Planned Parenthood doesn't profit from tissue sales - per NY Times

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Blank Stair

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96% of abortions are not for reasons of rape, incest, or the mother's life being in danger, so this argument is always awful.
Unless you're female and pregnant, 100% of abortions is none of your business.

People who think women should have to remain pregnant against their will are rarely people who have adopted babies that were born but given to adoption agencies or fostering.
If anti-abortion people invested as much energy into the born and homeless , those waiting for adoption, as they do advocating women be forced to have kids they don't want, the numbers of homeless children would be dropping daily. As it is, it's easier to tell a woman she must remain pregnant than it is to say one will adopt that baby that that pro-choice woman made the choice to have. And then give up to an adoption agency.
 
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benedictaoo

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Rather women die ?

How many babies have died in third world countries, either in utero or shortly after birth, since this whole PP issue started? Any clue?
How many babies from those third world countries have you adopted?
because that's how it works... If you don't kill a baby, a woman dies. Rolleyes...
 
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PapaZoom

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Perfect!THAT is exactly why the PL movement is unconscious.
I'm sorry but you don't make much sense. Your posts are ramblings. I wish you'd actually make a point and then develop it instead of all the rambling.
 
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benedictaoo

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Unless you're female and pregnant, 100% of abortions is none of your business.

People who think women should have to remain pregnant against their will are rarely people who have adopted babies that were born but given to adoption agencies or fostering.
If anti-abortion people invested as much energy into the born and homeless , those waiting for adoption, as they do advocating women be forced to have kids they don't want, the numbers of homeless children would be dropping daily. As it is, it's easier to tell a woman she must remain pregnant than it is to say one will adopt that baby that that pro-choice woman made the choice to have. And then give up to an adoption agency.
Is this post legal in OBOB political forum?
 
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Sword of the Lord

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Is this post legal in OBOB political forum?
Nope. The train of thought isn't legal in the Kingdom of God either. Just on this heathen earth.
 
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benedictaoo

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Nope. The train of thought isn't legal in the Kingdom of God either. Just on this heathen earth.
Got to give you props for that one. But you're a man so it's not your beeswax. Lol...unless you're a woman abortion is none of your beeswax. How can you beat that logic?
 
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benedictaoo

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What does any of this have to do with the morality of killing unborn human beings?
Well, its the ole, the babies in third worlds are going to die if we don't kill them...we must kill them because they're going to die. And don't you know? Its our fault because we won't adopt them.
 
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PapaZoom

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Well, its the ole, the babies in third worlds are going to die if we don't kill them...we must kill them because they're going to die. And don't you know? Its our fault because we won't adopt them.
It's an amazingly poor argument. It clearly has nothing to do with the argument that it's wrong to kill unborn human beings.
 
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PapaZoom

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The illogic of this rubs me the wrong way... I'm tempted to note the user name... Is it just irony?
I wonder if the people here pushing this report know who is behind it? I'll bet they don't. And I'll bet they don't know who hired this research firm. Also, did people here read this part of the report?
A report commissioned by Planned Parenthood has found that the sting videos targeting its tissue donation practices contain intentionally deceptive edits, missing footage and inaccurately transcribed conversations. But there is no evidence that the anti-abortion group behind the attack made up dialogue. ...

But the firm also wrote that it is impossible to characterize the extent to which the edits and cuts distort the meaning of the conversations depicted and that there was no “widespread evidence of substantive video manipulation.”

Hmmmm, no evidence that the dialogue was made up and no evidence of substantive video manipulation. I'll bet PP was hoping that wouldn't be included in the report.

Let's just hope that the research firm wasn't hired by PP. Oh wait, it was.

Well, at least it's not this firm from a report in the WSJ: http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052702304203604577397031654422966

Oh wait, it is. According to a report this firm is
an opposition research firm with ties to the Democratic party and has a history of harassing socially conservative Republican donors, possibly on behalf of the Obama campaign:
 
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classicalhero

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I still can't believe the BS being spouted that women die if they don't have an abortion. In fact two countries that have made abortion illegal are amongst the top countries for maternal health. In fact The USA is behind in maternal health in both Chile and Ireland. In fact in states in Mexico where abortion is illegal has better health outcomes for mothers than those places where abortion is legal.
bmjopen.bmj.com/content/5/2/e006013.full
 
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PapaZoom

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I still can't believe the BS being spouted that women die if they don't have an abortion. In fact two countries that have made abortion illegal are amongst the top countries for maternal health. In fact The USA is behind in maternal health in both Chile and Ireland. In fact in states in Mexico where abortion is illegal has better health outcomes for mothers than those places where abortion is legal.
bmjopen.bmj.com/content/5/2/e006013.full

I think what is meant by that is that if women don't have access to legal abortions they'll do the abortion themselves and many more women will die. It's the coat hanger argument. It's a fallacious argument but it still makes the rounds.
 
