why humans are not primates

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Frenzy

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I do need to chill out. Or I did. Now I am chill. But I still think it's annoying when threads become full of posts that are clearly not an attempt to promote relevant discussion.
Creationists will drive you crazy if you take them too seriously, they really don't know what they believe and will change what they say just as quick as they've said it if it means they don't have to back down, when you think you're getting through to them they will just stop posting or say that you don't understand or you're trying to put words in their mouth or you're twisting what they say, the reason for this is they don't have a whole lot of information about what it is they believe, they have been given something to believe and just left to get on with it, they read the garbage put out by the creationists web sites and think it's all true and they spout it as if it's all been proven beyond a doubt.
They do not understand about evolution and will make no attempt to understand it because they know that they will stop being creationists if they understand the first thing about evolution, they have been warned all their lives to stay away from it and they do, all in all it's just a very sad case.
 
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Aman777

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Creationists will drive you crazy if you take them too seriously, they really don't know what they believe and will change what they say just as quick as they've said it if it means they don't have to back down, when you think you're getting through to them they will just stop posting or say that you don't understand or you're trying to put words in their mouth or you're twisting what they say, the reason for this is they don't have a whole lot of information about what it is they believe, they have been given something to believe and just left to get on with it, they read the garbage put out by the creationists web sites and think it's all true and they spout it as if it's all been proven beyond a doubt.
They do not understand about evolution and will make no attempt to understand it because they know that they will stop being creationists if they understand the first thing about evolution, they have been warned all their lives to stay away from it and they do, all in all it's just a very sad case.

Such views are straight out of Disneyland since NO "so called" scientist here, can show us how and when prehistoric people changed into humans. They love to tell us it's "evolution" but FAIL to show us the mechanism for this miraculous event.

EVERY other creature MUST inherit their intelligence from their parents but NOT magical evolution humans, since we evolve and increase our parent's intelligence, over time in, a population....or so they claim. As these men fail to show ANY evidence for their "belief", God's Truth becomes more clear.

God shows that He created and brought forth, from the water, EVERY living creature that moves. Gen 1:21 These creatures change because it's the natural change (according to Evolism) which comes with ALL of God's creatures....except humans.

Humans leave the natural order of things and mystically become Mighty Men because ONLY they evolve superior intelligence which is higher than any other creature...Darwinists preach, but they don't tell us HOW, but only speak in generalities. Does ANYone here have ANY evidence of How this magic happens? Of course not. Anyone want to try? God Bless you
 
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PsychoSarah

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Such views are straight out of Disneyland since NO "so called" scientist here, can show us how and when prehistoric people changed into humans. They love to tell us it's "evolution" but FAIL to show us the mechanism for this miraculous event.
Come now, you know the mechanism is mutation, natural selection, etc. We have observed these in lab, btw. We might not be able to give you an exact "when" to the year, mostly because change is so gradual that the extreme blur between modern humans and the species that directly gave rise to us is too little to accurately determine with just bones. To be blunt, we can't tell which of the fossil hominids are direct ancestors to humans for the most part, due to the large numbers of them that lived at the same time. We can tell to an extent degree of relatedness though.
EVERY other creature MUST inherit their intelligence from their parents but NOT magical evolution humans, since we evolve and increase our parent's intelligence, over time in, a population....or so they claim. As these men fail to show ANY evidence for their "belief", God's Truth becomes more clear.
Humans just have too long a reproductive cycle compared to our lifespans to observe our own evolution on a macroscopic scale directly, for the most part. However, we have systematically bred dogs to either be smarter (on purpose) or dumber (mostly an unintended consequence of selecting for certain traits) in the past few centuries. Also, we do inherit most things from our parents, and between 50-60 mutations that we don't inherit.

God shows that He created and brought forth, from the water, EVERY living creature that moves. Gen 1:21 These creatures change because it's the natural change (according to Evolism) which comes with ALL of God's creatures....except humans.
Humans have changed. Why else do we have different bloods types, because god did it for the laughs? Even stranger, we have the same blood types that chimpanzees and many other apes(could be all, but I only know for sure about some of them), and were we created, there would be no reason for that to be the case. In fact, given that we are supposed to be (according to the bible) the ruler over the other creatures, it would make sense to make us as biologically different from them as possible, to both display this difference, and make disease transmission between us and other species less likely.

