Worshiptainment

[abysmul]

The heresy of worshiptainment | Mike Livingstone

I'll admit I don't know who the author is (as in I'm not familiar with him), I was sent this link by a family member and I find it thought provoking.

I can't say I find a lot to disagree with in it either.

Just wanted to share, and see if anyone had an opinion of the topic.

 

[kristina411]

Speaking for myself, I have never had the urge to go to church just to see the music. I go to a new age non denominational church and my husband plays in the worship band, and the music is not what draws me there. Neither is a big screen showing a few passages. I remember they used projector screens in the most southern Baptist churches to show the lyrics to new songs. We are just going along with technology.
We are much more at risk of attendees going for the reputation as opposed to a few upbeat songs.
The music, hymn or contemporary, is to worship Jesus. I love both because I can pour my heart out to Jesus with both.

 

[BryanW92]

Western Christians are born into a nominally Christian society, raised as nominal Christians, and become nominal Christians. When they go on vacation as a child, they skip church because that's not part of the vacation plans. If soccer practice and Wednesday Youth Group clash, soccer wins because if you don't practice, you don't play.

In fact, their parents chose the church because it is close to the house and had good daycare/youth programs.

When they grow up a little, they quit going to church because it is too early on Sunday morning after a Satruday night of having fun with the friends. They get to college and quit altogether. When they grow up, possibly get married, and have a child they start thinking about church for the child...

...and they go looking for one with good daycare.

Most western Christians practice "moralistic therapeutic deism" as a pragmatic replacement for swearing allegiance to God. Worshiptainment does little more than put them in a situation where God and Jesus take center stage for an hour or two a week. That is better than nothing.

Its not heresy. In fact, its really not much at all. But the alternative is nothing. People who seek out the Word, find it despite the worshiptainment.

 

[Andy S. Wright]

Western Christians are born into a nominally Christian society, raised as nominal Christians, and become nominal Christians. When they go on vacation as a child, they skip church because that's not part of the vacation plans. If soccer practice and Wednesday Youth Group clash, soccer wins because if you don't practice, you don't play.

In fact, their parents chose the church because it is close to the house and had good daycare/youth programs.

When they grow up a little, they quit going to church because it is too early on Sunday morning after a Satruday night of having fun with the friends. They get to college and quit altogether. When they grow up, possibly get married, and have a child they start thinking about church for the child...

...and they go looking for one with good daycare.

Most western Christians practice "moralistic therapeutic deism" as a pragmatic replacement for swearing allegiance to God. Worshiptainment does little more than put them in a situation where God and Jesus take center stage for an hour or two a week. That is better than nothing.

Its not heresy. In fact, its really not much at all. But the alternative is nothing. People who seek out the Word, find it despite the worshiptainment.

Could not agree with you more.

And to the article writer:

 

[BryanW92]

Could not agree with you more.

And to the article writer:

Love that meme!! Too few people know what judgment really means anymore and they think that pointing out that something is wrong is judgin'.

 

[Andy S. Wright]

Love that meme!! Too few people know what judgment really means anymore and they think that pointing out that something is wrong is judgin'.

I'd just be happy if the majority of God's people could figure out the difference between personal opinion/preference and Spirit-filled discernment.

I've wondered for years what the world would be like if the Body of Christ had raised up generations of Peters, Pauls, and Marys instead of generations of Simons, Sauls, and Marthas.

 

[dayhiker]

So clearly people can go to church today with a good worship team and be entertained.
If that is all one is going to church for than ya, they aren't getting what God has for them. But that has been true since the 1 Cor. 1-3 when people were choosing Paul and Apollas over Christ or Peter!

I most strongly disagree that church is about the Word, as important as that is. Church is about fellowship with God and people. In those relationships the Word comes alive in our spirit and we commune with God. If I had the chance to go to hear 6 hrs of the Bible studied or spend 6 hrs in loving people, I'd pick people any ways. Because 6 hrs in the Bible would be about me listening to a preacher think what he has to say is more important than what I have to say from all my Bible study. That to me is as bad as going to church to be entertained.

The early church had such an impact on their community because of how they loved each other. Yes, its always entertaining to hear a good sermon then as today. Yes, I'm sure the worship was as entertaining then as it is today and I'll even say seeing the miracles God preforms is as entertaining then as today. But to me the substance is in the love one for another and that's why I go to church.

 

[Norah63]

Maybe most christians got saved long time ago and that was that.
Church is sort of a place to reafirm yourself and the rest that you still are saved,
so they wont think ill of you. Just guessing here.
The music or whatever just goes along with the age bracket of whos running things.
I am older so I tire of high voltage, repete lines, and too loud music.
Dont need to be reved-up to worship in spirit and in truth. But thats just me.
The body of Christ is just that, who ever is a part must work out their own salvation, like dayhiker spoke of.
Its the sharing with each other in love and understanding.
Preachers can encourage with plain speaking from the scriptures and the heart.
That would seem ideal.

