ONE OF THE MOST DANGEROUS SUBJECT , BAPTISM !!

[Diamond7]

I say that because many are depending on WATER BAPTISM to save them . period .

I left the Baptist Church because they would not Baptize my son because he had not attended enough of their Sunday school to be indoctronated into their way of thinking. I went to a church that would Baptize him. Where the whole church makes a commitment to do what they can to raise him as a Christian. When people are old enough they can join the church and some people get this confused with baptism.

 

[Jan001]

Does your Acts 19:5 say WATER // HUDOR and why are you ADDING to the word of God ??

Verse 6 says how they were BAPTIZED and when Paul laid his hands upon them the HOLY SPIRIT came Upon them and theyb were speaking in languages and were prophesying , just as the Israel did at PENTECOST .

Verse 2 explains , since having believed , did you receive HOLY SPIRIT , But we did not hear WHETHER there is a HOLY SPIRIT

There was NO WATER in verse 5 AT ALL !!

dan p

This receiving of the Holy Spirit by Paul's laying on of hands is not the same as the initial receiving the Holy Spirit during water baptism as commanded by Jesus Christ in Matthew 28:18-19. These are two different manifestations of the Holy Spirit.

This baptism of the Holy Spirit by Paul's laying of hands upon them is by fire. This laying on of hands by an apostle imparts an additional measure of the Holy Spirit's graces to the person. This fire of the Holy Spirit is normally given to him after he has initially received the Holy Spirit's presence within him through his water baptism. However, God can impart the Holy Spirit's graces to persons whenever and however He desires.

Acts 19 And it happened, while Apollos was at Corinth, that Paul, having passed through the upper regions, came to Ephesus. And finding some disciples 2 he said to them, “Did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?” So they said to him, “We have not so much as heard whether there is a Holy Spirit.” 3 And he said to them, “Into what then were you baptized?” So they said, “Into John’s baptism.”

John's baptism with water was a baptism to publicly show that a person had repented of his sins. This water baptism did not forgive sins.

4 Then Paul said, “John indeed baptized with a baptism of repentance, saying to the people that they should believe on Him who would come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.” 5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.

This water baptism in the name of Jesus as commanded in Matthew 28:18-19 did forgive Adam's sin and it did forgive all of their own sins on their souls at the time they received this water baptism of Jesus.

6 And when Paul had laid hands on them, the Holy Spirit came upon them, and they spoke with tongues and prophesied. 7 Now the men were about twelve in all.

This manifestation/baptism of the Holy Spirit is not given by water. Acts 1:4-5 It is given like the tongues of fire that were seen by the apostles at Pentecost but it is not visible tongues of fire like theirs was. The Holy Spirit imparts His graces in differing measures to people depending on what God has called each one of them to do. The apostles received a different measure of graces than I received. Their measure of graces was much greater than mine.

The water baptism of Jesus and the initial giving of the Holy Spirit as commanded by Jesus in Matthew 28:18-19 forgives our sins and makes us His disciples. Acts 2:38

The baptism of the Holy Spirit that is given to us by the invisible tongues of fire makes us soldiers for Jesus Christ if we do the following:

Ephesians 6:10-20

Finally, my brethren, be strong in the Lord and in the power of His might. 11 Put on the whole armor of God, that you may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil. 12 For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this age, against spiritual hosts of wickedness in the heavenly places. 13 Therefore take up the whole armor of God, that you may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand.

14 Stand therefore, having girded your waist with truth, having put on the breastplate of righteousness, 15 and having shod your feet with the preparation of the gospel of peace; 16 above all, taking the shield of faith with which you will be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked one. 17 And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God; 18 praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, being watchful to this end with all perseverance and supplication for all the saints— 19 and for me, that utterance may be given to me, that I may open my mouth boldly to make known the mystery of the gospel, 20 for which I am an ambassador in chains; that in it I may speak boldly, as I ought to speak.

I am moving on now to post in a thread about the ?rapture?.

 

[Dan Perez]

This receiving of the Holy Spirit by Paul's laying on of hands is not the same as the initial receiving the Holy Spirit during water baptism as commanded by Jesus Christ in Matthew 28:18-19. These are two different manifestations of the Holy Spirit.