Humans leave the natural order of things and mystically become Mighty Men because ONLY they evolve superior intelligence which is higher than any other creature...Darwinists preach, but they don't tell us HOW, but only speak in generalities. Does ANYone here have ANY evidence of How this magic happens? Of course not. Anyone want to try? God Bless you

Sure we do, we even know specific genes that had to mutate into nonfunctioning forms in order for our brains to grow: one that promotes larger jaw development, and another that regulates brain growth. The former gives us weaker jaws, but in turn allows more space for our skulls and brains to grow, while the latter makes us prone to brain cancer, yet also allows for our brains to attain the size necessary for our intelligence.
 
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justlookinla

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Come now, you know the mechanism is mutation, natural selection, etc. We have observed these in lab, btw.

There's never been an observation in the lab, or anywhere else for that matter, of mutation and natural selection producing anything but the same life from. Moths produce moths, finches produce finches and bacteria produce bacteria.
 
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Hoghead1

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Reading your comments, I do not think you are being very accurate or fair here, Frenzy. The questions you posed about evolution have in fact been addressed in many lectures, books, etc. It's is very apparent to those of us who have been there, done, that, that you need to take some classes or do some further study. Now, the basic logic of your attack is that any position on creation is, to you, invalid unless it gives a clear account of what went down. So I wonder why you automatically accept the Genesis account It is not very clear at all, it really does not tell how God does things. I mean, can you sit there and tell me you are such buddies with God that he let you ion on the whole picture? Matter of fact, about Genesis being unclear, a basic problem is that there are two contradictory accounts of creation being given here. Gen. 1 says animals first, than man and woman together, Gen. 2 says fist man, then, animals, the woman. The reason that happened is that there texts were composed at very different times by different authors representing two radically divergent viewpoints. So, bottom line, you are willing to attack the Big Bang theory, or anything else in science, because no one directly observed it happening; yet you contradict yourself and turn around and that seriously the biblical accounts, when in point of fact nobody was around to he how and if God created.
 
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Aman777

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Come now, you know the mechanism is mutation, natural selection, etc. We have observed these in lab, btw. We might not be able to give you an exact "when" to the year, mostly because change is so gradual that the extreme blur between modern humans and the species that directly gave rise to us is too little to accurately determine with just bones. To be blunt, we can't tell which of the fossil hominids are direct ancestors to humans for the most part, due to the large numbers of them that lived at the same time. We can tell to an extent degree of relatedness though.

Really? How do we observe the change in intelligence in Humans? Can't be through education, since we would be born educated. When you study the physical changes in mutation, but do NOT have a way for studying the changes in intelligence, you are simply making a guess of how it happens.


Sarah:>>Humans just have too long a reproductive cycle compared to our lifespans to observe our own evolution on a macroscopic scale directly, for the most part. However, we have systematically bred dogs to either be smarter (on purpose) or dumber (mostly an unintended consequence of selecting for certain traits) in the past few centuries. Also, we do inherit most things from our parents, and between 50-60 mutations that we don't inherit.

Did you breed the smarter dogs with the dumber dogs in order to make the dumber dogs smarter? If so, the same thing happened with today's Humans since God bred Humans (descendants of Adam) with the sons of God (prehistoric people) and voila, today's Humans. Gen 6:4 Amen?

Sarah:>>Humans have changed. Why else do we have different bloods types, because god did it for the laughs? Even stranger, we have the same blood types that chimpanzees and many other apes(could be all, but I only know for sure about some of them), and were we created, there would be no reason for that to be the case. In fact, given that we are supposed to be (according to the bible) the ruler over the other creatures, it would make sense to make us as biologically different from them as possible, to both display this difference, and make disease transmission between us and other species less likely.

