Photo of teenage boy praying over homeless man in Baltimore goes viral

[civilwarbuff]

You've got the money to give street musicians "if they are good" -- "often quite a lot of money", but yet you "don't have the means to share a lot of time or money with the homeless".

That's a contradiction, and a direct one. It's also called being a respecter of persons (something the Bible condemns heavily). You pay musicians "if they are good" -- IE, if they please you -- but yet a homeless man who has nothing to offer you, you have nothing to give to them.

Matthew 21:41-45:

41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:
42 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink:
43 I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.
44 Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?
45 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.

Even if you don't believe in Christianity, this basically covers the concept of Karma that even non-believers usually have some sort of belief in.

Well said....

 

[Nithavela]

That is a cop out......

No it isn't, and you saying it is doesn't make it so.

Also, I live in a country where homeless people can get support and a place to live, food to eat and clothes to wear, all by the social net of the state. Most homeless people become homeless because of their own fault, or at least their own inability to take advantage of the help offered by the state.

 

[Nithavela]

You've got the money to give street musicians "if they are good" -- "often quite a lot of money", but yet you "don't have the means to share a lot of time or money with the homeless".

That's a contradiction, and a direct one. It's also called being a respecter of persons (something the Bible condemns heavily). You pay musicians "if they are good" -- IE, if they please you -- but yet a homeless man who has nothing to offer you, you have nothing to give to them.

Matthew 21:41-45:

41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:
42 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink:
43 I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.
44 Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?
45 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.

Even if you don't believe in Christianity, this basically covers the concept of Karma that even non-believers usually have some sort of belief in.

I don't believe in Karma. The world is not automatically good to you because of you being good to the world. That's magical thinking and nothing else.

And why should I not treat people who display some talent and drive better than those who just sit around with a written on cardboard sign, and who could get the means to live from the state if they just took advantage of them?

 

[civilwarbuff]

No it isn't, and you saying it is doesn't make it so.

Also, I live in a country where homeless people can get support and a place to live, food to eat and clothes to wear, all by the social net of the state. Most homeless people become homeless because of their own fault, or at least their own inability to take advantage of the help offered by the state.

How do you know that helping some homeless person will not have a positive effecto on their life? Can you see the future so you know that? Or is it what you want to believe only to assuage your own feelings for turning your back and walking away?

 

[Nithavela]

How do you know that helping some homeless person will not have a positive effecto on their life? Can you see the future so you know that? Or is it what you want to believe only to assuage your own feelings for turning your back and walking away?

I of course can't know that. Maybe they would use the money I gave them to get a shave and finally find a job. mabye they would buy themselves a MacDonalds meal and be sated for a few hours. Maybe they would buy themselves a cheap beer or some drugs.

You're correct, I can't see into other people's heads or into the future. So I either have to give to everyone indiscriminately (which I can't do, because I don't have the money), or I have to give to some at random (which I don't think is any better), or I have to set some sort of discriminating factor to help me decide. Like, are they doing anything that I find pleasing and worthy of giving money to, instead of just sitting there with a cardboard sign.

You don't have to agree with this way of doing things, but I think it is at least not illogical.

 

[Xalith]

I don't believe in Karma. The world is not automatically good to you because of you being good to the world. That's magical thinking and nothing else.

And why should I not treat people who display some talent and drive better than those who just sit around with a written on cardboard sign, and who could get the means to live from the state if they just took advantage of them?

Karma is the idea that you get what you give, and in some ways that can actually be true. If you're known to be a jerk who never helps anybody out, then people are going to be less likely to help you when you are in need yourself.

If you've made a reputation of yourself of being a nice, kind person... then when something bad happens to you, more people that you know (and your friend list would surely be bigger!) would be more willing to help you in return.

That's common sense logic.

Now, obviously helping every homeless guy you see lying around isn't going to fill your inner circle with rich and powerful people, but yet every little bit helps. As for "who could get the means to live from the state if they just took advantage of them?", Welfare does not work like you think it works.

The people who REALLY need welfare are oftentimes denied in favor of people who are taking advantage of it when they either don't need it, or they're relying on it instead of doing what they should be doing. Welfare is a messed up system that is often abused by the wrong people, and persecutes the right people. You see lots of drug addict single mothers on welfare who pop out more babies to increase their monthly welfare allowances, but yet you'll see a homeless guy get denied because he has no job at all and no ability to get a job.

You can't look at a homeless guy and say "If he'd just walk down to the welfare office, he'd have everything he needs!"