This baptism of the Holy Spirit by Paul's laying of hands upon them is by fire. This laying on of hands by an apostle imparts an additional measure of the Holy Spirit's graces to the person. This fire of the Holy Spirit is normally given to him after he has initially received the Holy Spirit's presence within him through his water baptism. However, God can impart the Holy Spirit's graces to persons whenever and however He desires.

Acts 19 And it happened, while Apollos was at Corinth, that Paul, having passed through the upper regions, came to Ephesus. And finding some disciples 2 he said to them, “Did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?” So they said to him, “We have not so much as heard whether there is a Holy Spirit.” 3 And he said to them, “Into what then were you baptized?” So they said, “Into John’s baptism.”

John's baptism with water was a baptism to publicly show that a person had repented of his sins. This water baptism did not forgive sins.

4 Then Paul said, “John indeed baptized with a baptism of repentance, saying to the people that they should believe on Him who would come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.” 5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.

This water baptism in the name of Jesus as commanded in Matthew 28:18-19 did forgive Adam's sin and it did forgive all of their own sins on their souls at the time they received this water baptism of Jesus.

6 And when Paul had laid hands on them, the Holy Spirit came upon them, and they spoke with tongues and prophesied. 7 Now the men were about twelve in all.

This manifestation/baptism of the Holy Spirit is not given by water. Acts 1:4-5 It is given like the tongues of fire that were seen by the apostles at Pentecost but it is not visible tongues of fire like theirs was. The Holy Spirit imparts His graces in differing measures to people depending on what God has called each one of them to do. The apostles received a different measure of graces than I received. Their measure of graces was much greater than mine.

The water baptism of Jesus and the initial giving of the Holy Spirit as commanded by Jesus in Matthew 28:18-19 forgives our sins and makes us His disciples. Acts 2:38

The baptism of the Holy Spirit that is given to us by the invisible tongues of fire makes us soldiers for Jesus Christ if we do the following:

Ephesians 6:10-20

Finally, my brethren, be strong in the Lord and in the power of His might. 11 Put on the whole armor of God, that you may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil. 12 For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this age, against spiritual hosts of wickedness in the heavenly places. 13 Therefore take up the whole armor of God, that you may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand.

14 Stand therefore, having girded your waist with truth, having put on the breastplate of righteousness, 15 and having shod your feet with the preparation of the gospel of peace; 16 above all, taking the shield of faith with which you will be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked one. 17 And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God; 18 praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, being watchful to this end with all perseverance and supplication for all the saints— 19 and for me, that utterance may be given to me, that I may open my mouth boldly to make known the mystery of the gospel, 20 for which I am an ambassador in chains; that in it I may speak boldly, as I ought to speak.

I am moving on now to post in a thread about the ?rapture?.

You have given me questions and will take more time to answer them at one seating ,

# 1 If you believe in WATER BAPTISM and in Acts 1:5 All will agree that John did BAPTIZE with Water // HUDOR , why , because it says John Baptized with WATER , do you AGREE .

#2 So did the Holy Spirit with WATER // HUDOR , you know it was not water because the Greek word HUDOR was not used at ALL , do you agree ???

#3 In 1 Cor 10:2 they were BAPTIZED UNTO Moses unto the Cloud unto the SEA .

#4 And do you see the Greek WATER // HUDOR here at all , do you agree or disagree >

In Luke 16:24 youb hve the Greek word DIP // BAPTO is probably get the word Immerse .

Then in Heb 9:13 and in Eze 36:24 you find the Heb word SPRINKLE // RHANTIZO

Then is Eph 4:5 you find the Greek word BAPTISMA also found 22 times from Matthew through 1 Peter 3:21

Then in Rom 6:4 you find the Greek word BAPTISM , which in the Greek text is really BAPTISMA , which really means PLACING .

Always glad to answer any question you may have .

dan p

 

[Jan001]

# 1 If you believe in WATER BAPTISM and in Acts 1:5 All will agree that John did BAPTIZE with Water // HUDOR , why , because it says John Baptized with WATER , do you AGREE .

