“I don’t belong here...”

[Ehnglo]

Today, it really hit me.

First off, i’m a vegan because i do not want to contribute to the suffering of ANY sentient life (ALL entities with feelings) and have a degree in nutrition to have learned the depths of biochemistry when it comes to the truth of what animal products do in our bodies - creates an acidic/toxic biproduct that actually degrades cells, DNA, and enzymes making the body age faster and become far more prone to pretty much all illnesses and diseases. God also made it clear that telling the truth about this and being a voice for sentient life is a big part of my purpose on earth.

I’m surrounded by people that don’t care and mock this. They mock that i actually care about the feelings of others and that i love animals so much that i DON’T want to eat them, for their sake (Christ is about LIFE and giving value TO life, that means ALL life, not just human life), and of course for very deep health reasons.

Isaiah 11:6 - When predator lays with their prey and is lead by a little child? God has made it clear to me that the reason a little child would lead this peace is because little children don’t even THINK to kill. God also is really putting it on my heart that, “Thou shalt not kill” is actually meant to be applied to animals too because Jesus says we are to be like little children, little children that are NOT meant to kill, nor contribute to killing, nor contribute to the suffering of ANYONE or ANYTHING. Animals have feelings, and i for one could NEVER look an animal in the eyes and kill it.

Also, before Eve and Adam ate the forbidden fruit, i guarantee the thought to kill anything did NOT exist in their minds or hearts.

But yeah, i get mocked by so many Christians even though God has made it CLEAR he wants me to awaken people to this truth. They go on about animal sacrifices, but don’t realize after Jesus’ perfect sacrifice, there was truly no need for ANY animal sacrifices... God (and Jesus) made it abundance clear that obedience to His Commandments meant more to them than sacrifice, which includes the Commandment, “Thou shalt not kill.” Eating animal flesh/products results in killing animals that ultimately kills ourselves faster.

I have a hard time being on earth because people don’t care about what God sent me to do. People don’t care about feelings (i have been bullied pretty much my entire life). People don’t want to look deeper into genuine truth.

Today was my mom’s birthday so we went to a restaurant where my sister basically mocked me saying that it was “so inconvenient” that i was a vegan (but, i was grateful that the restaurant did make modifications to accommodate that). After dinner my parents and i went to the symphony, and after the symphony there was a man outside asking for money and i watched hordes of people just walk by like he didn’t exist. I gave him the last of my change and prayed for him. Then another man asked my parents as we were approaching our vehicle for something and my dad made a remark like, “they always want more and more.” Yet, while he was saying that i was in the middle of praying for the abundance of homeless people and for them to have the means to get off the street (as i gave the last of my change to the previous man outside of the concert hall).

It’s like, no one even THINKS to treat others as they wish to be treated anymore. It’s at that moment where i really felt like i truly don’t belong on this earth. I really want to go home where people actually care at the level God has taught me to care. From what i can tell, that isn’t anywhere on earth.

 

[Triple]

Englo, you aren't alone. Yes it is difficult. Many will not agree, and many more will attack.

Did you ever think that perhaps simply be being, and demonstrating your way, is enough?

You never know whose eyes are watching, and simply by being, how much you may have influenced an onlooker's life.

When you demostrated empathy and kindness to that man, you showed how it's done and what it looks like.

A child may have been watching. An adult may have been watching. You don't know this.
God was certainly watching. I am sure you made Him smile that day.

Isn't that enough reason to stay and keep doing?

Good news: You are not alone. I am one like you. Similar and yet still different as we all are. We are out here. We just get scattered about.

I find that the key is to demonstrate by way of being, and to not so much lecture others...or push a point of view. This will always bring vitriol and a defensive manner. This gives reason for people to push the idea away and remain locked to consideration and reflection.

Let them come to you. If people come to you and ask, tell them what you do, what you believe in and why. This will have far more resonance.

Sure, if they react badly, as they sometimes do, and are rude or defensive, this just shows their fear. It's not personal.

Also, long after the conversation is over, your words will be remembered, and take effect eventually...these seeds will fall on fertile soil sooner or later and start to grow.

Even if that is a small thing, or changes a way a person thinks about consuming, and makes better choices...this is still positive change.

Keep going.

Keep smiling and making others smile.

Keep up the good work. x

 

[John Bowen]

Maybe you are here to be a example to others by your diet that people don't have to eat so much heavy meats. It is unhealthy people in Jesus time mostly ate vegetables , grains . Keep shining your light its a great time to be alive .

 

[friend of]

God also is really putting it on my heart that, “Thou shalt not kill” is actually meant to be applied to animals too because Jesus says we are to be like little children, little children that are NOT meant to kill, nor contribute to killing, nor contribute to the suffering of ANYONE or ANYTHING.

