Texts that get misinterpreted to imply the ten commendments. (2)

[createdtoworship]

So does this:

"If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us."

Have. Present tense holding.

s

back to the conversation:
Have is present tense, but that is talking about if we at the present time say we have no sin. And that meaning any time future or whatever. Same with "is" but that doesn't mean the same as PIN for "commiteth (sin)"

 

[Seeking Him]

I am no SDA, I am a dispensational Lordship Salvationist (like John MacArther, Ray Comfort, Kirk Cameron, etc, etc)

Have is present tense, but that is talking about if we at the present time say we have no sin. And that meaning any time future or whatever. Same with "is" but that doesn't mean the same as PIN for "commiteth (sin)"

You are SDA.

 

[createdtoworship]

I'm embarrassed for both of you. Neither one of you has a clue about what is actually going on here, one believes in the awful minority view of the SDA teaching along wth Ellen White, and another has a twisted chronologically distorted view of the Bible, I am ashamed of both of you! SH.

I am no SDA, I am a dispensational Lordship Salvationist (like John MacArther, Ray Comfort, Kirk Cameron, etc, etc)

 

[squint]

back to the conversation:
Have is present tense, but that is talking about if we at the present time say we have no sin. And that meaning any time future or whatever. Same with "is" but that doesn't mean the same as PIN for "commiteth (sin)"

It might certainly appear that at the point we say we 'have' no sin, we are in fact not 'in Truth.'

Matters of sin are internal, and not merely external actions. Many confess to sins in 'thought' 'word' and 'deed,' ALL being factually sins in progressive actions, thought to deed.

s

 

[Fireinfolding]

King James Version (KJV)

1 John 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin"

1 John 3:6 Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.

Again from my Greek KJV dictionary (Zodhiates)

"The phrase, used in verse nine, "does not commit sin" is in the present tense denoting continuous action."

"the correct translation of 1 John 3:8 should be, "the one who habitually, deliberately, easily and maliciously " (sins)

the rest of the verses quoted in other post are also in present tense denoting continuous action.

Yes, it speaks of our willfully sinning after receiving a knowledge of the truth. These are written a few ways


1Jon 1:10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

Why?
Romans 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

Then these two show the very same

John 8:7 He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her.

1John 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

And now here (these two)

1John 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God

In light of the grace we are under, sin shall not have dominion over us at some point is how I regard it

Whereas it also says...

1John 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

I had shared this before, but maybe if we examine the various verses seeking to recconcile them verses pitting them against one another could be helpful. So if one saying, I have not sinned (perhaps even in past tense given Christ died for the same) we already know all have. For while we were "yet sinners" Christ died. Even as it speaks of while we were "yet without strength", just as it speaks of the strength of sin is the law. Though it does say, sin shall not have dominion over you, for you are not under the law (but under grace).

So we cannot say we have "no sin" (as in) "in us" (as we all do) or "the truth" is not in us. Just as we cannot say we "have not" sinned (making him the liar. Yet it also says "whosover is born of God doth not commit sin or cannot sin or sinneth not (in the present active) that is shown also.

1John 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

So maybe a closer examination of while we were YET sinners (as it speaks) and that which says we have NOT sinned (even in past tense) given ALL HAVE sinned. Then to the actual presence of sin (within us) but also of the grace that renders the presence of sin (in our members) as having no dominion over us, and the power of the same grace to the effect of the latter (not commiting sin, cannot sin, or sinneth not) as it speaks in the other verses and elsewhere equally.

For example, both are equally true, that if you say you have no sin the truth is not in you,

Yet at the say time, whosever is born of God "doth not commit sin" and he cannot sin, so if we look at HOW these are worded (having no sin) verses (committing sin) and the others a bit more closely might help.

 

[createdtoworship]

It might certainly appear that at the point we say we 'have' no sin, we are in fact not 'in Truth.'

Matters of sin are internal, and not merely external actions. Many confess to sins in 'thought' 'word' and 'deed,' ALL being factually sins in progressive actions, thought to deed.

s

my verses have the word "committeth" which is in present tense denoting continual sin. Not singular. Yours however don't have that word. Yours has been explained by my last post.

 

[createdtoworship]

Yes, it speaks of our willfully sinning after receiving a knowledge of the truth. These are written a few ways


1Jon 1:10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

Why?
Romans 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

Then these two show the very same

John 8:7 He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her.

1John 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

And now here (these two)

1John 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God

In light of the grace we are under, sin shall not have dominion over us at some point is how I regard it

Whereas it also says...

1John 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

I had shared this before, but maybe if we examine the various verses seeking to recconcile them verses pitting them against one another could be helpful. So if one saying, I have not sinned (perhaps even in past tense given Christ died for the same) we already know all have. For while we were "yet sinners" Christ died. Even as it speaks of while we were "yet without strength", just as it speaks of the strength of sin is the law. Though it does say, sin shall not have dominion over you, for you are not under the law (but under grace).

So we cannot say we have "no sin" (as in) "in us" (as we all do) or "the truth" is not in us. Just as we cannot say we "have not" sinned (making him the liar. Yet it also says "whosover is born of God doth not commit sin or cannot sin or sinneth not (in the present active) that is shown also.

