Is homosexuality wrong in Christainity?

[John Pearce]

I can't see anywhere in the Bible that states homosexuality is wrong? I think its unfair that people who r gay cannot be treated equally? I am a hardcore left-winger, so you guys better have a good explaination...? If it is the word of God, well then, maybe homosexuality is just a state of mind, but I believe its genetic.

 

[12volt_man]

I can't see anywhere in the Bible that states homosexuality is wrong?

May I ask which part of the Bible you've studied?

If it is the word of God, well then, maybe homosexuality is just a state of mind, but I believe its genetic.

OK. Let's go with the theory that homosexuality is genetic.

If homosexuality is genetic, then how is it being passed on to the next generation since people who have that trait, by nature, don't reproduce?

If homosexuality were genetic, it would have died out long ago.

 

[Whitestone]

There are two main reasons against homosexuality in the bible.

1) God finds it detestable.

Lev 20:13 If a man lies with a man as one lies with a woman both of them have done what is detestable. They must be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads.

2) Any sexual relations outside marriage is sin. Since two people of the same sex cannot marry, they can never have sexual relations in a way that is not sinful.

Hope this helps,

Whitestone

 

[seebs]

This is probably not the best forum for this question. To answer your question, there's a three-way split on the issue. Some Christians believe homosexuality to be immoral. Some believe homosexuality to be non-volitional, and homosexual sex to be immoral; essentially, they view homosexuality as an inclination to a given sin, similar to a predisposition to alcoholism. Some don't see either as sinful. Many people hold positions which are odd hybrids of the above.

To answer a side question, there are many genetic traits which can be very hard to pass on; sickle-cell anemia is genetic, for instance, and very often prevents people from reproducing. However, people who have only half the genes for sickle-cell anemia are totally immune to malaria, so in regions where malaria kills a lot of people, having some of those genes is enough of an advantage to offset losing one kid in four to sickle-cell anemia. Note also that some gay people do reproduce, for various reasons. For homosexuality to be genetic and still exist, it must either have some indirect benefits, or be associated with something which has benefits. These theories have been explored at some length by researchers attempting to explain homosexuality in other species.

The question is only marginally relevant; people can be genetically predisposed to immoral behavior.

 

[12volt_man]

There are two main reasons against homosexuality in the bible.

1) God finds it detestable.

Lev 20:13 If a man lies with a man as one lies with a woman both of them have done what is detestable. They must be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads.

2) Any sexual relations outside marriage is sin. Since two people of the same sex cannot marry, they can never have sexual relations in a way that is not sinful.

Hope this helps,

Whitestone

I roll my eyes as much as the next guy when somebody says, "God created Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve" (hey, that's pretty clever. You come up with that all by yourself?) but the truth is, God created marruage the way He did for a reason.

In addition to the two you mentioned, remember also that the family is the first institution ordained by God, long before the institutions of civil government or even the church.

Marriage is an example of hierarchy like that found in both the Trinity and of the church.

 

[John Pearce]

Would you say then, that it is ok if a homosexual person is (obviosly) gay, but does not have relations with another man? I mean, surely they cannot help it? I used to think that I might be Bi-sexual due to a psychological thing that happened when i was a kid, now that im a little older and wiser I know that I am not, but one of friends is gay, and he is a Christian.

 

[Rafael]

Would you say then, that it is ok if a homosexual person is (obviosly) gay, but does not have relations with another man? I mean, surely they cannot help it? I used to think that I might be Bi-sexual due to a psychological thing that happened when i was a kid, now that im a little older and wiser I know that I am not, but one of friends is gay, and he is a Christian.

We all have to practice self-control over the flesh whether our burden or particular sin is homosexuality or any other sin. We have to turn from our sin and God will give us the grace power to overcome them. We all have the same battle in common with the flesh that passes away with its sexuality. These bodies are only temporary dwelling places for our spirits and the Holy Spirit.
The Bible is very plain about homsexual sin as being displeasing to God as is greed, anger, fornication......and the list of the works of the flesh.