Thank you for sharing this interesting take.

 

[Tolworth John]

(Christ is about LIFE and giving value TO life, that means ALL life, not just human life

Where is this found in the bible?

I am not aware of any statement by Jesus where he talks about valuing animal life?

God has made it CLEAR he wants me to awaken people to this truth.

Really, God said this to you or you want to promote a vegan lifestyle. Remember God authorised the eating of meat.
If you were talking about a more healthy lifestyle, eating less meat, fat etc I would understand where you were comig from and would agree. A vegan lifestyle has no biblical authority for us living after the flood.

 

[timewerx]

I am not aware of any statement by Jesus where he talks about valuing animal life?

There's actually plenty of verses valuing and preserving the life of an animal not just in the New Testament but from the Old Testament as well.

The end to animal sacrifice did not start with Christ but ended as early as the Book of Isaiah. By then, animal sacrifices are no longer acceptable to God and demands an end to it.

I'm going nearly vegan as well. Although for me, it's much more in the context of healthy living. Still plenty of protein sources from certain veggies and meat has plenty of bad stuff in it, stuff that leads to liver or kidney failure, and cancer.

And meat, particularly red meat can stimulate over-production of testosterone which is bad - leads to elevated levels of aggression and inability to reason properly which applies to women as well (as they too have testosterone in them).

 

[Tolworth John]

There's actually plenty of verses valuing and preserving the life of an animal not just in the New Testament but from the Old Testament as well.

There is a difference between being responcible for animal welfare and as the poster implies giving animals the same value as humans.

 

[SavedByGrace3]

Christians are used to this. It is par for the course and to be expected. We just plan on it.

 

[SavedByGrace3]

Acts 10
9 On the morrow, as they went on their journey, and drew nigh unto the city, Peter went up upon the housetop to pray about the sixth hour:
10 And he became very hungry, and would have eaten: but while they made ready, he fell into a trance,
11 And saw heaven opened, and a certain vessel descending unto him, as it had been a great sheet knit at the four corners, and let down to the earth:
12 Wherein were all manner of fourfooted beasts of the earth, and wild beasts, and creeping things, and fowls of the air.
13 And there came a voice to him, Rise, Peter; kill, and eat.
14 But Peter said, Not so, Lord; for I have never eaten any thing that is common or unclean.
15 And the voice spake unto him again the second time, What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common.
16 This was done thrice: and the vessel was received up again into heaven.

 

[timewerx]

There is a difference between being responcible for animal welfare and as the poster implies giving animals the same value as humans.

There is actually one curious sentence in Isaiah 66:3 - "Whoever sacrifices a bull is like one who kills a person.

There is also one verse where Jesus seems to assign the same value to an animal as a human child.

Another verse in the OT whether a man is righteous or wicked can be determined by how he treats his animals.

You can also look at it from a collective point of view - how our society treats animals is still cruelty and shows a wicked society. In this manner, it is actually better to be vegan - if it means to communicate the truth or protest how our society treats animals or livestock.

We should seek the truth and this is the truth about our society in its treatment of animals. We should not encourage the malpractice so being vegan might actually be closer to the truth.

 

[Tolworth John]

here is actually one curious sentence in Isaiah 66:3 - "Whoever sacrifices a bull is like one who kills a person.

One can prove anything by taking a verse out of context. Read the whole chapter and one sees that God is going on about false worship and in that context animal sacrifice is the same as killing humans for sacrifice totally valueless.

In which verse does Jesus assign the same value to an animal as to a child.

There is a difference between saying society treats animals badly and saying the bible teaches we should be vegan.
Man is a steward of the earth with all that stewardship implies.

 

[timewerx]

In which verse does Jesus assign the same value to an animal as to a child.

There is a difference between saying society treats animals badly and saying the bible teaches we should be vegan.
Man is a steward of the earth with all that stewardship implies.

Luke 14:5
Then he asked them, "If one of you has a child or an ox that falls into a well on the Sabbath day, will you not immediately pull it out?"

And then we have Proverbs 12:10.

God's original instruction for man (before sin took over) does not include consumption of meat - Genesis 2:16. Our being steward of this planet does not involve farming animals for their meat.

 

[Tolworth John]

Luke 14:5
Then he asked them, "If one of you has a child or an ox that falls into a well on the Sabbath day, will you not immediately pull it out?"

And then we have Proverbs 12:10.

God's original instruction for man (before sin took over) does not include consumption of meat - Genesis 2:16. Our being steward of this planet does not involve farming animals for their meat.

As I have said we are to care for animals, that verse says about practical physical care and nothing about the spiritual value assigned to a child.

