Why the 'obsession' with homosexuality?

Beanieboy · Jun 23, 2008

That's respectable.

However, it would also be nice if you would acknowledge that
a) it exists
b) these people claim to be Christian, so I have to take them at their word
c) that they threaten the lives of gay people

What are you doing about it? Ignoring it? Or standing up to them, and telling them that they are misrepresenting the Bible, and the message of Christ?

Or simply going off on a tangent about how Christians are killed in foreign countries?

CCGirl · Jun 23, 2008

People who are so afraid of homosexuality must struggle with their own sexuality. There is no other explanation.

seeker777 · Jun 23, 2008

Here are some interesting myths and facts...basically, these are a direct response from some of the vicious labels being thrown at homosexuals.

From affirmunited.ca

Myth Homosexuality is abnormal and sick.
Fact It is no more abnormal or sick to be homosexual than to be left
handed. Homophobia and heterosexism are what need to be
redressed. The Diagnostic and Statistical Manual, published by the
American Psychological Association, does not list homosexuality as
an illness anywhere in its pages.

Myth Loving people of the same sex is immoral.
Fact What is universally understood is that intolerance and hatred are
wrong.

Myth Homosexuals recruit children into their lifestyles.
Fact A review of more than 30 studies comparing children of lesbian or
gay parents showed no significant differences in terms of gender
identity or sexual orientation; sexual orientation is not a
consequence of "recruitment", or even of parental example.

Myth Gay men, lesbians, and bisexuals are promiscuous and cannot
maintain long-term relationships.
Fact As do heterosexuals, gays, lesbians, and bisexuals form a variety
of relationships, lasting from one night to many years.
Heterosexuals had a 49% divorce rate in 1989, suggesting there is
nothing inherent in heterosexuality that maintains strong, longterm
relationships.

Myth Lesbians and gays could change if they really wanted to.
Fact The American Psychological Association states that there is no
scientific evidence supporting the effectiveness of conversion
therapies and opposes "all portrayals of lesbian, gay and bisexual
people as mentally ill and in need of treatment due to their sexual
orientation." APA: internet web page information
(www.apa.org/monitor/oct97/conversion.html) Those who are
highly motivated to change their sexual orientation may change
their behaviour, but not their underlying desire. Energy should go
into eradicating homophobia so that people will feel comfortable
with their sexuality, whatever that may be.

Myth Lesbians and gays do not make good parents.
Fact Children raised by gay parents are no more likely to have
psychological problems then those raised in more conventional
circumstances. Charlotte Patterson, Child Development, 1992.
Approximately one out of four families has a lesbian or gay man in
the immediate family. There is no evidence that children are
harmed by having openly lesbian or gay parents; the greatest
difficulty they face is homophobia in other children.

Polycarp_fan · Jun 23, 2008

Beanieboy said:
http://www.theologyonline.com/

Try this. Pose as a homosexual. Post for a week or so. Then tell me if how you are treated is in keeping with Christianity. Then, think about what we go through every day.

Here is how I would do it:

Notice I would be quiet.

CCGirl · Jun 23, 2008

Polycarp_fan said:
Frighten? The ol' homphobia neologism at its best. I suspect that you get your position from gay activists and Humanist teachers.

Same-gender people cannot "equal" a marriage. Well, not in a Christian way anyway. And I am on record with not caring what pagans want to do. Just don't do it in the Church.

Biologically and physiologically speaking, there is no such thing as same-gender sexual intercourse. "Equality?" Not hardly. Perverting reality is not equality it is just altering the word "aberrant" for some social and political wierdness. Neologism is the craft of the GLBT culture.

FYI:

in·ter·course

Audio Help/ˈɪn

tərˌkɔrs, -ˌkoʊrs/Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[in-ter-kawrs, -kohrs]Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
noun 1.dealings or communication between individuals, groups, countries, etc. 2.interchange of thoughts, feelings, etc. 3.sexual relations or a sexual coupling, esp. coitus.

Click to expand...

Nope, no mention of gay or straight intercourse, so it does exist. And by the way, why are you so obsessed with SEX?

Polycarp_fan · Jun 23, 2008

CCGirl said:
People who are so afraid of homosexuality must struggle with their own sexuality. There is no other explanation.

This canard will not silence the Church. You can repeat this falsehood as many times as you need to make yourself believe it, but evangelizing the lost is what the Church is going to do. We stay, we pray, we're not going away.

BOO!!!! Doesn't work either.

Beanieboy · Jun 23, 2008

Polycarp_fan said:
Here is how I would do it:

Notice I would be quiet.

Fair enough.
I went there to see what they are blabbering about now.
There is a thread called, "George Carlin believes in God and the Bible now!"

The joke? Because he's dead, in hell.

Funny, huh? What Christian would rejoice and laugh about that?
Someone noted that as a Christian, a soul was lost, so they shouldn't be rejoicing, to which someone added, "Do you think we are commanded to hate those that mock God"?

There is not Christ in their Christianity.

Bring a barf bag. You'll need it.

CCGirl · Jun 23, 2008

Polycarp_fan said:
This canard will not silence the Church. You can repeat this falsehood as many times as you need to make yourself believe it, but evangelizing the lost is what the Church is going to do. We stay, we pray, we're not going away.

