Ted Cruz to Obama: Don't give weapons to people who hate us

[Cocoafrost]

It's a repeat of history. Arming the rebels. Dictator of the day is using chemical weapons on his own people. America must don the mighty mouse cape and save the day.

Wars distract from corrupt domestic politics.

In Syria when our enemies are killing each other let them get on with it while our military and weapons stay at home.

 

[zoink]

Wonder what Mr. Cruz what have said to Pres. Reagan when he armed the predecessor of Al Qaeda in Afghanistan in the 1980's? Or the contras in Nicaragua? Or fill-in-the-blank of any number of proxy forces we have armed through the years....

He would have said "Yes sir, Mr. Reagan."

I've seen plenty of partisan hacks attempt to obfuscate current discussions by asserting hypocrisy between a statesman's positions over a long tenure in office, but resorting to insinuations of hypothetical hypocrisy while a person would have been in high school... That is a new one for me.

 

[Archaeopteryx]

I've seen plenty of partisan hacks attempt to obfuscate current discussions by asserting hypocrisy between a statesman's positions over a long tenure in office, but resorting to insinuations of hypothetical hypocrisy while a person would have been in high school... That is a new one for me.

We're not talking about him being in high school at the time though. We are talking about what he would say if a Republican were in office.

 

[zoink]

We're not talking about him being in high school at the time though. We are talking about what he would say if a Republican were in office.

Either way, you aren't even taking the time to cite actual instances of hypocrisy on the part of Mr. Cruz. He's a Republican, I wouldn't be surprised if there are a myriad of possibilities. Instead you and wing2000 resort to insinuations of hypothetical hypocrisy citing events that predominantly occurred while Mr. Cruz was in high school.

 

[Archaeopteryx]

Either way, you aren't even taking the time to cite actual instances of hypocrisy on the part of Mr. Cruz. He's a Republican, I wouldn't be surprised if there are a myriad of possibilities. Instead you and wing2000 resort to insinuations of hypothetical hypocrisy citing events that predominantly occurred while Mr. Cruz was in high school.

It's not the event that is being invoked, but the attitude. Perhaps Cruz would have had similar things to say about Reagan or any other Republican. We don't know. There isn't enough information to clarify that issue. I admit that I was cynical in my speculations regarding what Cruz might say had it been a Republican.

 

[zoink]

The American Constitution makes the American people sovereign for sure, and not the American government.

Would you define "sovereign" for me?

1
a : one possessing or held to possess supreme political power or sovereignty
b : one that exercises supreme authority within a limited sphere
c : an acknowledged leader : arbiter

Using dictionary definitions I do not see how American people are sovereign, nor how the Constitution of the United States makes the American people sovereign. The Constitution asserted that slaves be returned to their masters.

I do not see how an American person meets this criteria. Is there anything that an American person can hold allodial title over? It doesn't even seem that one holds such title over oneself under the Constitution of the United States. The courts have held that Article I, Section 8 allows for the enslavement of males between the ages of 18 and 35.

 

[Jeffwhosoever]

Solution. Find Assad, and fire one of these at him. No need to send M-16s to rebels. Fewer people die, war is quickly over.

 

[NightHawkeye]

Solution. Find Assad, and fire one of these at him. No need to send M-16s to rebels. Fewer people die, war is quickly over.

Or this ... Raytheon / Texas Instruments GBU-28 Bunker Buster

It's a proven war stopper. Two hours after the first GBU-28 was dropped on a bunker in Iraq, Saddam Hussein agreed to end the Gulf War.

 

[jgarden]

Ted Cruz to Obama: Don't give weapons to people who hate us

As usual conservatives use a broad brush to characterize everyone opposed to Assad as a tool of Al-Qaeda.

This is the same mindset that supported the Bush Administration's invasion based on existence of WMD.

Now that we have a Syrian dictator having borders with Israel and has actually used chemical weapons on his own people, the argument concerning WMD is reversed - America is now supposed to stand back and allow it to be used on a civilian population because a few of them might belong to Al-Qaeda!

 

[conamer]

Ted Cruz to Obama: Don't give weapons to people who hate us

As usual conservatives use a broad brush to characterize everyone opposed to Assad as a tool of Al-Qaeda.

This is the same mindset that supported the Bush Administration's invasion based on existence of WMD.

Now that we have a Syrian dictator having borders with Israel and has actually used chemical weapons on his own people, the argument concerning WMD is reversed - America is now supposed to stand back and allow it to be used on a civilian population because a few of them might belong to Al-Qaeda!

They are Al Qaeda. So why would you are the ones who rejoice in 9/11? I guess it's too complicated?

 

[jgarden]

They are Al Qaeda. So why would you are the ones who rejoice in 9/11? I guess it's too complicated?

The longer America procrastinates, the greater the influence Al-Qaeda will be able to exert because they are the ones with the combat experience and the weapons.

I'm sure not everyone who fought in the American Revolution was in favor of democracy and personal freedoms. Based on Cruz's approach, the American Revolution should have been dismissed because it contained some individuals whose motivations were suspect.

 

[conamer]

[BIBLE][/BIBLE]

The longer America procrastinates, the greater the influence Al-Qaeda will be able to exert because they are the ones with the combat experience and the weapons.

I'm sure not everyone who fought in the American Revolution was in favor of democracy and personal freedoms. Based on Cruz's approach, the American Revolution should have been dismissed because it contained some individuals whose motivations were suspect.

What a bunch on non-sense. You want to increase "the influence' of Al Qaeda.