Humans were made like Jesus in incorruptible bodies which never die, BUT everything changed when Adam sinned and found himself in a body of Flesh, exactly like the corruptible bodies of the sons of God (prehistoric people). Cain married one of these people and Cain's descendants on Adam's world inherited Adam's superior intelligence. Gen 4 NO evolution involved, but simply changes within mankinds.

Sarah:>>Sure we do, we even know specific genes that had to mutate into nonfunctioning forms in order for our brains to grow: one that promotes larger jaw development, and another that regulates brain growth. The former gives us weaker jaws, but in turn allows more space for our skulls and brains to grow, while the latter makes us prone to brain cancer, yet also allows for our brains to attain the size necessary for our intelligence.

Changes within kinds? Of course. Prehistoric people who were here when the Ark arrived changed into today's modern Humans because we INHERITED it the natural way with NO magical evolution necessary. The sons of God (prehistoric people) became smarter and today's Humans inherited the DNA and ERVS of prehistoric people giving EVERYone a Free choice to believe God or the ever changing knowledge of mankind. Amen?
 
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Gene2memE

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Hominid foot evolution:

Fossils, feet and the evolution of human bipedal locomotion:

geologically more ‘recent’ hominin species, such as Homo antecessor, H. heidelbergensis, H. neanderthalensis and anatomically modern H. sapiens were fully bipedal (citations omitted). Their feet reflect this bipedalism, although certain aspects of the pedal morphology of H. antecessor, H. heidelbergensis and H. neanderthalensis differ from that of modern humans.

based on our current assessment of the data there are at least two different postcranial morphologies in roughly contemporaneous hominins at two different periods in the hominin fossil record. A. africanus with inferred ape-like intermembral proportions overlaps in time with the Bouri skeleton with inferred human-like intermembral proportions (but orang-utan-like brachial proportions), and H. habilis with inferred ape-like intermembral proportions overlaps in time with H. ergaster with human-like intermembral proportions (and human-like brachial proportions). A. afarensis has intermediate intermembral proportions that differ from those of H. habilis to a degree that is almost never seen in humans and is rare in extant great apes (Richmond et al. 2001) and pre-dates these other hominins. This situation implies considerable locomotor diversity that would be difficult to incorporate within a linear evolutionary framework.

Evolution of the Human Foot: Evidence from Plio-Pleistocene Hominids

The human foot shows the hallmarks of an arboreal heritage wherein the foot was primarily a grasping organ. Over the course of the human career the human foot has evolved an elaborate plantar aponeurosis, strong plantar ligaments, longitudinal arches, an enlarged musculus flexor accessorius, an adducted (non-opposable) hallux, a remodeled calcaneocuboid joint, a long tarsus, and shortened toes (II to V). Comparisons of the chimpanzee and human foot allow us to reconstruct the pathway of foot evolution.

Fossil foot bones of Homo habilis, dated at 1.76 million years, are remarkably like those of modern humans. Foot bones from Hadar, dated at around 3.5 million years, are remarkably chimpanzee-like, with only incipient human traits. The surprising chimpanzee-like qualities of the Hadar fossils strongly support the use of living apes as models of ancestral pongid-hominid morphotypes.

Mosaic transitional fossils like StW-573 and OH8 show hominid species with both human-like and chimp-like features:

Stw573 “Little Foot” Australopithecus africanus:



OH8 assessment

A series of multivariate investigations have been undertaken in order to identify patterns of morphological variation in biomechanically relevant features of the four hindmost tarsal elements among humans, selected apes and OH8. The results confirm the earlier univariate findings and firmly indicate the functional affinities of the four bones to be mosaic, in some respects being human-like while in others being essentially ape-like, suggesting the presence of a divergent first ray. These findings shed some doubt upon the original interpretation of the gait of this hominid and support a hypothesis of mixed locomotor adaptation, possibly arboreal and terrestrial.
 
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PsychoSarah

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Really? How do we observe the change in intelligence in Humans? Can't be through education, since we would be born educated. When you study the physical changes in mutation, but do NOT have a way for studying the changes in intelligence, you are simply making a guess of how it happens.
Brain to body ratio for average specimens will give one a good idea of how intelligent a species is, even if one only has the bones. You can tell brain size from skeletal remains so long as you have a good portion of the skull.