Gal. 5:17 The old sinful nature loves to do evil, which is just opposite from what the Holy Spirit wants. And the Spirit gives us desires that are opposite from what the sinful nature desires. These two forces are constantly fighting each other, and your choices are never free from this conflict

19 When you follow the desires of your sinful nature, your lives will produce these evil results: sexual immorality, impure thoughts, eagerness for lustful pleasure,
20 idolatry, participation in demonic activities, hostility, quarreling, jealousy, outbursts of anger, selfish ambition, divisions, the feeling that everyone is wrong except those in your own little group,
21 envy, drunkenness, wild parties, and other kinds of sin. Let me tell you again, as I have before, that anyone living that sort of life will not inherit the Kingdom of God.

Re 12:11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.

 

[klewlis]

Would you say then, that it is ok if a homosexual person is (obviosly) gay, but does not have relations with another man? I mean, surely they cannot help it? I used to think that I might be Bi-sexual due to a psychological thing that happened when i was a kid, now that im a little older and wiser I know that I am not, but one of friends is gay, and he is a Christian.

Most rational Christians would say that if there are in fact cases where the homosexual tendency is genetic (and it seems that there are), then yes, it is homosexual *actions* that make the difference, since a person cannot help how they are born. Just as if you were born with a physical predisposition towards alcoholism--if you never take a drink, then it's not going to be a problem.

I think in more cases than some would like to admit, homosexuality and gender confusion can be traced back to absuses and traumas in early childhood.

There are two places where the Bible *specifically* says that homosexuality is wrong--the Leviticus reference above, and Romans 1, where it talks about men and women trading natural uses of sex for unnatural ones, etc. Check it out.

Also, in the story of Sodom and Gomorrah, it is apparent that one of the major sins of the people is homosexuality and other kinds of sexual sins (hence the word "sodomy" today).

 

[John Pearce]

oh ok, thats cool. i havent read all the bible yet so i didnt know. yeah, i see your points. I mean, when I had a traumatic experience, it did affect me deeply. I saw two of my friends,# who were about 3 years older than me, both boys, get into bed naked with eachother and grope eachother, and that was wen i was about 5. that caused me doubt in my sexuality until about the age of 15, when i started to realise that i had sexual lust for girls rather than boys, but even today i sumtimes wonder. It's horrible to have sumthing like that happen. i often used to go to bed crying becasue i just didnt understand. nm... its much better now that I know im not gay or bi. NE who! thanks for that!

 

[Serapha]

oh ok, thats cool. i havent read all the bible yet so i didnt know. yeah, i see your points. I mean, when I had a traumatic experience, it did affect me deeply. I saw two of my friends,# who were about 3 years older than me, both boys, get into bed naked with eachother and grope eachother, and that was wen i was about 5. that caused me doubt in my sexuality until about the age of 15, when i started to realise that i had sexual lust for girls rather than boys, but even today i sumtimes wonder. It's horrible to have sumthing like that happen. i often used to go to bed crying becasue i just didnt understand. nm... its much better now that I know im not gay or bi. NE who! thanks for that!

Hi there!



I want to bring out one more point.... Jesus Christ didn't personally speak against homosexuality, but Jesus Christ followed the Judaic laws which included the condemnation of the homosexual acts... at least, the first-century Judaic laws concerning sodomy (men) were condemned.


It wasn't necessary for Jesus to teach against something that was already being taught as wrong in the society where he lived. He didn't teach against incest either, but it was covered by the law.

There is a difference between being a homosexual in the past, and in living a homosexual lifestyle in the present.


~serapha~

 

[Faith In God]

Hi there!



I want to bring out one more point.... Jesus Christ didn't personally speak against homosexuality, but Jesus Christ followed the Judaic laws which included the condemnation of the homosexual acts... at least, the first-century Judaic laws concerning sodomy (men) were condemned.


