I feel like a bad person for thinking this way

[Jupiter Drops]

^ Thanks Evie. Maybe one day I'll do some gallery show for my fellow CF people here. Need a camera and a stable life...

The depression part was about my past abuses in my family, both physical and emotional. It was hard to deal with, and I'm still trying to get over it. I'm not depressed as I used to be. I'm a lot better now.

A lot of people don't understand what abuse and depression means to an individual, so I don't bother telling it to anyone except here. I still haven't told anyone close to me to this day. I don't want to be judged or pitied. I just want to organize my thoughts and memories, and put away what had happened years ago.

I'll keep on praying to God. Lately, I've been pretty bad, and I really need Him. But I feel pretty far from Him with this unbalanced life.

 

[eckhart]

^ Thanks Evie. Maybe one day I'll do some gallery show for my fellow CF people here. Need a camera and a stable life...

The depression part was about my past abuses in my family, both physical and emotional. It was hard to deal with, and I'm still trying to get over it. I'm not depressed as I used to be. I'm a lot better now.

A lot of people don't understand what abuse and depression means to an individual, so I don't bother telling it to anyone except here. I still haven't told anyone close to me to this day. I don't want to be judged or pitied. I just want to organize my thoughts and memories, and put away what had happened years ago.

I'll keep on praying to God. Lately, I've been pretty bad, and I really need Him. But I feel pretty far from Him with this unbalanced life.

Im sorry I had no idea about the abuse. You're right I have no idea. Try getting a journal and writing them down? like an art sketch book but for memories or thoughts.
Please put some of your work up I want to see what it is like

 

[Jupiter Drops]

^ Actually that's a great idea... I've been meaning to do some kind of art diary...

I'll put my work up! Hopefully sooner or later, I will.

And it's okay. Thank you

 

[m.a.r.X]

^ Thanks Evie. Maybe one day I'll do some gallery show for my fellow CF people here. Need a camera and a stable life...

The depression part was about my past abuses in my family, both physical and emotional. It was hard to deal with, and I'm still trying to get over it. I'm not depressed as I used to be. I'm a lot better now.

A lot of people don't understand what abuse and depression means to an individual, so I don't bother telling it to anyone except here. I still haven't told anyone close to me to this day. I don't want to be judged or pitied. I just want to organize my thoughts and memories, and put away what had happened years ago.

I'll keep on praying to God. Lately, I've been pretty bad, and I really need Him. But I feel pretty far from Him with this unbalanced life.

How about today ?

as they say, today is the best day, you know

 

[Rhye]

Jupiter! I was an art major and I agree with the waste you are talking about. Even from the professors. Talentless people get those gallery openings honestly. 90 percent of the art world is like that.
You will get to where you want just keep your head up and work hard. And don't be angry with yourself anymore find forgiveness. You deserve better then that!

 

[Rhye]

I want to also add sometimes things happen in life that hurt us but those things in many ways are blessing. I don't mean abuse is a blessing far from it but these inner struggles you are writing about somehow hit close to home. But the things that have happened that have made me angry and hurt have been the best things that could have happened to me. If you like I can write to you what I went through. Sometimes knowing you are not alone eases our pain a little.

Trust in the lord he is sooooo good!

 

[MacFall]

I loathe and despise the university system in general, and if I had to boil down the question of college to "yay or nay" I would choose nay.

I failed out of college after one year, and I've been taking courses piecemeal when I have the ability to pay for it without going into debt. Yet I am better off financially than everyone I know who has graduated college with the major I was seeking. We have similar jobs, but I have almost no debt.

There are some disciplines for which the university system is still the best available system. I want to teach college economics and/or philosophy, and for that I know I'll need a doctorate, regardless of my low opinion of the system. But for almost any career choice outside of academics, there are better ways than college. So if you want to be in a trade or such like, I think what it comes down to, for you, is: will the stigma of being a college dropout be worth the long-term financial benefits? Because that's really all that you would be missing.