Did you breed the smarter dogs with the dumber dogs in order to make the dumber dogs smarter? If so, the same thing happened with today's Humans since God bred Humans (descendants of Adam) with the sons of God (prehistoric people) and voila, today's Humans. Gen 6:4 Amen?
Actually, if you breed a border collie with a dumb breed of dog (mastiffs, perhaps), the resulting puppies would be smarter than their dumb parent, but also dumber than their smart parent. Try it if you have the resources to do so, scientists do it with rats.

Humans were made like Jesus in incorruptible bodies which never die, BUT everything changed when Adam sinned and found himself in a body of Flesh, exactly like the corruptible bodies of the sons of God (prehistoric people). Cain married one of these people and Cain's descendants on Adam's world inherited Adam's superior intelligence. Gen 4 NO evolution involved, but simply changes within mankinds.
How much genetic change does it take before it transitions from "micro" evolution to "macro" evolution. Please give a number of mutations or genes rather than traits, as some singular genes impact more traits or single traits more significantly than others.


Changes within kinds? Of course. Prehistoric people who were here when the Ark arrived changed into today's modern Humans because we INHERITED it the natural way with NO magical evolution necessary. The sons of God (prehistoric people) became smarter and today's Humans inherited the DNA and ERVS of prehistoric people giving EVERYone a Free choice to believe God or the ever changing knowledge of mankind. Amen?

Why couldn't all apes be a kind? They even have the same blood types as us, and we have fossil evidence of bipedal apes with chimpanzee sized brains.
 
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Jimmy D

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yes a link full of discussion,
however I asked
don't tell me show me,
the claim was of "foot fossils" from Australopithecus,
do we really need Olympic sized mental gymnastics ?
either "foot fossils" exist or they don't.

now you want a subject change to Homo Naledi,
I had planned on letting you dig a hole but could not be bothered,
what do you think of the undated unclassified bones ?

I thought it might be more productive to move the discussion on if you're interested in transitional fossils. Presumably there's only one Australopithecus foot fossil? (I don't know and I never claimed otherwise) is there any point in arguing about it, except for point-scoring.

I notice your debating style involves bickering over petty points and avoiding the salient issue - that all the evidence points to common descent - all you have to refute that is incredulity, rhetoric and trying to deflect arguments you can't win by countering with pedantic nitpicking.

wonkypedia states
"Three dating methods have been tried with inconclusive results, so local scientists are working on adapting another technique they expect can be performed in 2017"

  • The research team proposes the bones represent a new species, naledi in the genus Homo; other experts contend further analysis is needed to support this classification.[9][21]
  • Paleoanthropologist Tim D. White said the significance of this discovery is unknown until dating has been completed and additional anatomical comparison with previously known fossils has been done.[22]
  • Rick Potts said that without an age there is no way to judge the evolutionary significance of this find.[24] He stated that "it's hard to know without a date whether it's from that period, as one of those experiments that then went nowhere, or whether it's in fact much less than one million years old. In that case, we could be talking about something that also didn't go anywhere and was just an isolated, probably very small population that persisted for a long time in splendid isolation."[22]
  • New York University anthropologist Susan Anton stated that even after dating, experts will likely spend many years striving to put these fossils in the proper context because there is no consensus in paleoanthropology about exactly how such comparisons are used to define the genus Homo. "Some would argue that striding bipedalism is a defining feature, so that being Homo means using a specific way of moving around the environment. Other scholars may look more to cranial characteristics as Homo family features."[22]
  • Bernard Wood, a paleoanthropologist at the George Washington University, agrees the remains represent a new species, but thinks the bones may represent a relict population that may have evolved in near isolation in South Africa, similar to another relict population, a small-brained species of Homo floresiensis from the island of Flores in Indonesia.[16]
  • With the number of individuals, and the sexes and age groups represented, scientists consider the find to be the richest assemblage of associated fossil hominins ever discovered in Africa,[16] and aside from the Sima de los Huesos collection and later Neanderthal and modern human samples, it (the excavation site) has the most comprehensive representation of skeletal elements across the lifespan, and from multiple individuals, in the hominin fossil record.[1][6]

I asked what you thought about them, not what wikipedia says, haven't you got an opinion? Do you think that they're transitional?

