The Reality of Universal Salvation in Scripture (2)

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Floatingaxe

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Can you give me an example of these things that people see that would make them go, Oohh!, there is a God and here are His laws!

I seriously hope you are not talking about that rocks and trees thing!

Why not? We live in an amazing universe! Just look at this galaxy recently photographed at the outer limits of the known universe...

Look at the image in the center and tell me that Jesus Christ is not Lord and not known from His Creation!

bigbang-M-51whirlpool-galaxy-core-c.jpg


Look at this electron microscopic photograph of an ice crystal! Tell us that God doesn't loudly declare Himself in the infinitessimal as well as the infinite!

Snowcrystals.png
 
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firstborn888

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I don't make that call, nor do I have any certain idea about it. I do know that an eternal Hell is discussed in scripture, though, and God's righteous judgment knows what's just for each individual person. However, by that same measure, a God who would needlessly allow suffering for no greater good, when all people will rightly be allowed salvation in the end, is not only unjust, but completely inconsistent. Do I have any earthly idea what Hell is? Not really, although I know a few basic ideas about it that scripture serves to tell.

So 'hell' is a mystery? It seems like if God was going to send the masses there forever it should be a little more plainly spelled out, don't you think?

Actually, 'hell' in scripture is not so cut and dried as many would like to think. In fact, using the "h" word at all shows a degree of ignorance about the subject. The number one problem is that the English word 'hell' has no Hebrew or Greek counterpart(!!!).

There are some simple facts anyone can study and discover about the term 'hell' in scripture.

Four words are translated 'hell' in the KJV. Sheol, Hades (the Greek equivalent of Sheol) Geheena and Tartarus (Tartarus is only used once - by Jude).


One of the BIGGIST misconceptions about 'hell' is that it is a place of conscious torment at all, because 'Sheol' and it's Greek equivalent 'Hades' are used throughout scripture to denote the generic state of the dead, ie: "the grave" (as evidenced by it's free translation as either) and is NEVER used to denote a place of punishment except in one parable spoken by Jesus (more on that later). There are many passages throughout scripture stating that there is no consciousness or thought or knowledge in Sheol/Hades. That should be a big clue right there.

Job longs to go to 'Sheol' to escape his earthly sufferings. Jonah cries out from the belly of 'Sheol' (ie: he felt as good as dead!)
The good, the bad and the ugly ALL GO TO 'HELL' (Sheol/Hades) upon there death. Those who belong to Christ at his coming shall rise from 'Hades' (The grave - it's there - look it up) and death will be swallowed up in victory.

Then we have Geheena (also translated 'hell') - spoken of by Jesus 12 times on 8 occasions and never mentioned once by any original apostle of Christ (except once by James concerning the tongue). That should be another big clue. The 'judgment of Geheensa' (translated 'damnation of hell') has nothing to do with Sheol/Hades EXCEPT that the KJV translators chose to translate both 'hell'.

The simple fact that Sheol is translated (KJV) as 'the grave', 'the pit' and 'hell' is the biggest single source of confusion about this subject.

So, why would Jesus, contrary to ALL OTHER SCRIPTURE tell a parable about consciousness and torment in Sheol/Hades (rich man and Lazarus)?

There's a good reason for that and I hope some are curious to know. Ever notice how faith in God is never mentioned in that parable? Just that one had a good life and the other a bad life. Curious?

Why would theologians build an entire 'two compartments in Sheol/Hades' doctrine on one single passage that is contrary to all other descriptions of Sheol/Hades in scripture?

If anyone is eager or willing to come out of ignorance about the use of the word 'hell' in scripture, they may do so - as long as they can read or have someone read for them. Any reputable concordance will do. Please be aware, however, that the Strong's concordance (which I love) is (admittedly) written in conjunction with the KJV, so after the 'real' definition it will ALWAYS give the English word used by the KJV - no matter how far off it is (!) If you keep your brain engaged, it's easy to see the difference though.

If anyone uses the word 'hell' in this conversation it can only lead to ineffective communication as you are not stating whether you are referring to 'the grave' (Sheol/Hades) to the judgment of Geheena or to Tartarus.

Also note that the Greek 'Hades' automatically has a TON of Greek mythology attached to it. I would recommend only referencing the scriptural use of it's Hebrew counterpart 'Sheol" unless you want a definition filled with pagan Greek myths (not what we are after here, right?).

blessings,
- Byron
 
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