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With all the UR threads...

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Armistead

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False.
All that has been PROVEN is that Adam chose to do what God instructed him NOT to do.

The God some of you worship is FAR worse than the One I do. At least MY God doesnt play little mind games with His creation like rats in a maze.

So it was God's plan to remain for all of humanity to remain in a garden. I guess the garden would increase in size as population increased.

You need to answer a few question to prove God wanted man in the garden forever.

Obvious, God knowing all knew Satan would fall, but created him anyway.

When Satan fell, why did God not destroy him right away,,,knowing what he could do?

Why didn't God take away his power, being the most powerful angel? Simply take away his power...and that was that, no evil.

And for what possible reason would God remove Satan from heaven and place him on earth with man with all this power?

Then why put the tree there in the first place..Not there, man doesn't eat and God knowing beforehand he would anyway.

You see God put all the pieces in place for man to fall. It was his plan and
you give Satan and man too much credit for having the power to ruin God's plan.

When we speak of having truth, a better way to describe it is this. Children don't have a real understanding of truth, even though they can be told no, because they lack real knowledge, they still act. Adam and Eve were basically children and they did not understand the true impact. Yes,
they knew God said no, but did not have the knowledge to understand WHY no. Like children, they had no real understanding. That's why Satan
easily tempted them...God already allowed evil in the garden, because he gave Satan entrance to it.

Adam and Eve did not have truth or understanding of God's plan. But it was obvious God's plan that man would have knowledge. In order for that to happen, he planned the fall of man. We can argue why...freewill, ect, but it was God's plan. Yes, they did not obey...God knew that beforehand...please stop blaming them. But not having knowledge of truth, God already had the remedy...He clothed them...already showing the salvation of Christ...and started working his plan for the ages.

You may feel God eternally damned you for just being born, but they truth is, God already saved you before you were born.

God had a better plan than a garden already ordained...the new heaven and earth...and the clear proof why the garden was flawed before Adam sinned was the fact Satan was in the garden before they even fell. The garden was already corrupted with knowlege of evil.

Now, it doesn't matter if the story of the garden, the apple, ect..is literal or not...it's the truth that was being taught and it remains the same literal or not.

That truth is God was in charge. He planned that man would have knowledge and freewill. With that knowledge, man could do evil or good.
We can blame Satan, Adam or Eve, but we are missing the truth behind the story, literal or not....God had a better plan.
 
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Armistead

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It takes time to put it together, because we are unbiblical doctrines ingrained into our minds. I taught eternal hell for most of my life. I spent years using the same ET debate tactics used here against UR. Obvious, most Christians struggle greatly, not understanding why a loving God knowing that man would fall, would create anyway and toss most of mankind in hell. It eats at the soul of all but the most hardened christians.

Even when I accepted UR, I wouldn't admit it. It's scary. You know others
will call you a heretic. However, you find that 99% of them never even studied hell, just believed what was passed down.

I finally went to a debate UR against ET. Now there were pastors with more degrees than hair on both sides. UR so clearly won, it was obvious to all. The ET pastors basically left mad. With all their training, they simply could not respond. Many ET'ers left that day and became UR. I will try and find a copy of that debate. It's amazing. These UR Pastors challange any
group to open debate....but they now get no takers.

If you take the time to study both sides equally, side by side, putting all
past belief aside, UR will overwhelm you with truth. In fact, many ET pastors know it's true and more are stepping out daily.
 
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Armistead

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Hi All,

I asked a question back in post 6. Can someone shed some light?



This was my question when someone hinted at coming to know Christ after death. Anyone care to answer?


I gave you a list, but I will get into better detail tomorrow...gotta go to bed..

But rest assured as the bible tells us...every knee will bow and confess
Jesus Christ as Lord...Believe me, this is not God changing men into robots and making them fall and admit. Even if he did this, in their hearts they would be lying, because it would be forced worship. What glory can God get out of forced worhip...None, no more than a bully holding a helpless kid down.

No, they will pronounce him LORD, because he will be their LORD. They will bow and confess willingly, having a refined heart and true knowledge of Christ.

God's plan to reconcile all of man will come to pass...and heaven will begin. There will be true Joy, no more tears...we will not be robots in heaven with changed emotions and wiped out memories. All our loved ones will come to Christ.
 
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HuntingMan

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Yawn....

Eternal hell vs eternal life
under construction

Assertions/Conclusions of this Article

To show that 'Hell' is a temporary place whose contents will finally be put into this eternal 'lake of fire' and that that place is 'perpetual'.
We do not teach about torment because we want to get even or revenge but only because we want to warn everyone we can about the truth and save them from going to that terrible place. Don't let false teachings cause you to not take this issue VERY seriously.

