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Wise Counsel Needed

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bliz

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As briefly as I can put it...

I used to work with, let's call him, Phil. I recruited him, trained him, worked with him and spent a lot of hours working with him for about a year. Got to know his live in girlfriend (of 4 years) (let's call her Marie) listened to his tails of ring shopping and their discussions concerning when they would marry etc. (He knew my feelings on the subject...). He was doing well at work, especially after his past job where he earned nothing for 6 months while Marie supported him 100%.

So, 7 months ago, big surprise, Phil suddenly quits. No one saw it coming. His brief explainations didn't hold water and then he fell off the face of the earth - did not return phone calls etc. He left owing some people "business" which = money (including me) and just walked away to a nothing of a job with an hourly wage. Very perplexing. Lots of "why did Phil quit" discussions including some of us wondering if we did anything wrong and what we could have done differently.

So, a few days ago I worked with a young lady in the office I knew slightly and we got to know each other rather well with her pouring out her heart a lot (people tend to do that with me) and she mentioned that she was a lesbian and how badly some people in the office had treated her when she was outed" etc.

She mentioned that several months ago she had been in a gay/lesbian bar and had been surprised to see Phil there, who she harldly knew but recognized. Phil was very amorously involved with another young man. She had tried to catch him to tell him not to panic, his secret was safe with her but when he saw her, he bolted. She sent an e-mail to him saying "Don't worry - I'm not telling." He did not respond and went to great lengths to avoid her in the office. Two weeks after she saw him at the bar, he quit.

I have no reason to disbelieve what the young lady said. She was talking to me about the strain when some people know and some don't and this came to mind. My concern here is for Marie. I am concerned about her risk of STDs. He is choosing to participate in risky behavior, but if she does not know, that she is unknowingly at risk.

I have friends who acquired STDs from unfaithful husbands who had no clue they were unfaithful until they had a routine exam. Such behavior is so selfish and their anger over not knowing and the pain they felt was devestating to the relationships.

I am not a fan of running around telling people of other people's sins. But in this case, this sin is putting her health and life at risk.

I can argue myself into telling Marie something and I can argue myself into saying nothing, but I don't feel good about either position. I am praying about this and thought I'd seek additional advice as I wrestle with this.

Advice?
 

IamAdopted

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wow you are in a very tight spot.. I will be praying for you as well.. Here are some thoughts for you.. Jesus said to love our neighbor as ourselves.. Now put yourself in the place of this woman and tell me what you would want if it was you.. If this has to be told I would do it quite secretly.. I can't even imagine if I was her how I would feel to pledge my life to a man and find out later that he actually is gay.. How devestating.. Read the scriptures. We as children of light are suppose to reveal the sins of darkness.. Not to destroy but to bring truth where there is lie.. For with one lie we can really weave a web and many can get caught in this web and sometimes can be fatal.. So it isn't a matter of gossiping. It is a matter of bringing the dark into the light..
 
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LightDancer

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My first thought Bliz is... do you have a pastor you can call right now? If you do, I'd call him and talk to either him or his wife, or both.

Also, I am thankfully through with that ye old "gonna get the ring routine"... been there, done with that.

As my Mom would say, it's "the free milk from the cow these days"? Women are being very naive when it comes to men. I think you should bring this up in the Women's discussion area, if that is within the rules?

If you need prayer, you got it from me also!

I also think your friend could do better. If this man loves someone else, let him go.
 
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koban4max

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As briefly as I can put it...

I used to work with, let's call him, Phil. I recruited him, trained him, worked with him and spent a lot of hours working with him for about a year. Got to know his live in girlfriend (of 4 years) (let's call her Marie) listened to his tails of ring shopping and their discussions concerning when they would marry etc. (He knew my feelings on the subject...). He was doing well at work, especially after his past job where he earned nothing for 6 months while Marie supported him 100%.