From what I've read they show a mixture of human and more ape-like features therefore they are transitional fossils.
 
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Hominid foot evolution:

Fossils, feet and the evolution of human bipedal locomotion:





Evolution of the Human Foot: Evidence from Plio-Pleistocene Hominids





Mosaic transitional fossils like StW-573 and OH8 show hominid species with both human-like and chimp-like features:

Stw573 “Little Foot” Australopithecus africanus:


OH8 assessment
wow,
a wall of cut and paste with no comment,
this most heinous of crimes fails to show any Australopithecus feet fossils that someone claimed existed up thread ,
but more than that the above cut and paste crime shows very little of anything except a classification frenzy of dead monkeys that "maybe", "could have", "possibly", "suspected" ect.
your cut and paste asks for suspended disbelief,
a desperate miss mash of bits here and bits there that are shoe horned into supporting the macro evolution narrative,



: )
 
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Jimmy D

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wow,
a wall of cut and paste with no comment,
this most heinous of crimes fails to show any Australopithecus feet fossils that someone claimed existed up thread ,
but more than that the above cut and paste crime shows very little of anything except a classification frenzy of dead monkeys that "maybe", "could have", "possibly", "suspected" ect.
your cut and paste asks for suspended disbelief,
a desperate miss mash of bits here and bits there that are shoe horned into supporting the macro evolution narrative,

I notice your debating style involves bickering over petty points and avoiding the salient issue - that all the evidence points to common descent - all you have to refute that is incredulity, rhetoric and trying to deflect arguments you can't win by countering with pedantic nitpicking.

What a surprise. Rhetoric and deflection.

What Gene2meme presented is genuine research and evidence into Hominid foot evolution, do you refute it?
 
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: D

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I thought it might be more productive to move the discussion on if you're interested in transitional fossils. Presumably there's only one Australopithecus foot fossil? (I don't know and I never claimed otherwise) is there any point in arguing about it, except for point-scoring.
uh hu......
discussion moved (again)

I notice your debating style involves bickering over petty points and avoiding the salient issue - that all the evidence points to common descent - all you have to refute that is incredulity, rhetoric and trying to deflect arguments you can't win by countering with pedantic nitpicking.
is this the twilight zone ?



I asked what you thought about them, not what wikipedia says, haven't you got an opinion? Do you think that they're transitional?
I think it would be better to wait for the evidence before attempting to shoehorn them into the evolution narrative like a lot of the relevant scientists have stated.

From what I've read they show a mixture of human and more ape-like features therefore they are transitional fossils.
therefore you jump the gun before anything's decided because the ToE is desperate for evidence,
whats the rush?
and where did you read that ?
got a link ?

: )
 
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Larniavc

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I always liked the trivia question:

In the song GOD REST YE MERRY GENTLEMEN, where does the comma go, and why?

After the the ye. We are being told that God is giving rest to the merry gentlemen.
 
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Larniavc

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usually through unchallenged authority figures.

You do realise that God could fit this definition. This implies that you are happy with unchallenged authority. Unless your belief is that something could legitimately challenge God: in which case where goes omnipotence?
 
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You do realise that God could fit this definition. This implies that you are happy with unchallenged authority. Unless your belief is that something could legitimately challenge God: in which case where goes omnipotence?
in my humble opinion this could not be more wrong,
if God was an authoritarian you would not have free will to believe or not.
you are living proof that Gods authority does not go unchallenged by labelling yourself as an atheist.

