 'reflections available' based on other 'facts' that 'others' may employ for 'reflections.'

Luke 12:10 And whosoever shall speak a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but unto him that blasphemeth against the Holy Ghost it shall not be forgiven.

That is something all of us need to deal with.

And that too. I have no dispute with ANY scripture and believe THE ENTIRETY of same, limited views as I may have to see same.

Is it me saying that I will not forgive someone?

I believe it says exactly what it says. But when you address the fact that YOU ALONE turn into SATAN or THE DEVIL then YOU will have to bear the entire brunt of what those statements say....

however...logic does dictate that IF there is more than ONE party involved in these matters, then THAT PARTY will by logic have to come into view to obtain a FULLER PICTURE of the matter.

Just because someone doesn't actually PLUNGE THE KNIFE into the heart of a murder victim DOESN'T MEAN they are not somehow IMPLICATED in a murder if there is EVIDENCE to IMPLICATE them...

Do you understand this line of reasoning?

Where have you seen me say anyone will "burn alive forever?"

I've said repeatedly that you are welcome to INSERT YOUR OWN FAVORITE FORM OF PUNISHMENT for that UNforgivable SIN...permanent annihilation/permanent separation/permanent DEATH---or any other you want to insert as yet you have to divulge.

You have taken this topic into some strange realm. If you want to see Satan in everyone then be my guest. I don't.

Like I said...I haven't found any way to DISCONNECT the DEVIL from sin. You can spin that however you please, but 1 John 3:8 is not going away on the basis of any kind of SPIN doctoring.

The topic is the unforgiveable sin. There is one. I would imagine Satan would just love for us not to understand that sin....wouldn't you?

Satan WHO? Satan YOU? IF you and you alone are THE DEVIL in the equation of SIN...then YES, you do have MUCH to fear.

But if the DEVIL is NOT YOU, then you should LOGICALLY and REASONABLY weigh in on how an ENTIRELY SEPARATE ENTITY weighs into this particular matter as THAT SIN is NOT disconnected from THE DEVIL.

s

 

[1whirlwind]

Have a good day Squint.

 

[annrobert]

The topic is the unforgiveable sin. There is one. I would imagine Satan would just love for us not to understand that sin....wouldn't you?

Understanding what the unforgivable sin is....., is not neccesary to salvation.
It does not apply in any way shape or form to anyone who comes to Jesus.
Since Jesus said all that the Father gives to Me will come to Me and he that cometh to Me I will in no wise cast out.

I do not see in the bible Jesus teaching long sermons on the unforgibable sin.
Jesus warned a few select people they were in danger of it.

The bulk of Jesus sermons were on love ,forgiveness mercy, compassion,visiting the sick,ministering to the maim
and lame and halt,
and praying for our enemies,
feeding the poor,
being like the good samaritan,
serving others,
loving God with all our heart soul and mind and our nieghbour as ourself.
Coming to Him with our troubles for rest
and trusting Him to meet our needs
and believing in Him .
Jesus ministry also consisted of delivering the oppressed and captive,
healing the broken hearted ,
healing peoples infirmities and sicknesses
and setting at liberty those who were bruised
and feeding the poor
and being moved with comapssion and showing mercy and forgivness.

His mentioning an unforfivable sin was only about a few select people in danger of it.

Jesus did not go around terrorizing the multitudes that they might get eternally damned if they accidentally did this and therefore must carefully examine every way they might be possible to do this and fret and worry.

This did not apply to the multitudes following Him and listening to Him and being healed and set free by Him.

It does not apply to us who have come to Him in any way either.
so why is it so important to understand what it is.

All this fretting and thinking we need to know and sermons on this has caused many sensitive people great trauma and they are finding it hard to get free from it.
Every time they hear yet another twist on what it might be,the fear and trauma they are going through convinces them they may have done that somehow,some way.

When Jesus said all sins and blaphemies shall be forgiven unto man,why not focus on that great promise.
When Jesus said verily verily I say unto you he that believeth on Me has everlasting life
why not focus on that,the promise is everlasting life.
When Jesus said this is the work of God that you believe on Him whom He has sent.Why not focus on that.
These are grat hope inspiring and faith inspiring promises.
The invitaion to come to Him for rest.
The promise to heal broken hearts and set at liberty the bruised.