 

[Rhye]

It would be interesting and rather fascinating taking a class with you MacFall. =) But I would wonder if you could find a balance with opinions. I had a professor who was amazing with that. Later I found out that he has compete different views then what his students talked about but he was so centered and balanced within those discussions. It amazed me. He was and still is one of my favorite teachers.

 

[Jupiter Drops]

How about today ?

as they say, today is the best day, you know

Today is the best day, and I have no camera.

I will post it!...Someday!!!

Jupiter! I was an art major and I agree with the waste you are talking about. Even from the professors. Talentless people get those gallery openings honestly. 90 percent of the art world is like that.
You will get to where you want just keep your head up and work hard. And don't be angry with yourself anymore find forgiveness. You deserve better then that!

Thanks, Ethnog!!

It's so great to talk to an art major here who understands what's going on in the art world. I'm tired of this whole postmodern "I dunno" phase that the art world is going through right now. For instance, how can you possibly say that you don't know what art is because there's no real truth, but you yourself is an artist and push offensive material to the public? At times, there's too much ironic, hipster nonsense. I mean, if the material is offensive, there's better, creative ways that you can do than just... not.

I want to also add sometimes things happen in life that hurt us but those things in many ways are blessing. I don't mean abuse is a blessing far from it but these inner struggles you are writing about somehow hit close to home. But the things that have happened that have made me angry and hurt have been the best things that could have happened to me. If you like I can write to you what I went through. Sometimes knowing you are not alone eases our pain a little.

Trust in the lord he is sooooo good!

Yes, I'll keep on trusting the Lord. Strangely, the struggles I went through did make me a bit stronger. I'm able to handle difficult situations a bit better.

If you'd like, you can. I'm always open to listening.

I loathe and despise the university system in general, and if I had to boil down the question of college to "yay or nay" I would choose nay.

I failed out of college after one year, and I've been taking courses piecemeal when I have the ability to pay for it without going into debt. Yet I am better off financially than everyone I know who has graduated college with the major I was seeking. We have similar jobs, but I have almost no debt.

There are some disciplines for which the university system is still the best available system. I want to teach college economics and/or philosophy, and for that I know I'll need a doctorate, regardless of my low opinion of the system. But for almost any career choice outside of academics, there are better ways than college. So if you want to be in a trade or such like, I think what it comes down to, for you, is: will the stigma of being a college dropout be worth the long-term financial benefits? Because that's really all that you would be missing.

I don't like public education system in general, and I see what you're saying.

I never felt like I learned much of anything from my K-12 years, save for few teachers who made small differences in my life. It's kind of the same with college, except I'm learning more because my program's a bit specialized and some of my profs are interesting. Snotty, but interesting, though they have every reason to be a bit snotty, lol. But I can't wholly put my trust in what I learn from school because I know that reality is different and expects more out of graduates.

In the end, I need a degree because that's what the industry demands and I need training. I could think of a million better ways to do it, but I will be going to a good school, so I'll go with it for starters.

It would be interesting and rather fascinating taking a class with you MacFall. =) But I would wonder if you could find a balance with opinions. I had a professor who was amazing with that. Later I found out that he has compete different views then what his students talked about but he was so centered and balanced within those discussions. It amazed me. He was and still is one of my favorite teachers.

Agreed, it would be fun to take classes with MacFall. Glad you had a great prof... We need more profs like that.

 

[Rhye]

A few years ago my dad and I went to look at art. There was one gallery we went into and WOW. I was so embarrassed that my father was there with me. I walked out and he followed me. I thought he was going to get very upset with me but he said nothing. Later that night my uncle and family came over for dinner and my dad started talking about it. He said, some artist describe the horrible things that go on in the world and other times they describe the ugliness of the human heart. I was amazed that he had such an open heart to it and saw it as it was instead of just getting upset about it.
Also this weekend I saw something even worse at a major museum. I can't even believe they would put it up, it wasn't art, it was down right pornography. And I don't even say that lightly.
Maybe 1 out of 10 galleries you walk into might have some good art, the rest is really crap.