 

[TerranceL]

Wonder what Mr. Cruz what have said to Pres. Reagan when he armed the predecessor of Al Qaeda in Afghanistan in the 1980's? Or the contras in Nicaragua? Or fill-in-the-blank of any number of proxy forces we have armed through the years....

Senator Ted Cruz

Ask him.

 

[jgarden]

[BIBLE][/BIBLE]

What a bunch on non-sense. You want to increase "the influence' of Al Qaeda.

Raw Video: Iraqi Journalist Throws Shoe at Bush - YouTube

 

[wing2000]

Mr Cruz will no doubt feign shock at learning this as well:

WASHINGTON — CIA operatives and U.S. special operations troops have been secretly training Syrian rebels with anti-tank and antiaircraft weapons since late last year, months before President Obama approved plans to begin directly arming them, according to U.S. officials and rebel commanders.

...and training the "people who hate us"

The training has involved fighters from the Free Syrian Army , a loose confederation of rebel groups that the Obama administration has promised to back with expanded military assistance, said a U.S. official, who discussed the effort anonymously because he was not authorized to disclose details.

U.S. has secretly provided arms training to Syria rebels since 2012 - latimes.com

 

[SolomonVII]

Would you define "sovereign" for me?Using dictionary definitions I do not see how American people are sovereign, nor how the Constitution of the United States makes the American people sovereign. The Constitution asserted that slaves be returned to their masters.

Certainly. With pleasure.
I will be very glad to define what sovereignty means in the American context.

Four score and seven years ago our fathers brought forth on this continent a new nation, conceived in liberty, and dedicated to the proposition that all men are created equal.
Now we are engaged in a great civil war, testing whether that nation, or any nation so conceived and so dedicated, can long endure. We are met on a great battlefield of that war. We have come to dedicate a portion of that field, as a final resting place for those who here gave their lives that that nation might live. It is altogether fitting and proper that we should do this.

But, in a larger sense, we can not dedicate, we can not consecrate, we can not hallow this ground. The brave men, living and dead, who struggled here, have consecrated it, far above our poor power to add or detract. The world will little note, nor long remember what we say here, but it can never forget what they did here. It is for us the living, rather, to be dedicated here to the unfinished work which they who fought here have thus far so nobly advanced. It is rather for us to be here dedicated to the great task remaining before us—that from these honored dead we take increased devotion to that cause for which they gave the last full measure of devotion—that we here highly resolve that these dead shall not have died in vain—that this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom—and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth.

Now that is the kind of definition of sovereignty that Republicans brought to the table.
God bless 'em for that.

 

[jgarden]

Ted Cruz to Obama: Don't give weapons to people who hate us

If the current revolt against fails, America's lack of support will be widely viewed as tacit support for Assad and the Russians.

A dozen years ago the possible use of WMD by Saddam was considered a "call to arms" by the Bush Administration - now conservatives have reversed their position and politicians like Cruz are willing to accept their use against Syrian civilians.

 

[SolomonVII]

The American position lacks intelligence and foresight. There was a time for Americans to lend their support to the forces of democracy in the Syrian movement, and that was when Syrian moderates still had a say in the movement.

Americans missed the boat on that, much like the boat was missed when Iranian democratic forces were rallying against the Iranian Islamists, and Obama chose to sit on his thumbs.

Yes, that means that the position of American leadership is being displaced in the ME, and that means that Russia has been given an opportunity to fill the void.

That is what it means to cede the position of world leadership, and to 'lead from behind', which is to say not to lead at all.

So much American blood and capital was spilled in securing Iraq, and all that blood and capital has been wasted as it has all been squandered by Obama through not ensuring that Iraq stayed in the American camp. Now the Iraqi skies are Iranian skies.

American people have decided that they do not want to be involved in the ME. That is what Obama campaigned on, and that is exactly why Iraqi is not a physical buffer between Syria and Iran, as it really should have been if the American administration had the foresight to maintain a real presence in Iraq.

Being a leader in this part of the world requires foresight, commitment and perseverance. When it comes to the ME, Americans have not been able to provide that leadership.


I supported the Iraqi campaign.
I was wrong to do so.
Americans have amply demonstrated that they do not have the will or the perseverance to maintain a victory in this part of the world. The people from the left to the libertarian right have spoken. They want out of their role of being the world leader that has led to American being despised globally.

Ergo, Yankee stay home. Not another drop of American blood to be spilled in this region is my wish.

 

[TerranceL]

Ted Cruz to Obama: Don't give weapons to people who hate us

If the current revolt against fails, America's lack of support will be widely viewed as tacit support for Assad and the Russians.

Well, fools will believe what they want.

A dozen years ago the possible use of WMD by Saddam was considered a "call to arms" by the Bush Administration - now conservatives have reversed their position and politicians like Cruz are willing to accept their use against Syrian civilians.

And a dozen years ago people who didn't want us to go to war because of possible use of WMD by Saddam are now championing us going to war because of possible use of WMD by Assad.

What a difference the party in power makes to a persons reasoning skills.

 

[wing2000]

Well, fools will believe what they want.

[/B]
And a dozen years ago people who didn't want us to go to war because of possible use of WMD by Saddam are now championing us going to war because of possible use of WMD by Assad.

What a difference the party in power makes to a persons reasoning skills.

For the record, I don't think we should be involved in Syria at all.

But in any case, arming and training proxy armies is more akin to the Reagan policy of the 1980's than the GWB policy of invasion and occupation.