: )
 
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Gene2memE

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wow,
a wall of cut and paste with no comment,
this most heinous of crimes fails to show any Australopithecus feet fossils that someone claimed existed up thread ,
but more than that the above cut and paste crime shows very little of anything except a classification frenzy of dead monkeys that "maybe", "could have", "possibly", "suspected" ect.
your cut and paste asks for suspended disbelief,
a desperate miss mash of bits here and bits there that are shoe horned into supporting the macro evolution narrative,

I guess you cant teach those that refuse to learn and there are none so blind as those that refuse to see.

But, for the good of my own conscience:
1. If you look at some of those papers, as well as some of the links below, you'll find diagrams and photos of early hominid, ape and human anatomy, including comparisons of their foot morphology. You might have to scratch around for free access, but they're there;
2. Australopithecus was not a "dead monkey", and to claim this suggests either deep ignorance of the subject matter or deliberate distortion. The Homo genus is a direct descendant of the australopithecines;
3. Its not just these papers that show the evolutionary links between hominini feet, adapted for aboreal dwelling, and later hominid feet, adapted for ground dwelling, and the 'mosaic' transitionary forms.

To whit, some more papers, for those that actually have an interest in learning:

Sterkfontein member 2 foot bones of the oldest South African hominid. Clarke RJ1, Tobias PV:

Four articulating hominid foot bones have been recovered from Sterkfontein Member 2, near Johannesburg, South Africa. They have human features in the hindfoot and strikingly apelike traits in the forefoot. While the foot is manifestly adapted for bipedalism, its most remarkable characteristic is that the great toe (hallux) is appreciably medially diverged (varus) and strongly mobile, as in apes. Possibly as old as 3.5 million years, the foot provides the first evidence that bipedal hominids were in southern Africa more than 3.0 million years ago. The bones probably belonged to an early member of Australopithecus africanus or another early hominid species.


The locomotor anatomy of Australopithecus afarensis. Stern JT Jr, Susman RL.:

The postcranial skeleton of Australopithecus afarensis from the Hadar Formation, Ethiopia, and the footprints from the Laetoli Beds of northern Tanzania, are analyzed with the goal of determining (1) the extent to which this ancient hominid practiced forms of locomotion other than terrestrial bipedality, and (2) whether or not the terrestrial bipedalism of A. afarensis was notably different from that of modern humans. It is demonstrated that A. afarensis possessed anatomic characteristics that indicate a significant adaptation for movement in the trees. Other structural features point to a mode of terrestrial bipedality that involved less extension at the hip and knee than occurs in modern humans, and only limited transfer of weight onto the medial part of the ball of the foot, but such conclusions remain more tentative than that asserting substantive arboreality.


Metatarsophalangeal joint function and positional behavior in Australopithecus afarensis. Duncan AS1, Kappelman J, Shapiro LJ:

Recent discussions of the pedal morphology of Australopithecus afarensis have led to conflicting interpretations of australopithecine locomotor behavior. We report the results of a study using computer aided design (CAD) software that provides a quantitative assessment of the functional morphology of australopithecine metatarsophalangeal joints. The sample includes A. afarensis, Homo sapiens, Pan troglodytes, Gorilla gorilla, and Pongo pygmaeus. Angular measurements of the articular surfaces relative to the long axes of the metatarsals and phalanges were taken to determine whether the articular surfaces are plantarly or dorsally oriented. Humans have the most dorsally oriented articular surfaces of the proximal pedal phalanges. This trait appears to be functionally associated with dorsiflexion during bipedal stride. Pongo has the most plantarly oriented articular surfaces of the proximal pedal phalanges, probably reflecting an emphasis on plantarflexion in arboreal positional behaviors, while the African hominoids are intermediate between Pongo and Homo for this characteristic.


Talocrural joint in African hominoids: implications for Australopithecus afarensis. Latimer B1, Ohman JC, Lovejoy CO:

Talocrural joints of the African apes, modern humans, and A.L.288-1 are compared in order to investigate ankle function in the Hadar hominids. Comparisons between the hominids and African pongids clearly illustrate the anatomical and mechanical changes that occurred in this joint as a consequence of the evolutionary transition to habitual bipedality.



Like I said, not for you, but for those with eyes that are open enough to learn.
 