As for education. I would say I didn't get a good one from K-12. It was only in college that I was blessed to have really great professors and mentors. Maybe all those years of struggling to get through I was finally blessed with people who helped me better myself. Either way I am extremely grateful because even when I was struggling I learned to be a better teacher now and understand children and their development.

 

[MacFall]

It would be interesting and rather fascinating taking a class with you MacFall. =) But I would wonder if you could find a balance with opinions. I had a professor who was amazing with that. Later I found out that he has compete different views then what his students talked about but he was so centered and balanced within those discussions. It amazed me. He was and still is one of my favorite teachers.

All I would ask is that people be able to rationally and systematically defend their beliefs. No "just Google it" in my classroom!

 

[Jupiter Drops]

^
^ It's wonderful to hear about your experience!!

Sadly it's true for my previous school as well. If you go down into the basement studios, there are people who collected mass amount of pornographic material as 'art.' I was disgusted. I can see that they were trying to prove a point about women and porn industry, but it was obvious that they liked to watch those things as well when they talked about it.

 

[Wagonmaker]

I would like to point out that the girls you mentioned as struggling and hating their vocational fields has nothing to do with taking the wrong path during school. Happiness is a life choice we make or don't make every day.

think about what it is you see yourself doing in 5 years. In 10 years. This is something you should evaluate often, as it could change. In my life I have been blessed with many job opportunities, but none of them made me happy or sad. They just were. Do you want your job to pay the bills or fulfill you? Maybe both?

No one here can give you the answer you seek. You have the answer inside of you. I suspect you are very good at something, or maybe you have a deep interest in a certain field. Can you see yourself moving in that direction? Money aside, in 5 years what would it look like if you kept going in the direction you are currently going in?

There are no clear-cut answers, and you can't know with absolute precision where and what you will be. But you can trust that your direction will come to something good. Even if you change your mind down the road, your efforts and experiences will have taught you things about life that you wouldn't otherwise know.

Trust yourself, and know that your creator is watching you, is inside of you, helping you to unfold your greater purpose.

 

[blackribbon]

I'm too tired to read the whole thread, so I am responding to the original post.

Go talk to the counselor at the trade school that you are interested in and see what the job forecast and the expected entry level pay..along with what it is likely to be after you gain some experience and expertise. There are plenty of "trades" that pay better than college degrees and they usually cost less to get there.

Then go talk to the counselor at the college and get the same stats for someone in your degree plan.

A college degree is simply a piece of paper that proves you can thing and you can finish a major project. If you think it is anything more than that, then you don't understand what it really is. After you graduate, it is your responsibility to prove to your potential employer why they should hire you. It isn't a big "trade school" where you are trained of a career unless you pick something like nursing, law school, or engineering.

If you aren't wanting to be at school, you won't do well. There is never a point where you are too old to go to school...so there is no "I have to get this done now"...and often older students do better because they have an idea of what they want to get out of school. (I am 47 and in nursing school...and with a much, much higher gradepoint than when I went young in spite of being and only parent (widow) to two teenagers.)

As for avoiding the big debt, look into your local community college...and either transfer to a 4 year school or pick an Associates Degree program to start with. It is more economical and I've found at the professors are every bit as good as the big 4 year university I went to before...maybe even better because they don't waste or time or money.

And pick a major or trade that excites you in some way, because you will do better and be more statisfied in the career of your choice someday. ... Of course, this has to be within reason because majoring in something like Renaissance History probably has its limitations...but a science or English degree offer quite a few career possibilities.

(And if you have the trade school, you have a way to make "real" money while pursuing that 4 year degree later in life.)

 

[MacFall]

I'm too tired to read the whole thread, so I am responding to the original post.