If we were living in the same pre sin world we would all be hapily vegan, but we are not and eating meat is permitted.
Again a case can be made for better treatment of animals and for the eating of less meat and fat etc.

 

[Hazelelponi]

Luke 14:5
Then he asked them, "If one of you has a child or an ox that falls into a well on the Sabbath day, will you not immediately pull it out?"

And then we have Proverbs 12:10.

God's original instruction for man (before sin took over) does not include consumption of meat - Genesis 2:16. Our being steward of this planet does not involve farming animals for their meat.

Luke that you quoted is talking about property. Literally.

Oxen back in the day were horribly expensive and absolutely necessary to any farm. So, an indispensable item/property..

Luke is showing a similar value in the heart of the farmer; that of an indispensable animal of labor and a child, as both being valuable property the farmer would be desirous of saving.

He's not saying that the child should be held equal to an animal, just that the farmer does hold those two as of similar value, and therefore Jesus can easily open a parable about the Sabbath with it.

As far as your Proverbs verse quote, let's consider this same Oxen, a beast of burden, or the dog which guards the sheep which brings wool to the home..

There are lots of animals which we use as work animals, especially in a rural society prior to machinery, that are under our care.

This proverbs is saying don't beat or abuse them in anyway, if you do your wicked. We've all seen cruelty to a family pet depicted on television - those are the animals which tell you whether someone is a righteous man or a wicked one.

That has nothing to do with the chicken on your dinner plate, although I believe even she should be well treated while alive, and her death quick and merciful too.

Also, there is a lot of metaphoric and figurative language throughout the Bible.

For instance Jesus refers to His flesh/body as manna from Heaven or the Bread of Life - yet we don't physically eat HIM.

The trees in the garden, were they actual food? The tree of life? Really? You see stomach food there?

I would posit that it's far more likely none of the trees in the garden were actual fruit for our stomachs (like bananas or apples) but were ALL (regardless of tree ) representative of something else and not a discussion of the stomach food available to Adam and Eve...

What you wish to eat from all the bounty God placed on the earth for us is good - God placed animals for stomach food here on earth so if you'd like to make use of it them do, and if you don't care to that's fine too..

But there is no sin in eating meat..

 

[timewerx]

If we were living in the same pre sin world we would all be hapily vegan, but we are not and eating meat is permitted..

Very good point you brought up.

In the pre-sin world, a man and a woman's needs were provided with ease. After that, needs can only be fulfilled with hard toil.

Likewise, men and women are equals pre-sin. After that, men (husband) ruled over their wives (consequences of Adam and Eve's sin).

But the good news of the Gospel of the Christ can reverse it.

From hard toil to a light burden. In the kingdom of God, the work is easy, and animals, even the lion and the bear no longer kill other animals for their meat. A child would be playing with these animals.

We are to live according to the Kingdom of God and not this fallen kingdom.

Now, with regards to the topic, eating meat is probably okay, probably not a sin..... However, based on my overall understanding of scriptures, you'd be much better off not eating meat.

 

[timewerx]

But there is no sin in eating meat..

Absolutely we should treat all animals, including livestock with much care and respect.

Yes, it's not explicitly mentioned in the Bible that it would be sin to consume any meat, but you'll still be better off without meat.

Avoiding meat does wonders to the body.

 

[Hazelelponi]

you'll still be better off without meat.

Avoiding meat does wonders to the body.

I'm sure that is a difference of opinion... All my doctors have encouraged a healthy and balanced diet - not even one has ever suggested that vegan is a better diet.

So ill stay away from fad diets and do what my doctors see as best. It's kept me healthy my entire life and I've no need of eternal life this side of heaven.

 

[Kristen.NewCreation]

This thread has been closed for staff review. Discussion of whether veganism is biblical or not is off topic to recovery. Please take your discussion of it being Biblical to an appropriate forum.

 

[Paidiske]

MOD HAT ON
This thread has been moved to the Christian Philosophy & Ethics forum.​

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MOD HAT OFF​

 

[Serving Zion]

I am with you ehnglo! .. keep going on that path and try to put space between yourself and the detractors. I find that the action of not looking down on those who eat meat is enough for God's wrath to come upon them. As you can see, if you step out of the heat, the way they speak of slaughtering and devouring our beautiful fluffy friends, it is despicable. That is the wrath of God coming upon them (consider this article).

If you do not retaliate, then it is no longer rewarding for them to mock you, and only two things can come of that - either their conscience will win them to the light or they will descend into frustration, manifesting conduct fit for judgement.

It is hard to let go of the sense of judgement that is rooted in compassion, and think for a moment of our Lord who has been doing this ever since the fall, and in all cases.. let Him do the speaking

(Consider Romans 12:19-21).