I think Jesus wanted us to focus on these great promises.

He barely mentioned the other,and only in reference to some persistently hard hearted self righteous people who intentionally plotted against Him and openly slandered Him and refused forgiveness and mercy from Him.

Those of us who have come to Jesus are safe in His hand and none will snatch us out and we shall never perish.

Knowing precisely what this awful sin is is not neccesary to salvation.

 

[Giver]

[
Those of us who have come to Jesus are safe in His hand and none will snatch us out and we shall never perish.

Knowing precisely what this awful sin is is not neccesary to salvation.[/quote]
(Acts 4:19-20) “You must judge whether in God’s eyes it is right to listen to you and not to God. We cannot promise to stop proclaiming what we have seen and heard.”

(Acts 5:1-11) “There was another man, however, called Ananias. He and his wife, Sapphira, agreed to sell a property; but with his wife’s connivance he kept back part of the proceeds, and brought the rest and presented it to the apostles. Ananias, Peter said ‘now can Satan have so possessed you that you should lie to the Holy Spirit and keep back part of the money from the land? While you still owned the land, wasn’t it yours to keep, and after you had sold it wasn’t the money yours to do with as you liked? What put this scheme into your mind? It is not to men that you have lied, but to God. When he heard this Ananias fell down dead. This made a profound impression on everyone present. The younger men got up, wrapped the body in a sheet, carried it out and buried it.

About three hours later his wife came in, not knowing what had taken place. Peter challenged her, ‘Tell me was this the price you sold the land for? ‘Yes,’ she said ‘that was the price.’ Peter then said, ‘So you and your husband have agreed to put the Spirit of the Lord to the test! What made you do it? You hear those footsteps? They have just been to bury your husband; they will carry you out, too.’ Instantly she dropped dead at his feet. When the young men came in they found she was dead, and they carried her out and buried her by the side of her husband. This made a profound impression on the whole Church and on all who heard it.

 

[nephilimiyr]

The unforgiveable sin is rejection of Christ, the Holy Spirit. Nothing more, nothing less.

 

[Giver]

The unforgiveable sin is rejection of Christ, the Holy Spirit. Nothing more, nothing less.

(Hebrews 10:26-31) “If, after we have been given knowledge of the truth, we should deliberately commit any sins, then there is no longer any sacrifice for them. There is left only the dreadful prospect of judgment and of the fiery wrath that is to devour your enemies. Anyone who disregards the Law of Moses is ruthlessly put to death on the word of two witnesses or three; and you may be sure that anyone who tramples on the Son of God, and who treats the blood of the covenant which sanctified him as if it were not holy, and who insults the Spirit of grace, will be condemned to a far severer punishment. We are all aware who it was that said: Vengeance is mine; I will vindicate his people. It is a dreadful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.”

(Hebrews 6: 4) “As for those people who were once brought into the light, and tasted the gift from heaven, and received a share of the Holy Spirit, and appreciated the good message of God and the powers of the world to come and yet in spite of this have fallen away it is impossible for that to be renewed a second time. They cannot be repentant if they have willfully crucified the Son of God and openly mocked Him.”​

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(Matthew 7:21) “It is not those who say to me, ‘Lord, Lord’, who will enter the kingdom of Heaven but the person who does the will of My Father in Heaven. When the day comes many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, cast out demons in your name, work many miracles in your name?’ Then I shall tell them to their faces: I have never known you; away from me, you evil men!”

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(Matthew 25:31-46)"When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, he will sit on his throne in heavenly glory. All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. He will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left.

"Then the King will say to those on his right, 'Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.'
"Then the righteous will answer him, 'Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?'
"The King will reply, 'I tell you the truth, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers of mine, you did for me.'
"Then he will say to those on his left, 'Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.'
"They also will answer, 'Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?'
"He will reply, 'I tell you the truth, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.'

 

[1whirlwind]

Mark 3:29-30 But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation: Because they said, "He hath an unclean spirit."
​

The "they" saying that were scribes which said, "He hath Beelzebub, and by the prince of the devils casteth He out devils." [3:22] They attributed the Work of Jesus, casting out devils, to the works of Satan.

So...the unforgiveable sin is....placing Satan's power/works in place of that of Christ. Attributing the good things of Christ to that of anti-christ.