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classicalhero

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I think what is meant by that is that if women don't have access to legal abortions they'll do the abortion themselves and many more women will die. It's the coat hanger argument. It's a fallacious argument but it still makes the rounds.
The only way abortion advocates can make a case for is by making up one. It's the big lie about abortion, just repeat it until it becomes true.
 
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frenchdefense

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Hey, all you guys dissing the NY Times reporting of an expert analysis of the vids:

Question:

Why are you taking the vids at face value ?

Who are these "experts" and why should we take their word for it? There are plenty of other analysts out there and they did not come to any of those conclusions. We're these "experts'" finding peer reviewed and where can we see that analysis? Or are you taking the NYT at face value.

Who are these con men video taping surreptitiously, editing the tapes and passing them off as unedited and why should I believe them ?

The issue her isn't really who's wrong or right, but who you wish to believe and why.

Truth is I believe government investigation and the professional over the sleazy con guy.

I'm funny like that.



This isn't something that the pro-life camps want to hear.
You know, the truth about this issue?

It's not that they don't want to hear the truth, it's that they'll believe anything as true as long as it fits the their internal narrative of planned parenthood.

That's even worse, really because it give them carte blanshe to attack, slander, obfuscate and slur anyone and anything them deem critical of their views.
o
 
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PapaZoom

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Who are these con men video taping surreptitiously, editing the tapes and passing them off as unedited and why should I believe them ?

You are bearing false witness to the truth here. They never tried to pass the edited tapes off as unedited. That is a lie. Get your facts straight. From the beginning they offered the edited version which highlighted the most egregious things said by PP staff and they offered not only the full version they also had a full transcript.

Undercover videos are common in journalism. Every organization used them and they are legal.

The issue her isn't really who's wrong or right, but who you wish to believe and why.
And apparently you choose to believe the firm that was hired by PP and is known for attacking conservative ideals.

Truth is I believe government investigation and the professional over the sleazy con guy.

Yes because the government is such a paragon of virtue. What could possibly go wrong?

I'm funny like that.

It's not that they don't want to hear the truth, it's that they'll believe anything as true as long as it fits the their internal narrative of planned parenthood.

I would say this totally applies to you. Your posts all indicate that you don't care about the truth because you're committed to your ideology.

That's even worse, really because it give them carte blanshe to attack, slander, obfuscate and slur anyone and anything them deem critical of their views.

Which is what you seem to be doing.
*con men video taping surreptitiously, editing the tapes and passing them off as unedited
*sleazy con guy.

Kinda sounds like your attacking, slandering, obfuscating and slurring those with whom you disagree.
 
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frenchdefense

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You are bearing false witness to the truth here. They never tried to pass the edited tapes off as unedited. That is a lie. Get your facts straight. From the beginning they offered the edited version which highlighted the most egregious things said by PP staff and they offered not only the full version they also had a full transcript.

Even the full versions have time stamp issues on them. The con men say that these were just "dead spaces" in the conversation like when someone excused themselves or when they were talking to the wait staff but, who knows ?
We don't, that's who

Undercover videos are common in journalism. Every organization used them and they are legal.

You know what else is legal ?

Abortion.

Legal doesn't' really matter so much as how one see's things. I see edited, undercover taping by "journalists" (and that label is a stretch in this case) as sleazy and a con job.

I'm not alone in that view.

And apparently you choose to believe the firm that was hired by PP and is known for attacking conservative ideals.

Since they're pro's and didn't the work blind (they we're told who the transcribing was for) yeah, I do.

Yes because the government is such a paragon of virtue. What could possibly go wrong?

I don't know who you trust other then the sleazy con men who took this video and then edited it so it fit your narrative but yeah, I kind of trust the governmental agency that investigated this and filed an open an transparent report before I'd trust the con man

I would say this totally applies to you. Your posts all indicate that you don't care about the truth because you're committed to your ideology.

My ideology is Catholicism and in Catholicism we don't bear false witness and feel that abortion is enough of an evil in and of itself so that trumping up stuff like this isn't necessary to actually fight against it.

Which is what you seem to be doing.
Kinda sounds like your attacking, slandering, obfuscating and slurring those with whom you disagree.

It isn't a slur if they're actually doing it.

It isn't a slur if they're actually doing it and admitting that they are or did. You can call a guys who misrepresents himself, secretly videos people talking about medically gross stuff, edits it for maximum impact and then releases it without asking permission of the people in it thus putting them in harm's way of the more, shall we say, unstable members of the pro-life movement, and call them a hero.

But to me their just con men blackmailers doing con men blackmailer stuff.[/QUOTE]
 
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