 

[Andy S. Wright]

This pretty much sums up my personal belief on worship:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nuYoVjp33zk

 

[BryanW92]

This pretty much sums up my personal belief on worship:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nuYoVjp33zk

Hmm. Its ironic to the point of hypocritical to make a video with eye-catching images and contemporary soundtrack to make the point that worship is not about videos, eye-catching images, or the contemporary soundtrack.

I agree with it, but the irony is just amusing.

 

[Norah63]

It does seem that we are suppose to 'look at' something or 'listen' to something to worship. The church could just be afraid of quiet.... Be still and know that I am God.
The empty space is really not empty when our hearts and prayers are on full blast.
Long gone are the days when you could enter a building and not have the music so loud that it is hard to say how ya been to another. Then waiting to 'be told' to turn and hug everyone you don't know, for what reason? Just another fad that has come along in the way things are done.

 

[BryanW92]

It does seem that we are suppose to 'look at' something or 'listen' to something to worship. The church could just be afraid of quiet.... Be still and know that I am God.
The empty space is really not empty when our hearts and prayers are on full blast.
Long gone are the days when you could enter a building and not have the music so loud that it is hard to say how ya been to another. Then waiting to 'be told' to turn and hug everyone you don't know, for what reason? Just another fad that has come along in the way things are done.

People used to have simpler lives. I was a child of the 1960s and 70s. People just didn't have the schedules they do now. Even "busy" people in those days had downtime when they drove and ate. They had time to play board games at parties. They chatted in the parking lot before church because they arrived at events early. Now, people get angry if you leave your brakes on for 2 seconds after a light turns green. Downtime is now filled with the smartphone, so chatting with someone is usually an imposition on one of the two parties, if you can even get either one to their phone away.

Once they get inside, if you give them a moment's quiet, the phones come back out. You see that at movies, football games, car races, parties, and church. If you want to have a meaningful conversation that lasts for more than a minute with someone these days, text them. They'll text back and forth all day, but in a face-to-face conversation, they will pull their phones out the first time it makes a sound and drop your old-fashioned "conversation" in a second.

 

[Andy S. Wright]

Hmm. Its ironic to the point of hypocritical to make a video with eye-catching images and contemporary soundtrack to make the point that worship is not about videos, eye-catching images, or the contemporary soundtrack.

I agree with it, but the irony is just amusing.

Well, I've learned over the years that whatever you are looking for in any given circumstance you are guaranteed to find.

Blessings Brother Bryan,

ASW

 

[BryanW92]

Well, I've learned over the years that whatever you are looking for in any given circumstance you are guaranteed to find.

Blessings Brother Bryan,

ASW

And conversely, people fail to see the things they do not want to see or evidence that disproves what they want to beleive.

 

[Norah63]

Running away from God and fellowship, running to teck, text, ect... noise and distraction.
Are we satisfied with this? Is God?

 

[BryanW92]

Running away from God and fellowship, running to teck, text, ect... noise and distraction.
Are we satisfied with this? Is God?

Would he be happier if people just stayed home? If you can't find God in contemporary music, then don't listen to it. If you can, then people shouldn't tell you that is it wrong.

 

[Norah63]

Didn't say I couldn't understand the way we have gotten here. Didn't say that it was
not helpful to some, or that anyone told me it was wrong. Just asked if any were satisfied with where we are in Worshiptainment?
Would you want to say that quiet moments in worship with God, in the company of others was wrong, of course not, it's just personal choice.

 

[BryanW92]

Didn't say I couldn't understand the way we have gotten here. Didn't say that it was
not helpful to some, or that anyone told me it was wrong. Just asked if any were satisfied with where we are in Worshiptainment?
Would you want to say that quiet moments in worship with God, in the company of others was wrong, of course not, it's just personal choice.

I was just responding to one post and not to the body of your work in this thread. I just think that insulting a form of worship that may not be perfect, but it is effective, by calling it something like "worshiptainment" is not very productive. Its another form of exclusion that the "good Christians" use to set themselves above the "bad Christians" like celebrating Halloween, church on Sunday, casual dress, lack of perfection, not tithing, contemporary music, bible translations written after 1900, etc. How many threads are devoted to ignoring the freedom of being in Christ and dividing the church over these issues? Too many.

 

[Norah63]

Ere you offended by a word?
I was not, its just a word.

 

[ToBeBlessed]

well I have gone to a more contemporary worshipping church back to a church that worships only using scripture-related hymns. At first I did miss the worship at my previous church quite a bit, but I do find that the quieter time and holding a hymnal book does bring more peace. It's like there is so much going on every day, that I enjoy the quieter hymn experience again.

I chose the new church based on the teaching, but once I really accepted the hymns and didn't fight the urge to like it, I was very comforted by them again.

This is probably a bad comparison but it's like watching an episode of "Happy Days" or "Leave it to Beaver". It takes you back to a simpler time.