So, 7 months ago, big surprise, Phil suddenly quits. No one saw it coming. His brief explainations didn't hold water and then he fell off the face of the earth - did not return phone calls etc. He left owing some people "business" which = money (including me) and just walked away to a nothing of a job with an hourly wage. Very perplexing. Lots of "why did Phil quit" discussions including some of us wondering if we did anything wrong and what we could have done differently.

So, a few days ago I worked with a young lady in the office I knew slightly and we got to know each other rather well with her pouring out her heart a lot (people tend to do that with me) and she mentioned that she was a lesbian and how badly some people in the office had treated her when she was outed" etc.

She mentioned that several months ago she had been in a gay/lesbian bar and had been surprised to see Phil there, who she harldly knew but recognized. Phil was very amorously involved with another young man. She had tried to catch him to tell him not to panic, his secret was safe with her but when he saw her, he bolted. She sent an e-mail to him saying "Don't worry - I'm not telling." He did not respond and went to great lengths to avoid her in the office. Two weeks after she saw him at the bar, he quit.

I have no reason to disbelieve what the young lady said. She was talking to me about the strain when some people know and some don't and this came to mind. My concern here is for Marie. I am concerned about her risk of STDs. He is choosing to participate in risky behavior, but if she does not know, that she is unknowingly at risk.

I have friends who acquired STDs from unfaithful husbands who had no clue they were unfaithful until they had a routine exam. Such behavior is so selfish and their anger over not knowing and the pain they felt was devestating to the relationships.

I am not a fan of running around telling people of other people's sins. But in this case, this sin is putting her health and life at risk.

I can argue myself into telling Marie something and I can argue myself into saying nothing, but I don't feel good about either position. I am praying about this and thought I'd seek additional advice as I wrestle with this.

Advice?
Hmm.. interesting story. Well, you should be straight up with her and let her know that it's wrong to be in that position. Tell her to pray to God and let him handle the situation.
 
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Gwenyfur

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wow you are in a very tight spot.. I will be praying for you as well.. Here are some thoughts for you.. Jesus said to love our neighbor as ourselves.. Now put yourself in the place of this woman and tell me what you would want if it was you.. If this has to be told I would do it quite secretly.. I can't even imagine if I was her how I would feel to pledge my life to a man and find out later that he actually is gay.. How devestating.. Read the scriptures. We as children of light are suppose to reveal the sins of darkness.. Not to destroy but to bring truth where there is lie.. For with one lie we can really weave a web and many can get caught in this web and sometimes can be fatal.. So it isn't a matter of gossiping. It is a matter of bringing the dark into the light..

Best advice I've seen on this...and pretty much what I have to say as well...
 
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mohawk

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This is a tough situation. Before you do anything you need to find out if it is the truth. If it is, his actions could result in contracting aids. If that happens and he is still in a relationship with her, it could be a death sentence. If you are silent, could you live with that?
 
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bliz

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This is a tough situation. Before you do anything you need to find out if it is the truth.

And how do I do that? While I don't disbelieve the young lady, I only have her sighting him in the bar and acting very strangly after that...

If it is, his actions could result in contracting aids. If that happens and he is still in a relationship with her, it could be a death sentence.

Yeah, I get the gravity of the situation.

If you are silent, could you live with that?
Of course not! Hence my concern...
 
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eastcoast_bsc

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As briefly as I can put it...

I used to work with, let's call him, Phil. I recruited him, trained him, worked with him and spent a lot of hours working with him for about a year. Got to know his live in girlfriend (of 4 years) (let's call her Marie) listened to his tails of ring shopping and their discussions concerning when they would marry etc. (He knew my feelings on the subject...). He was doing well at work, especially after his past job where he earned nothing for 6 months while Marie supported him 100%.

So, 7 months ago, big surprise, Phil suddenly quits. No one saw it coming. His brief explainations didn't hold water and then he fell off the face of the earth - did not return phone calls etc. He left owing some people "business" which = money (including me) and just walked away to a nothing of a job with an hourly wage. Very perplexing. Lots of "why did Phil quit" discussions including some of us wondering if we did anything wrong and what we could have done differently.