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Jimmy D

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there's nothing to refute.

How about this bit:

The Olduvai Hominid 8 (OH8) foot has long been the centre of investigation in considering the locomotor adaptations of earlyHomo, the original interpretation reporting it as having “. . . principal affinities . . . with that ofHomo sapiens” and having “. . . the structural requirements of an upright stance and a fully bipedal gait” (Day * Napier, 1964). These conclusions have since proved to be controversial. The ape foot and that of the modern human differ in many areas, two of which are the divergence of the first ray found in apes but not humans, and the decreased, but alterable, range of motion at the midtarsal joint. The modifications required to reduce the range of motion at the midtarsal joint to that of the human are principally twofold, one at each of the talonavicular and calcaneocuboid joints. A univariate analysis of the four bones involved in the midtarsal joint of OH8 reveals that, although the calcaneocuboid articulation has assumed an essentially human-like state, the talonavicular joint has not. A series of multivariate investigations have been undertaken in order to identify patterns of morphological variation in biomechanically relevant features of the four hindmost tarsal elements among humans, selected apes and OH8. The results confirm the earlier univariate findings and firmly indicate the functional affinities of the four bones to be mosaic, in some respects being human-like while in others being essentially ape-like, suggesting the presence of a divergent first ray. These findings shed some doubt upon the original interpretation of the gait of this hominid and support a hypothesis of mixed locomotor adaptation, possibly arboreal and terrestrial.


Notice the bit in bold, suggestive of a transitional fossil and therefore 'macro' evolution don't you think?

To be honest, I don't know why I'm wasting my time on this nonsense anyway, that we're even having this discussion suggests that anything you've said so far is worth debating and to be honest - it isn't.

Anyway, good luck in your endeavors in overturning an established scientific theory. When you've got anything worth discussing let us know.

Bye
 
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Aman777

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How about this bit:

The Olduvai Hominid 8 (OH8) foot has long been the centre of investigation in considering the locomotor adaptations of earlyHomo, the original interpretation reporting it as having “. . . principal affinities . . . with that ofHomo sapiens” and having “. . . the structural requirements of an upright stance and a fully bipedal gait” (Day * Napier, 1964). These conclusions have since proved to be controversial. The ape foot and that of the modern human differ in many areas, two of which are the divergence of the first ray found in apes but not humans, and the decreased, but alterable, range of motion at the midtarsal joint. The modifications required to reduce the range of motion at the midtarsal joint to that of the human are principally twofold, one at each of the talonavicular and calcaneocuboid joints. A univariate analysis of the four bones involved in the midtarsal joint of OH8 reveals that, although the calcaneocuboid articulation has assumed an essentially human-like state, the talonavicular joint has not. A series of multivariate investigations have been undertaken in order to identify patterns of morphological variation in biomechanically relevant features of the four hindmost tarsal elements among humans, selected apes and OH8. The results confirm the earlier univariate findings and firmly indicate the functional affinities of the four bones to be mosaic, in some respects being human-like while in others being essentially ape-like, suggesting the presence of a divergent first ray. These findings shed some doubt upon the original interpretation of the gait of this hominid and support a hypothesis of mixed locomotor adaptation, possibly arboreal and terrestrial.


Notice the bit in bold, suggestive of a transitional fossil and therefore 'macro' evolution don't you think?

To be honest, I don't know why I'm wasting my time on this nonsense anyway, that we're even having this discussion suggests that anything you've said so far is worth debating and to be honest - it isn't.

Anyway, good luck in your endeavors in overturning an established scientific theory. When you've got anything worth discussing let us know.

Bye

Sorry, but you are confusing Humans with animals. Don't you know that Humans were made long before any other living creature, making it impossible that we could have evolved from any animal? Here's God's Truth:

Adam, the first Human was made on the 3rd Day BEFORE the Big Bang of our Cosmos. Gen 2:4-7
The sons of God (prehistoric people) were made on the 5th Day. Gen 1:21

The ToE is false since it assumes that Humans had our origin on Planet Earth. This is provably false and History refutes such foolishness. Amen?
 
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