Before what events mentioned in the book?
Do you know the church was prophesied by Moses?
Deuteronomhy 32
Rev.4 shows
John went to heaven - in the spirit
)not the eternal life body
he even weeps
is confused later - and tries to worship an angel
Rev. 4
in the spirit
describes the throne area
Why do you think if John was raptured as being the entire church - he hears four beasts saying this?
"Holy, holy, holy, Lord God Almighty, which was, and is, and is to come."
Why not - hey Jesus that was sure cool you getting everybody and welcome back.
Instead, John hears about He is to come.
It doesn't make any sense for people to place the rapture in Rev. 4. I have heard people say such things - as - John represents the entire church being raptured and - then horrible times begin on the earth.
Well, look too with me at v 5; for there aren't even any plagues yet being mentioned in the list.
v5
"...out of the throne proceeded lightnings and thunderings and voices..."
But get to Rev. 8:5 and we find
"thunderings, and lightnings, and an earthquake."
Now there will come a time of plagues - and that section of time will end with an earthquake.
Rev. 11:13
"And the same hour was there a great earthquake..."
(the third woe)
(7th trumpet)
(6th seal)
Rev. 4 shows John was caught up - alone - Jesus never descended to get him - it wasn't cloud time - the last trumpet event didn't unfold.
but four beasts repeat and repeat over and over a phrase
till when?
until it is time for this part
"And when those beasts give glory, and honour, and thanks..."
now - we come to where the 24 elders that have been seen as sitting since the start of the chapter - will fall
(so we have to also be in Rev. 11:16)
"And the four and twenty elders. which sat before God on their seats, fell..."
At both the end of Rev. 4 and this part of Rev. 11 - John has not yet seen the elders do anything but sitting down at the throne area.
If he had seen them doing other things - or heard them saying stuff - he would have said - the 24 elders that fell - fell again - and again -
But at the point of Rev. 11 (7th trumpet) - John has only seen this group as in seats.
and now - they fall upon their faces and worship God
John was in the time of part of the 7th trumpet as he told us about the end of Rev. 4.
In Rev. 5 - the 24 elders and the four beasts fall - but no one was first seated just before that moment of falling down.
John was in the time of the 7th trumpet - that means he has seen all of the previous trumpet events up to when the two witnesses had been slain by the beast - and now John knew he had been told by the angel of Rev. 11 that the two rise at the same hour as a great earthquake.
Find the earthquake event- and find the when the just get resurrected at cloud time.
But first - John would need to weep over a sealed book - the great earthquake must get unsealed from that book.
How could anyone of the church have come to the day of redemption- the day when she is to look up for her redemption draweth nigh - before Rev. 5?
The Redeemer must be located still in Rev. 5.
The sealed book must get opened - bringing in the day of redemption for the church.