It wasn't necessary for Jesus to teach against something that was already being taught as wrong in the society where he lived. He didn't teach against incest either, but it was covered by the law.

There is a difference between being a homosexual in the past, and in living a homosexual lifestyle in the present.


~serapha~

Which side are you on? Jesus said lust is sin, and is condemnable by the law, and will be judged. homosexuality falls into that catagory.

 

[draper]

1) God finds it detestable.
Lev 20:13 If a man lies with a man as one lies with a woman both of them have done what is detestable. They must be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads.

So, gays should be killed? Sorry if that comes off as harsh, I'm just looking for clarification.

 

[Faith In God]

So, gays should be killed? Sorry if that comes off as harsh, I'm just looking for clarification.

They will be judged, as all sinners.

Broken laws require restitution, and that was it in that society, but it is still sin, as is lying, stealing, lusting of any sort, coveting, all of it is condemnable by God.

 

[draper]

Hmm...was that verse (Levitcus) a command from God, or a prophet?

 

[Faith In God]

Hmm...was that verse (Levitcus) a command from God, or a prophet?

A prophet acts as God's mouthpiece. moot question.

 

[draper]

A prophet acts as God's mouthpiece. moot question.

Yeah...realized that after I posted, heh.

So...correct me if I'm wrong, but from what I'm understanding from this thread, God's ideas of acceptable punishments for homosexuality have changed...(ranging from Levitcus..death, to now just judgment for the sin come the afterworld)...

..now, whats to say his perception of homosexuality could at one point change to homosexuality being totally acceptable?

 

[Faith In God]

Yeah...realized that after I posted, heh.

So...correct me if I'm wrong, but from what I'm understanding from this thread, God's ideas of acceptable punishments for homosexuality have changed...(ranging from Levitcus..death, to now just judgment for the sin come the afterworld)...

..now, whats to say his perception of homosexuality could at one point change to homosexuality being totally acceptable?

"I am the Lord, your God. I changeth not." His views do not change. But His instructions for His nation (Israel) are more clear than His instructions for nations such as America.

Sin was punished exactly the way God intended. A man was stoned for picking up sticks on the Sabbath.

But we do not live in OT times. God will still judge all sin that gets away in society (whether society smiles at it or not)

His law has remained constant. Adultery (ranging to lusting in the heart) is sin, and will be judged. Just because society does not acknowledge God's law does not mean it is acceptable in God's eyes. He does not change.

 

[Whitestone]

So, gays should be killed? Sorry if that comes off as harsh, I'm just looking for clarification.

I was just quoting that part of scripture to show the Lord's opinion on the issue.

If you look in Leviticus the punishment for I think everything was death, homosexuality was not being singled out.

People were killed for using the Lord's name in vain, and for working on the sabbath.

The requirements and punishments in the old testament are harsh, but that makes the sacrafice of Jesus all that much more precious.

Whitestone

 

[draper]

So, God's actual moral values do not change, just the earthly punishments he wants to be performed for them?

"I am the Lord, your God. I changeth not." His views do not change. But His instructions for His nation (Israel) are more clear than His instructions for nations such as America.

Sin was punished exactly the way God intended. A man was stoned for picking up sticks on the Sabbath.

But we do not live in OT times. God will still judge all sin that gets away in society (whether society smiles at it or not)

His law has remained constant. Adultery (ranging to lusting in the heart) is sin, and will be judged. Just because society does not acknowledge God's law does not mean it is acceptable in God's eyes. He does not change.

 

[draper]

Hmm..how does the punishments in Levitcus affect Jesus' sacrifice?

I still don't understand why God decided to change thr punishments for sin (on earth).

I was just quoting that part of scripture to show the Lord's opinion on the issue.

If you look in Leviticus the punishment for I think everything was death, homosexuality was not being singled out.

People were killed for using the Lord's name in vain, and for working on the sabbath.

The requirements and punishments in the old testament are harsh, but that makes the sacrafice of Jesus all that much more precious.

Whitestone