1John 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

So maybe a closer examination of while we were YET sinners (as it speaks) and that which says we have NOT sinned (even in past tense) given ALL HAVE sinned. Then to the actual presence of sin (within us) but also of the grace that renders the presence of sin (in our members) as having no dominion over us, and the power of the same grace to the effect of the latter (not commiting sin, cannot sin, or sinneth not) as it speaks in the other verses and elsewhere equally.

For example, both are equally true, that if you say you have no sin the truth is not in you,

Yet at the say time, whosever is born of God "doth not commit sin" and he cannot sin, so if we look at HOW these are worded (having no sin) verses (committing sin) and the others a bit more closely might help.

yeah, thats a good study.

 

[squint]

my verses have the word "committeth" which is in present tense denoting continual sin. Not singular. Yours however don't have that word. Yours has been explained by my last post.

To be 'in faith' is to come under the test of temptation within.

That working is sin of the tempter, within.

s

 

[createdtoworship]

To be 'in faith' is to come under the test of temptation within.

That working is sin of the tempter, within.

s

your changing the topic of what we were saying. But okay. Temptation is sin. But it's not continual sin.

 

[squint]

your changing the topic of what we were saying. But okay. Temptation is sin. But it's not continual sin.

Paul was clear about 'how' that works:

Romans 7:8
But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.

Paul's conclusion of this matter?

21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.

No one makes that presence and working obedient, faithful or under Grace.

We have Grace. Evil present does not.

Easy CUT. Right down the middle. What applies to one does not apply to the other.

s

 

[Frogster]

this whole thread proves the point, sin law, sin law, conexion..as the British say..


if we are talking law, we are talking sin.


The gospel is the power over sin, not law, as all these posts prove, sin law, sin law...

 

[Cribstyl]

Are you guys actually reading my posts? I already said they sinned and those sins were atoned for.

Repost...I dont believe you said anything about atonement. You seem as stressing they kept the commandments, ignoring that "blameless" may signify atonement.

The apostles taught Gods will, and apparently part of that is obeying your conscience concerning law and walk charitably with those that are weak.

Commentary can contradict scriptures because righteousness apart from the law is the New Covenant and the Gospel to the Gentiles.

 

[seekertruth72]

this whole thread proves the point, sin law, sin law, conexion..as the British say..


if we are talking law, we are talking sin.


The gospel is the power over sin, not law, as all these posts prove, sin law, sin law...

No one said the law is power over sin, its only the knowledge of sin. Is the knowledge of sin also sins strength? Is this what you are asserting?

If so then teaching that we should love each other strengthens sin.

 

[seekertruth72]

Can we teach or practice walking in love but not also casting off works of darkness?

Can we say love God with heart mind and soul and love neighbor as self, but not also say flee from idolatry?

Is one good to teach and the other evil?

 

[Seeking Him]

No one said the law is power over sin, its only the knowledge of sin. Is the knowledge of sin also sins strength? Is this what you are asserting?

If so then teaching that we should love each other strengthens sin.

Just out of curiousity young man, how long have you been studying, if you do, the Bible? Thanks, SH.

 

[seekertruth72]

Just out of curiousity young man, how long have you been studying, if you do, the Bible? Thanks, SH.

Irrelevant and against the rules, lets stay on topic. Have you read forum rules?

Do you have a comment about my post?

 

[bugkiller]

No one said the law is power over sin, its only the knowledge of sin. Is the knowledge of sin also sins strength? Is this what you are asserting?

If so then teaching that we should love each other strengthens sin.

Ah yes but that certianly is not what is implied by keeping the law or the commandments here at CF. Keeping the law is synonymous with not sinning and thus the law stops sin or has power over sin when obeyed. Now that is a huge load of dung.

Do you then say that the law has no value? What good is knowledge? If the law is only the knowldege of sin and does nothing we can say so what. It would be like calling an eraser a car simply because it resembles an image of a car. A toy car is not an automobile.

bugkiller

 

[Seeking Him]

Irrelevant and against the rules, lets stay on topic. Have you read forum rules?

Do you have a comment about my post?

I was just curious, forgive me if you were offended by a simple question. Would you like to ask me? I will show you that it would not bother me, as a woman, I know who I am, and am not easily offended by a simple question. SH.

 

[seekertruth72]

I was just curious, forgive me if you were offended by a simple question. Would you like to ask me? I will show you that it would not bother me, as a woman, I know who I am, and am not easily offended by a simple question. SH.

Im not offended. Do you have a comment about my post?

 

[seekertruth72]

Ah yes but that certianly is not what is implied by keeping the law or the commandments here at CF. Keeping the law is synonymous with not sinning and thus the law stops sin or has power over sin when obeyed. Now that is a huge load of dung.

Do you then say that the law has no value? What good is knowledge? If the law is only the knowldege of sin and does nothing we can say so what. It would be like calling an eraser a car simply because it resembles an image of a car. A toy car is not an automobile.

bugkiller

I dissagree. That is only your opinion of what is implied.