Iran president wants Israel ‘wiped off the map’

[Kelly]

The Lord has permitted and sent enemies against Israel before, this is nothing new.

 

[k]

The Lord has permitted and sent enemies against Israel before, this is nothing new.

The Israel in the Bible is not the same concept as Israel the nation that was formed just 60 years ago. Besides, something about the NT tells me...quite a few things about the concept of Israel...we are all included.

 

[LogicChristian]

Let's pray to Christ and ask God why nukes have not been used on Iran yet. Better yet, let's pray to Christ and ask if we should even have nukes. I'm being very serious. It is perplexing to me how so many on a Christian site openly advocate the use of a device that is the greatest abomination to all of God's Creation.

Nukes haven't been used on Iran yet because they don't pose that much of a threat to the existance of hte United States.

We have nukes though so that if nations like Iran get nukes, they can't dictate policy to the United States because they have a nuclear deterrant.

 

[SimplyMe]

It also reminds me of how WWII got started. There are lots of alliances like with China, Iran, and Russia, versus the US... um, quick question, do we still have any allies?

I'm thinking you meant WWI, it was the war that started because of all the alliances. WWII started because Europe was nervous about Germany, who attacked Poland, and Japan was trying to conquer Asia.

The Soviet Union actually had an agreement with Germany at the time the war started and didn't join the allies until Germany broke the agreement by attacking them.

 

[Sphere]

Yeah, the hate in the middle east is all one-sided.

Not quite.

 

[chokmah]

The Israel in the Bible is not the same concept as Israel the nation that was formed just 60 years ago.

Besides not being a theocracy, what is different about the "concept"?

 

[Kelly]

The Israel in the Bible is not the same concept as Israel the nation that was formed just 60 years ago.

Well, I guess we are all entitled to our opinion

 

[simplicity]

For the children of Abraham there has been Babylonian captivity, Egyptian bondage, German concentration camps. The State of Israel would not exist without Western support. I suggest that peace is a reasonable alternative in the event the west becomes incapacitated. WMD (White Man's Diplomacy) has made enemies where friends once existed.

I think Iran realizes that after three major hurricanes and its resources spread thin around the world, the US is weaker today than it has ever been in decades. So if you fall for the bait and send troops into Iran swinging like a drunken sailor - relying on this amazing team of intellectual juggernauts at the Pentegon for planning and intelligence - then Rumsfeld is your uncle.

 

[SimplyMe]

If Germany won WWII and gave Africans the southeastern portion of the U.S. because it was in their holy writings, and then prevented us from building up a strong military force, and continued to be a superpower and supported the new African nation, do you think we'd be over it? If the African nation continously razed the homes of white Chrisitians do you think it would be OK to rationalize it? Do you think England wouldn't still support us and hate the African nation? With the tables turned, the reaction would be the same, only the players would be different. If the tables were turned, we'd be no different than Arab countries are today.

It's not quite the same. Palestine, prior and during WWII, was a British colony. Jews were increasingly immigrating to Palestine, which the British attempted to curb around the time WWII started (and actually denied entrance to Jews fleeing the Holocaust). During WWII there was some terrorist activity within Palestine, which did not stop with the end of the war.

The British developed a plan to split Palestine into separate Jewish and Arab states, which was made a formal proposal by the UN and adopted. Jerusalem was to remain neutral and governed by the UN. The Palestinians rejected this plan, while the Jews set up Israel anyway. Six Arab nations attacked the new Israel and, during the war, Israel conquered portions of the land that was to become the Palestinian state, expelling the Palestinians and making those areas a part of Israel.

As with every argument, there are two sides. While the Palestinians will claim that the UN didn't listen enough to their objections, it also appears that the Palestinians were unwilling to seriously compromise --lands were being taken from them, places they had lived for several generations. The world was looking at it as solving two problems, a solution to the escalating violence between Jews and Arabs in Palestine, and a solution to the problem of a home for Jews who no longer felt safe in Europe --especially with the growing Communist threat to them in Eastern Europe.

The Arabs exacerbated the situation after the first Israeli war because they would not accept the Palestinians into existing Arab countries. The Palestinians remained people without a country and received little support from either the UN, which forced the Arab-Jewish agreement, or from the Arabic community.