Supporting Evidence

1.0
Two eternal destinies

No eternal punishment = No eternal life.
From that passage we see two distinct paths, one of which each of us will take depending on whether we are His child or not. It is also clear that the one path leads into the 'fire prepared for the devil and his angels', showing clearly that humans will at some point be put into the same place as Satan himself and the angels that decided to rebel against God with him.
Some use the argument that it doesnt SAY that people will burn forever, but it also doesnt specifically that they wont. Given the evidence as a whole, it seems much more likely that the people put in the lake of fire will face the same consequence that Satan and his angels will who are also there.

2.0
Resurrection to life or death

So yes....ALL will be resurrected.
And what more is said about this resurrection ?
ALL will be made alive..resurrected...some to eternal life, some to eternal condemnation.

2.5
The resurrection body

Now this I say, brothers, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; nor can corruption inherit incorruption.
(1Co 15:50 EMTV)

These who reign with Christ during the millennial reign quite apparently DO have their resurrection bodies since death has no power over them and they live thru the millenium with Christ.
Scripture shows that the rest were resurrected afterward and judgment taking place.


3.0
Torment

And here again, these PEOPLE who take the mark.
Notice the word is not 'kolasis' which is an argument used by some.


Again, context of the whole SHOWS torment....


And here we have the rich man in hell asking for water to cool his tongue.
 
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HuntingMan

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If you take the time to study both sides equally, side by side, putting all
past belief aside, UR will overwhelm you with truth. In fact, many ET pastors know it's true and more are stepping out daily.
What a Joke....
Ive SEEN your so called 'evidence' and it IS a joke....99% of it is taken completely out of context and what might actually be in context is exaggerated and distorted.

The unlearned ones your used to debating may be giving up, but you can rest yourself assured that the TRUE followers of Christ will never buy into this heresy.
 
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HuntingMan

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When Satan fell, why did God not destroy him right away,,,knowing what he could do?
For the very same reason God didnt take Cains life to prevent him from killing Able....because He has given and permitted FREE WILL to CHOOSE.
This UR heresy removes free will entirely.

You folks joke about 'forced worship' but that is EXACTLY what you are pushing....that God will toss people who reject Him into fiery flames till they finally cave and worship Him to get out of their torment.
That isnt love or true worship....that is escaping torture....which is ALL your doctrine amounts to..




.
 
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HuntingMan

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And ironically that is EXACTLY what YOU and UR preach....that this big bully god will just burn those who reject him till they cant take it anymore and are forced to worship him just to get away from the torturous flames.

The biggest joke here is that UR teaches EXACTLY what you folks accuse ETers of preaching....



.
 
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Armistead

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Is a Yawn now a biblical answer, funny.

The evidence of the truth is becoming the hope and faith of thousands everyday....no longer serving God because they must out of fear, but out of love and respect.
Your answers are now just rants...let's stick with the bible. Does it bother you that so many here that were ET have now found the truth. We should
praise God that so many here have seen the evidence and stop following pagan teachings. It's also good to see so many ET'er at least now questioning their belief system....the truth will soon become clear to them.

That's all we can do, is show them the true gospel, the first gospel, that Christ will reconcile all mankind.

I think the angels in heaven sing everytime someone drops the pagan teaching of hell and gives God the glory for his grace.
 
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Armistead

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That statement was so unbiblical, I'm not even going to respond.
 
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Tissue

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I have placed HM on Ignore, and I highly encourage anyone who wants to have a reasonable discussion to do the same. He clearly cannot contribute anything intelligent to the matter at hand, choosing to entirely throw out interpretation of text without reason.
 
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Rajni

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Yes, I did that awhile go myself.


.
 
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Rajni

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Can you point me to the verse that teaches that one can become a believer after death?
Philippians 2:10-11: "... so that at the name of Jesus every knee will bow, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father."


.
 
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HuntingMan

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Translation: "HM wont relent and the evidence he provides is exposing UR so we better not give him any more ammo"
 
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HuntingMan

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Philippians 2:10-11: "... so that at the name of Jesus every knee will bow, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father."


.
Im sorry, where does that say 'and these shall be SAVED' ?
 
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HuntingMan

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That statement was so unbiblical, I'm not even going to respond.
Puhlease....its VERY obvious what UR teaches....even if it doesnt put it on the wrapper.

I think the angels in heaven sing everytime someone drops the pagan teaching of hell and gives God the glory for his grace.
Yeah...the pagan teaching of hell that Jesus Christ and His apostles taught
 
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