So, a few days ago I worked with a young lady in the office I knew slightly and we got to know each other rather well with her pouring out her heart a lot (people tend to do that with me) and she mentioned that she was a lesbian and how badly some people in the office had treated her when she was outed" etc.

She mentioned that several months ago she had been in a gay/lesbian bar and had been surprised to see Phil there, who she harldly knew but recognized. Phil was very amorously involved with another young man. She had tried to catch him to tell him not to panic, his secret was safe with her but when he saw her, he bolted. She sent an e-mail to him saying "Don't worry - I'm not telling." He did not respond and went to great lengths to avoid her in the office. Two weeks after she saw him at the bar, he quit.

I have no reason to disbelieve what the young lady said. She was talking to me about the strain when some people know and some don't and this came to mind. My concern here is for Marie. I am concerned about her risk of STDs. He is choosing to participate in risky behavior, but if she does not know, that she is unknowingly at risk.

I have friends who acquired STDs from unfaithful husbands who had no clue they were unfaithful until they had a routine exam. Such behavior is so selfish and their anger over not knowing and the pain they felt was devestating to the relationships.

I am not a fan of running around telling people of other people's sins. But in this case, this sin is putting her health and life at risk.

I can argue myself into telling Marie something and I can argue myself into saying nothing, but I don't feel good about either position. I am praying about this and thought I'd seek additional advice as I wrestle with this.

Advice?


I am not condoning his Bad behaviour, But did not she tell him that his secret was safe with her? well apparently she told you and you have now told several hundred here. apparently he was right to be concerned. Unless your close to her, I would back off. situations like this can be like gasoline and a match.
 
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Johnnz

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I beleive she needs to know what you have been told. You don't know if it is true or not. It is not for you to have to decide that before telling her. Your basis for telling her is that, if it is true, then she could be at some risk. That is acting in love towards her. She can then chose to have a medical 'just in case' and to accept or reject what she has been told. That is not your responsibility.

John
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bliz

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I am not condoning his Bad behaviour, But did not she tell him that his secret was safe with her?

Rightly or wrongly she felt that since he no longer worked for the company she no longer was obligated.

well apparently she told you and you have now told several hundred here. apparently he was right to be concerned.

I assure you, his name is not Phil and her's is not Marie and you have no idea where I live or work or if the person who saw him at the bar really is male or female...
or if I am really male or female...

Unless your close to her, I would back off. situations like this can be like gasoline and a match.

Please explain this further. How close to her do I have to be to make this a matter I should care about? How do you weigh the possibility of "Marie" getting, say, AIDS to your gasoline and match scenario?
 
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eastcoast_bsc

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Rightly or wrongly she felt that since he no longer worked for the company she no longer was obligated.



I assure you, his name is not Phil and her's is not Marie and you have no idea where I live or work or if the person who saw him at the bar really is male or female...
or if I am really male or female...



Please explain this further. How close to her do I have to be to make this a matter I should care about? How do you weigh the possibility of "Marie" getting, say, AIDS to your gasoline and match scenario?

An opinion was asked, I gave my opinion. I see things every day in my life that are immoral. Unless someone is a close friend of mine, I back off. How do you know that this guy won't find out that your the one that ratted on him? How do you know how he will react toward you if he did. Just some questions to ponder.
 
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fragglerocker

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Is there any way you can try to talk to Phil about this first? Not sure how exactly to advise you to bring it up, but it seems she not only has a right to know, but has a right to know it from HIM. Plus, it wouldn't hurt to get all the facts from him before you rush to warn her. How embarrassing for everyone would the situation be if he wasn't really in the bar? If you found out that it was in fact true, and gave him an ultimatum of "either you tell her or I will," perhaps that would get him to own up to his responsibility in the matter. Because in the end, it really is his responsibility to be honest with his partner.
 