If that's how welfare truly worked, there wouldn't BE anybody living on the streets in the first place. The government isn't some magical entity that can hand out as much money as it wants to anybody who wants it. If that were so, we'd all be Donald Trump.

 

[Nithavela]

Actually, that IS pretty much how wellfare works in Germany. Nobody can be denied wellfare over here. They can only not accept it, for whatever reasons.

I don't think that you get what you give. The things you just wrote only underscore the need for good publicity, not for good deeds.

Also, I'd really like for this thread to stop being about me. Can we do that? Please? It's off topic and I don't desire to defend my actions, any more. I think I've laid them out well enough.

 

[civilwarbuff]

I of course can't know that. Maybe they would use the money I gave them to get a shave and finally find a job. mabye they would buy themselves a MacDonalds meal and be sated for a few hours. Maybe they would buy themselves a cheap beer or some drugs.

You're correct, I can't see into other people's heads or into the future. So I either have to give to everyone indiscriminately (which I can't do, because I don't have the money), or I have to give to some at random (which I don't think is any better), or I have to set some sort of discriminating factor to help me decide. Like, are they doing anything that I find pleasing and worthy of giving money to, instead of just sitting there with a cardboard sign.

You don't have to agree with this way of doing things, but I think it is at least not illogical.

But you have not looked at helping anyone in a logical way?

 

[Nithavela]

But you have not looked at helping anyone in a logical way?

I see that you still want to make this thread about me.

I shall now leave it and not return.

 

[civilwarbuff]

Post #116...

 

[civilwarbuff]

If you don't want it to be about you, don't make it about you.....common sense.....

 

[Xalith]

Post #116...

Yeah, that was just ridiculous. He manages to contradict himself in a two-line post, somehow, and expects people to not talk about it.

 

[PsychoeDial]

I see that you still want to make this thread about me.

I shall now leave it and not return.

Thank you.

 

[civilwarbuff]

How much is 10 euros.....about 12 bucks? I was going to ask him if he thought that 12 bucks could affect someones life if it could buy 1200 meals.....wonder if he still would have blown us off....?

 

[civilwarbuff]

Yeah, that was just ridiculous. He manages to contradict himself in a two-line post, somehow, and expects people to not talk about it.

I think he was getting scared. I wonder if there is not something that is eating at him, bothering him, prodding him and he is afraid to confront it.....sometimes that is how the Holy Spirit works.....

 

[Tiny Bible]

That is beautiful. State governments need to do more for the homeless. Rather than as some local governments have done or possibly still have enforced, making it illegal in a sense to be homeless in a particular county. Officials round up the so called offenders and drop them off across the county line where such a law doesn't exist. Making them someone elses problem.

That and making it illegal to feed them is also a problem. When did America lose its grace?
God bless that young man and the homeless gentleman too. May prayers be answered so that they are both healthy and whole with a home, food, security, and health.

 

[civilwarbuff]

That is beautiful. State governments need to do more for the homeless. Rather than as some local governments have done or possibly still have enforced, making it illegal in a sense to be homeless in a particular county. Officials round up the so called offenders and drop them off across the county line where such a law doesn't exist. Making them someone elses problem.

That and making it illegal to feed them is also a problem. When did America lose its grace?
God bless that young man and the homeless gentleman too. May prayers be answered so that they are both healthy and whole with a home, food, security, and health.

Rather than just depending on government, how about digging into your own pocket?.....and encouraging your friends and fellow church members to do the same?

 

[Tiny Bible]

Rather than just depending on government, how about digging into your own pocket?.....and encouraging your friends and fellow church members to do the same?

What do you and your church do for the homeless out of your own pockets?

 

[Xalith]

Rather than just depending on government, how about digging into your own pocket?.....and encouraging your friends and fellow church members to do the same?

^^
I agree with this.

I find this verse relevant:

James 2:16: And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?

What do you and your church do for the homeless out of your own pockets?

This isn't supposed to be a "holier than thou" race, and I don't know about @civilwarbuff , but I can personally say that I have, in fact, donated money out of my pocket to homeless people. Not directly, but through a nonprofit ministry. I live in a rural area and I don't encounter homeless people in my life.

 

[TerranceL]

Oh I would never refuse employment for religious reasons.. I never even used to ask or care what religion someone was..

Placing your hand on an unconscious person without their consent, and for your own personal reasons (such as to pray), is not only offensive and insulting, it could also be considered assault.

Citation needed.