Acts 1:5 for John truly baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now.”

John's water baptism was a person's public announcement that he had repented of his sins. John's water baptism did not forgive sins. Jesus had not yet been sacrificed so this water baptism could not forgive sins. Also, this water baptism was not done as Jesus commanded in Matthew 28:18-19 because Jesus gave this commandment after He rose from the dead. John baptized people before Jesus rose from the dead. John died before Jesus died on the cross. John's baptism did not forgive sins.

#2 So did the Holy Spirit with WATER // HUDOR , you know it was not water because the Greek word HUDOR was not used at ALL , do you agree ???

This is about the laying on of hands by the apostles which is the Baptism of the holy Spirit with fire. Acts 8:17 These are invisible tongues of fire. It seems only the apostles were chosen on that first Pentecost Sunday to receive the visible tongues of fire directly from God.

#3 In 1 Cor 10:2 they were BAPTIZED UNTO Moses unto the Cloud unto the SEA .

#4 And do you see the Greek WATER // HUDOR here at all , do you agree or disagree >

The sea is made of water. The Red Sea drowned all the Egyptians so the Israelites were saved by the water of the Red Sea. This water did not forgive their sins.

You are perhaps overthinking about this subject.

The baptism commanded by Jesus is the water baptism which forgives Adam's sin (we were born with his sin on our souls). None of the other baptisms forgives Adam's sin. The blessed water of this baptism of Jesus is the conduit by which the blood merits of Jesus' sacrifice are applied to our souls and this baptism is what washes away Adam's sin and our sins and so it is this water baptism which initially saves us. Acts 22:16

God does not have to follow the commands that He gave to His Church leaders but God's Church leaders do have to follow His commands. That is why even though some Gentiles received the Holy Spirit before they were water baptized Acts 10:47, they still were required to be water baptized according to Jesus' command in Matthew 28:18-19.

 

[Dan Perez]

Acts 1:5 for John truly baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now.”

John's water baptism was a person's public announcement that he had repented of his sins. John's water baptism did not forgive sins. Jesus had not yet been sacrificed so this water baptism could not forgive sins. Also, this water baptism was not done as Jesus commanded in Matthew 28:18-19 because Jesus gave this commandment after He rose from the dead. John baptized people before Jesus rose from the dead. John died before Jesus died on the cross. John's baptism did not forgive sins.

This is about the laying on of hands by the apostles which is the Baptism of the holy Spirit with fire. Acts 8:17 These are invisible tongues of fire. It seems only the apostles were chosen on that first Pentecost Sunday to receive the visible tongues of fire directly from God.

The sea is made of water. The Red Sea drowned all the Egyptians so the Israelites were saved by the water of the Red Sea. This water did not forgive their sins.

You are perhaps overthinking about this subject.

The baptism commanded by Jesus is the water baptism which forgives Adam's sin (we were born with his sin on our souls). None of the other baptisms forgives Adam's sin. The blessed water of this baptism of Jesus is the conduit by which the blood merits of Jesus' sacrifice are applied to our souls and this baptism is what washes away Adam's sin and our sins and so it is this water baptism which initially saves us. Acts 22:16

God does not have to follow the commands that He gave to His Church leaders but God's Church leaders do have to follow His commands. That is why even though some Gentiles received the Holy Spirit before they were water baptized Acts 10:47, they still were required to be water baptized according to Jesus' command in Matthew 28:18-19.

And you disagree how all were BAPTIZED uno Moses and all can read my OP and your answer and decide for them self and here is just one more in Rom 6:3 Or are you IGNORANT , that as many were BAPTIZED into Christ were BAPTIZED into hid death .

How can anyone that reads Rom 6:3 say it means WATER // HODUR ?

How can WATER BAPTISM place into his DEATH ?

dan p

 

[Jan001]

And you disagree how all were BAPTIZED uno Moses and all can read my OP and your answer and decide for them self and here is just one more in Rom 6:3 Or are you IGNORANT , that as many were BAPTIZED into Christ were BAPTIZED into hid death .