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bliz

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An opinion was asked, I gave my opinion. I see things every day in my life that are immoral. Unless someone is a close friend of mine, I back off. How do you know that this guy won't find out that your the one that ratted on him? How do you know how he will react toward you if he did. Just some questions to ponder.

I am not arguing with you. I am asking you to clarify your expressed opinion. How close does someone need to be before you'll get involved?

I'm working under the assumption that he will find out I "ratted on him", probably becasue I'll inform him if I do.
 
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Argent

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Four years of leading this woman along? Hooking up in a gay bar? Leaving a job owing people money?

This guy's a cad, and maybe his girlfriend is naive or a fool, but she doesn't deserve sickness or death from HIV/AIDS.

Type an anonymous letter saying that "Phil" was seen in a homoerotic situation in a gay bar and mail it to her with a fake return address on the envelope that won't raise his suspicions if he gets to the mail first. State that your concern is for her health.

BE AWARE: Phil may very well make the connection to the lesbian emailer in the office and confront her, and she make the connection to you as the letter sender and confront you, providing she hasn't told a lot of other people.

Phil is going to be [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse]ed for being "outed" to his girlfriend. He might retaliate. He is an unethical cad, after all. Proceed with caution.
 
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sunlover1

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Bliz,
You've received much wise advice.

"If" I were in "Marie's" shoes, here's how it might go:

Marie wonders why Phil doesn't seem to treasure her, why he seems to give her the cold sholder when she tries to become intimate.
Which in turn, is making her feel extremely undesirable about herself.
Wonders why she catches him in lies all the time, which is driving her nuts.
Wonders about those hours where he's so long checking a job or (insert excuse).
She wonders why he seems to be keeping something from her all of the time, and why he's so darn secretive...
I can go on and on but you get my drift.

She may by now, after four years, have strongly suspected (due to some feminine sounding guy calling for Phil or what have you), and it may be eating her alive trying to find out but never being able to 'prove' it.

Then again, maybe she's in blissful ignorance, but I doubt that.

OR, maybe she knows he switched teams
or swings both ways and she doesn't care.

My advice is to pray until He gives you confirmation, and then proceed as He leads.
Pray in agreement with your wife if you can, and take from all of this advice.

I bet walking away sure sounds tempting.
What a mess.
:doh:
I will pray for your situation too.

sunlover
 
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W

WalkingforHim

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Find Phil though Marie and address you concerns, and tell him to either be straight with Marie, or you will.

You're right, Phil has no right to put her in this position. Same would be true if it was a girl he was messing around with.

Type an anonymous letter saying that "Phil" was seen in a homoerotic situation in a gay bar and mail it to her with a fake return address on the envelope that won't raise his suspicions if he gets to the mail first. State that your concern is for her health.

BE AWARE: Phil may very well make the connection to the lesbian emailer in the office and confront her, and she make the connection to you as the letter sender and confront you, providing she hasn't told a lot of other people.

Hence why it isn't such a great idea to do everything in the dark and all spylike.

Confront Phil, find out the truth, and then get him to at least break it off with her. No one needs to even know he is gay, and it might be a little easier on her.

To love and lost is one thing, to know that 4 years of your life was wasted on someone who never loved you, that would suck.
 
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Rebekka

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Find Phil though Marie and address you concerns, and tell him to either be straight with Marie, or you will.

You're right, Phil has no right to put her in this position. Same would be true if it was a girl he was messing around with.



Hence why it isn't such a great idea to do everything in the dark and all spylike.

Confront Phil, find out the truth, and then get him to at least break it off with her. No one needs to even know he is gay, and it might be a little easier on her.

To love and lost is one thing, to know that 4 years of your life was wasted on someone who never loved you, that would suck.
This would be my advice too. Go to Phil first, find out the truth, and try to make him tell his girlfriend. If he refuses to tell her and you are certain that what you've been told about Phil is true, then tell Marie.
 
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