It’s tough to make a valid comparison to the founding of Israel. A couple of possibilities were if the UN were to demand the return of the land of some Native American tribes in the US. That part of this plan was for these tribes, who were illegally forced off of their lands, to not only get those lands back but also become sovereign nations and not a part of the US. The other possibility is, with the immigration of Mexicans into Texas and California, that the US be required by the UN to give back the lands gained by the Mexican-American war, creating a new country, possibly restoring them as the Republic of Texas. I doubt these solutions would be any more acceptable to the US than the formation of a Jewish state in Palestine was acceptable to the Arabs, regardless of the historical inequities.

 

[k]

Nukes haven't been used on Iran yet because they don't pose that much of a threat to the existance of hte United States.

We have nukes though so that if nations like Iran get nukes, they can't dictate policy to the United States because they have a nuclear deterrant.

How is this a response to post #18?

 

[k]

Besides not being a theocracy, what is different about the "concept"?

There is a difference between nationalism and religious systems.

 

[chokmah]

There is a difference between nationalism and religious systems.

That's not an answer to my question.

Besides the lack of a theocracy, how does the state of Israel differ from the Israel of antiquity?

 

[JPPT1974]

There was a movie a long time ago, on HBO. About what would had happened if Hitler won the war. I think the world would be in very, very, big trouble.
As well as there would be so much grief & suffering.

 

[k]

That's not an answer to my question.

Besides the lack of a theocracy, how does the state of Israel differ from the Israel of antiquity?

It is the use of nationalism that trumps religious institutions, and more often than not, an amalgamation will occur that obfuscates any relic of nobility in either institution. If that does not answer the question, I am not sure what else to say, but I did my best.

 

[k]

There was a movie a long time ago, on HBO. About what would had happened if Hitler won the war. I think the world would be in very, very, big trouble.
As well as there would be so much grief & suffering.

It's kind of ironic that it was Russia that mainly defeated Germany (they sacrificed well over 20 milliion people while the US lost about 450,000), then the US that defeated Russia.

Hitler lost, and the world is STILL in very very big trouble, IMAO.

 

[LogicChristian]

How is this a response to post #18?

You said "let's pray to christ and ask why nukes haven't been used on Iran yet."

I answered why.

It's kind of ironic that it was Russia that mainly defeated Germany (they sacrificed well over 20 milliion people while the US lost about 450,000), then the US that defeated Russia.

Russia gave the most in terms of lives, the US gave by far the most in terms of equipment, production, and capital. Without the US' war production, Russia and Britain would never have held out against the Nazi war machine.

 

[Kelly]

Russia gave the most in terms of lives, the US gave by far the most in terms of equipment, production, and capital. Without the US' war production, Russia and Britain would never have held out against the Nazi war machine.

It was an Allied victory.

 

[k]

You said "let's pray to christ and ask why nukes haven't been used on Iran yet."

I answered why.


Russia gave the most in terms of lives, the US gave by far the most in terms of equipment, production, and capital. Without the US' war production, Russia and Britain would never have held out against the Nazi war machine.

There is much more to post #18 than that one sentence...and in fact, to only quote that one sentence is to take it entirely out of context. Par.

The Permanent War Economy is not something to be proud of.

 

[LogicChristian]

The Permanent War Economy is not something to be proud of.

What permanent war economy? The US was barely producing any military goods until the German invasion of Poland. Production ramped up a great deal throughout the war as the US needed weapons and so did our allies. After the war, military spending dropped by a HUGE amount, and has never been as high as that seen in WWII in terms of percentage of GDP.

BTW, in post #18, you also asked that we should pray to Christ to ask why we have nuclear weapons, I answered that one too.

Nuclear weapons and war aren't a function of Christ. I told you why they exist when you asked. If you don't like my response to post #18, I could really give a rats behind.

 

[k]

What permanent war economy? The US was barely producing any military goods until the German invasion of Poland. Production ramped up a great deal throughout the war as the US needed weapons and so did our allies. After the war, military spending dropped by a HUGE amount, and has never been as high as that seen in WWII in terms of percentage of GDP.

BTW, in post #18, you also asked that we should pray to Christ to ask why we have nuclear weapons, I answered that one too.

Nuclear weapons and war aren't a function of Christ. I told you why they exist when you asked. If you don't like my response to post #18, I could really give a rats behind.

The US functions on a Permanent War Economy...it is what got us out of the Great Depression and maintains our economic livelyhood...that is the Permanent War Economy that is being referred to.

My post spoke specifically of prayer...and the end result is referencing a "rat's behind."