How can anyone that reads Rom 6:3 say it means WATER // HODUR ?

How can WATER BAPTISM place into his DEATH ?

dan p

When we are baptized by the water baptism commanded by Jesus Christ in Matthew 28:18-19, we receive salvation because of Jesus' blood sacrifice (His death on the cross). Through this water baptism of Jesus, the Holy Spirit applies the merits of the blood of Jesus' sacrifice to our souls. It is this application of the blood of Jesus to our souls which forgives Adam's sin and forgives our own sins (the sins on our souls at the time of this baptism). The shedding of blood forgives sins. Hebrews 9:22


Romans 6:4 Therefore we were buried with him by baptism into death, so that just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, so also we might walk in newness of life. Acts 22:16

Colossians 2:11-13 In Him you were also circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, by putting off the body of the sins of the flesh, by the circumcision of Christ, 12 buried with Him in baptism, in which you also were raised with Him through faith in the working of God, who raised Him from the dead. 13 And you, being dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He has made alive together with Him, having forgiven you all trespasses,

The water baptism commanded by Jesus is this: Ephesians 5:26 that He might sanctify and cleanse her with the washing of water by the word,

This is my understanding.
You are free to have your own understanding.

 

[Dan Perez]

When we are baptized by the water baptism commanded by Jesus Christ in Matthew 28:18-19, we receive salvation because of Jesus' blood sacrifice (His death on the cross). Through this water baptism of Jesus, the Holy Spirit applies the merits of the blood of Jesus' sacrifice to our souls. It is this application of the blood of Jesus to our souls which forgives Adam's sin and forgives our own sins (the sins on our souls at the time of this baptism). The shedding of blood forgives sins. Hebrews 9:22


Romans 6:4 Therefore we were buried with him by baptism into death, so that just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, so also we might walk in newness of life. Acts 22:16

Colossians 2:11-13 In Him you were also circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, by putting off the body of the sins of the flesh, by the circumcision of Christ, 12 buried with Him in baptism, in which you also were raised with Him through faith in the working of God, who raised Him from the dead. 13 And you, being dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He has made alive together with Him, having forgiven you all trespasses,

The water baptism commanded by Jesus is this: Ephesians 5:26 that He might sanctify and cleanse her with the washing of water by the word,

This is my understanding.
You are free to have your own understanding and always keep to , 2 Tim 2:15

I see you quote Rom 6:4 in if you were to check the Greek text it will read ,like this !!

Therefore , we were buried together with him , through this BAPTISMA >

The Greek text blew it by translating it BAPTISM ?

Since all do not believe me , here is how to check the Greek text ?

Google BLUE LETTER BIBLE or google BIBLE HUB and SEE and do not believe me at ALL !!

dan p

 

[Jan001]

I see you quote Rom 6:4 in if you were to check the Greek text it will read ,like this !!

Therefore , we were buried together with him , through this BAPTISMA >

The Greek text blew it by translating it BAPTISM ?

Since all do not believe me , here is how to check the Greek text ?

Google BLUE LETTER BIBLE or google BIBLE HUB and SEE and do not believe me at ALL !!

dan p

There is only one baptism which forgives Adam's sin on our souls. Romans 5:8-17 This baptism also forgives all of our own sins that are present on our souls at the time of our baptism. This baptism that Jesus commanded saves us because of Jesus' sacrificial death on the cross, His burial, and His resurrection from the dead. This baptism (Romans 6:4) is the water baptism as commanded by Jesus in Matthew 28:18-19.
See also Ephesians 5:25-27, Acts 22:16

When we are water baptized as Jesus commanded, it is as if we die, are buried, and rise from the dead in imitation of Jesus. We die to our old sinful desires when our sins are forgiven by this water baptism and these sins are remembered no more (buried), and we are born anew (born again to a new spiritual life in Christ Jesus) which means that we become God's adopted children. John 3:3-8

 

[Dan Perez]

This receiving of the Holy Spirit by Paul's laying on of hands is not the same as the initial receiving the Holy Spirit during water baptism as commanded by Jesus Christ in Matthew 28:18-19. These are two different manifestations of the Holy Spirit.