Go talk to the counselor at the trade school that you are interested in and see what the job forecast and the expected entry level pay..along with what it is likely to be after you gain some experience and expertise. There are plenty of "trades" that pay better than college degrees and they usually cost less to get there.

As a trade school instructor and a tradesman myself, I would not necessarily advise trust in school guidance offices. Many of them are required - whether they like it or not - to feed the state's labor stats information to students, which is usually badly flawed. At least check what they say against what the instructors themselves, who generally seem to have a good bead on the market for labor in their trades, have to say. Also, go directly to people already in the trades full-time.

The skills that are taught at trade schools are all pretty useful in general, but may not be marketable at a level that would be even close to bringing in a living wage. And with the economy growing more unstable, it is becoming more and more difficult to predict which trends are sustainable.

One small bit of specific advice: stay out of new home construction. There are literally millions of homes in "shadow inventories" which, once on the market, will drive the value of new construction down even further than its lowest point after 2008. We are in for a MASSIVE liquidation of the construction market, in the best case (in the worst, the Fed will attempt to prevent that liquidation by inflation, which will only make the problem even worse and more general). Commercial and industrial job markets are far more reliable, if still unstable.

If you go into residential, handyman work is your best bet, especially "dirty jobs" which homeowners don't want to do themselves, and on which bigger and well-established contractors would overbid because they don't think they need the work.

 

[Jupiter Drops]

Funny thing about guidance counselors- They were all useless to me, starting from my high school to college. My college guidance counselor could care less about which major we should go into, the courses we should take, or what's the best for us, and despite the fact that it was her job, all she did was say, "Well, it's your choice."

Yes, it's my choice, but isn't it also your job to explain to me which course is alright, future residencies, and what the job outlook's like?

High school one was no better. She was new and used to be my middle school teacher. When I asked for some advice on colleges and the scores I needed to prep up, all she did was give me a blank stare and said, "Well, I don't know. You need to find out... Well, it's your job to know, isn't it?"

It really baffled me. I just wondered for a long time how this woman got the job.

Turns out, most guidance counselors are terrible. They should be fired. All of them. They don't do anything. They don't care about the student's needs despite what they said in the assembly. Most of them just eat off the money they get paid and play internet games from 9 to 5. They really have nothing to do. It's the most comfortable job in the world yet they complain about how low their pays are (not true- they get high pays, some even higher than the profs). If they went straight into politics, I can guarantee you that some of them could become elected because of their so-called promises.

Not to mention the fact that all that my high school guidance counselor knew about universities was the one right in my hometown. That's the only one she knew, and she even had to search it on her computer for about 30 minutes while explaining to me. She even kept telling me that she didn't know what grades I needed and so on while doing her short research.

Turns out, high school guidance counselors and others alike use what they 'know' to make students stay in their hometown for money. Basically they try to keep their students instead of going out because they're going to lose money. College and universities are big businesses, after all.

Guidance counselors are a big waste of government's money, the school's money, and my money. I don't need them and I really do hope that the job goes to wasteland sooner or later. At least, most of them do need serious evaluation from the government.

Aside from my rants and quips about guidance counselors, thanks for your info and support.


@MacFall: Thanks for the info.

 

[ImperatorWall]

There is no magic formula, no secret path that others have followed. Some fortunate few live a blessed existence, but life is full of doubts and fears for most of us.

You have to identify what you want to live for, and then go after it with all your heart and soul. Reconcile yourself to the reality that you may fail, and be left broken, alone, and with nothing. The only other option is to never try, and thus never know.

It ain't about talent, I'm not talented. It's not about intelligence, I'm not smart. What it takes is grit and heart. Nothing good comes without hard work, even art. (Sorry, could not resist the rhyme!)

 

[Takkles]

(he'd regret posting that in the morning)

 

[Takkles]

(this too, you can thank me later mister =])