This baptism of the Holy Spirit by Paul's laying of hands upon them is by fire. This laying on of hands by an apostle imparts an additional measure of the Holy Spirit's graces to the person. This fire of the Holy Spirit is normally given to him after he has initially received the Holy Spirit's presence within him through his water baptism. However, God can impart the Holy Spirit's graces to persons whenever and however He desires.

Acts 19 And it happened, while Apollos was at Corinth, that Paul, having passed through the upper regions, came to Ephesus. And finding some disciples 2 he said to them, “Did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?” So they said to him, “We have not so much as heard whether there is a Holy Spirit.” 3 And he said to them, “Into what then were you baptized?” So they said, “Into John’s baptism.”

John's baptism with water was a baptism to publicly show that a person had repented of his sins. This water baptism did not forgive sins.

4 Then Paul said, “John indeed baptized with a baptism of repentance, saying to the people that they should believe on Him who would come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.” 5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.

This water baptism in the name of Jesus as commanded in Matthew 28:18-19 did forgive Adam's sin and it did forgive all of their own sins on their souls at the time they received this water baptism of Jesus.

6 And when Paul had laid hands on them, the Holy Spirit came upon them, and they spoke with tongues and prophesied. 7 Now the men were about twelve in all.

This manifestation/baptism of the Holy Spirit is not given by water. Acts 1:4-5 It is given like the tongues of fire that were seen by the apostles at Pentecost but it is not visible tongues of fire like theirs was. The Holy Spirit imparts His graces in differing measures to people depending on what God has called each one of them to do. The apostles received a different measure of graces than I received. Their measure of graces was much greater than mine.

The water baptism of Jesus and the initial giving of the Holy Spirit as commanded by Jesus in Matthew 28:18-19 forgives our sins and makes us His disciples. Acts 2:38

The baptism of the Holy Spirit that is given to us by the invisible tongues of fire makes us soldiers for Jesus Christ if we do the following:

Ephesians 6:10-20

Finally, my brethren, be strong in the Lord and in the power of His might. 11 Put on the whole armor of God, that you may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil. 12 For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this age, against spiritual hosts of wickedness in the heavenly places. 13 Therefore take up the whole armor of God, that you may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand.

14 Stand therefore, having girded your waist with truth, having put on the breastplate of righteousness, 15 and having shod your feet with the preparation of the gospel of peace; 16 above all, taking the shield of faith with which you will be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked one. 17 And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God; 18 praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, being watchful to this end with all perseverance and supplication for all the saints— 19 and for me, that utterance may be given to me, that I may open my mouth boldly to make known the mystery of the gospel, 20 for which I am an ambassador in chains; that in it I may speak boldly, as I ought to speak.

I am moving on now to post in a thread about the ?rapture?.

# 1 Fire in the bible means JUDGMENT !

#2 And in Matt 28:19 does NOT and will never use the Greek word WATER // HUDOR and no one can prove otherwise '

#3 Verse 19 the apostles were to BAPTIZING them in the name of the Father , and of the Son and of the HOLY SPIRIT so when did the apostles do that command , NEVER !!

#4 The next Greek word is 0F THE // HO is a Greek owed that is pointing to the next words , Holy Spirit .

$5 Holy // AGIOS , is in the GENTIVE CASE , and in the SINGULAR , and the GENTIVE CASE which means it is Descriptive and in the Greek SINGULAR .

#6 SPIRIT // PNEUMA is in the ACCUSATIVE CASE and is means that this verse in Matthew 28:19 is in the Greek SINGULAE and will happen jus ONE TIME .

# 7 Alll the Greek words , OF THE , and HOLY and SPIRIT are all a one TIME EVENT .

#8 The apostles NEVER acc0mplished the so-called GREAT COMMISSION . PERIOD !!

dan p

 

[Jan001]

Time for me to move on.

 

[Dan Perez]

Time for me to move on.

Sorry about that and will always give what I see , by the context what the bible is really saying , so do not be discouraged !!

dan p