BOO!!!! Doesn't work either.

So you do struggle with your own sexuality?

Verv · Jun 23, 2008

CCGirl said:
People who are so afraid of homosexuality must struggle with their own sexuality. There is no other explanation.

That could be true.

Most people I know who do not fear it. In fact, I have met extremely few people who fear homosexuality.

Rather, most people are disgusted by it. I am one of those.

Homosexuality must be a repugnant and confusing act to most people, viewed as unnatural and probably the result of some sort of chemical disorder... There is no other explanation.

seeker777 said:
Here are some interesting myths and facts...basically, these are a direct response from some of the vicious labels being thrown at homosexuals.

From affirmunited.ca

Myth Homosexuality is abnormal and sick.
Fact It is no more abnormal or sick to be homosexual than to be left
handed. Homophobia and heterosexism are what need to be
redressed. The Diagnostic and Statistical Manual, published by the
American Psychological Association, does not list homosexuality as
an illness anywhere in its pages.

FACT: Homosexuality is not common amongst humans thus it is not 'normal.'
FACT: Most people find it unsettling and disgusting at the thought of performing a sexual act on someone of their own gender... In this sense it is sickening.

Myth

Click to expand...

Loving people of the same sex is immoral.
Fact What is universally understood is that intolerance and hatred are
wrong.

Correct. However, wanting to have sex with someone of the same gender as you is not as God intended and is a mental disorder caused by a malformation in the brain.

Myth

Click to expand...

Homosexuals recruit children into their lifestyles.
Fact A review of more than 30 studies comparing children of lesbian or
gay parents showed no significant differences in terms of gender
identity or sexual orientation; sexual orientation is not a
consequence of "recruitment", or even of parental example.

I can buy that.

Myth

Click to expand...

Gay men, lesbians, and bisexuals are promiscuous and cannot
maintain long-term relationships.
Fact As do heterosexuals, gays, lesbians, and bisexuals form a variety
of relationships, lasting from one night to many years.
Heterosexuals had a 49% divorce rate in 1989, suggesting there is
nothing inherent in heterosexuality that maintains strong, longterm
relationships.

Previously heterosexuals had much lower divorce rates -- a lot of the divorce rates could come from the drastic changes people have experienced since the sexual revolution and the amazing way our ecoomy grew.

People became far more individualist.

It is also true that the cases of depression, anxiety, etc. have increased exponentially since the sexual revolution. We live in a very odd situationr ight now.

Myth

Click to expand...

Lesbians and gays could change if they really wanted to.
Fact The American Psychological Association states that there is no
scientific evidence supporting the effectiveness of conversion
therapies and opposes "all portrayals of lesbian, gay and bisexual
people as mentally ill and in need of treatment due to their sexual
orientation." APA: internet web page information
(www.apa.org/monitor/oct97/conversion.html) Those who are
highly motivated to change their sexual orientation may change
their behaviour, but not their underlying desire. Energy should go
into eradicating homophobia so that people will feel comfortable
with their sexuality, whatever that may be.

Yeah, I do not think they can change because it is a mental disorder that is inherent to their birth as the studies showing the malformation of the hypothalamus demonstrate.

Myth

Click to expand...

Lesbians and gays do not make good parents.
Fact Children raised by gay parents are no more likely to have
psychological problems then those raised in more conventional
circumstances. Charlotte Patterson, Child Development, 1992.
Approximately one out of four families has a lesbian or gay man in
the immediate family. There is no evidence that children are
harmed by having openly lesbian or gay parents; the greatest
difficulty they face is homophobia in other children.

Since kids in general have such higher instances of depression these days, I do not know. Perhaps.

Kids who are raised in other circumstances also do not necessarily have increased mental disorders.

I could probably accept that, yeah. I think it needs to be studied more but that is about it.

CCGirl · Jun 23, 2008

jmverville said:
That could be true.

Most people I know who do not fear it. In fact, I have met extremely few people who fear homosexuality.

Rather, most people are disgusted by it. I am one of those.

Homosexuality must be a repugnant and confusing act to most people, viewed as unnatural and probably the result of some sort of chemical disorder... There is no other explanation.

<snip>

Why do you boil it all down to the sex act? Do you also think about every straight persons sexual life? Do you go to a wedding and think "oh boy, lots of sex tonight"? How bizarre. :o

You do understand that a homosexual relationship is exactly the same as straight relationships, except for the genders? That they have hopes and dreams and possibly want to have a family?

seeker777 · Jun 23, 2008

theologyonline really is a trashy place. I spent 3 minutes there and found this nearly immediately, now the poster of this trash claims that they are a former lesbian who is now saved of their wicked ways...I kid you not...now that's some serious hatred.

SO are you saying that out-n-proud [wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth] who claim to be Christians will go to heaven?

Cause if so - I don't think I want to be spending eternity with a bunch of unrepentant perverts.

Seems like if that's the case - heaven would turn into hell in a flash!

This is the hatred that I'm talking about...this is not Christianity.

Beanieboy · Jun 23, 2008

Maybe that is all marriage is to him? Heterosexual sex?

Beanieboy · Jun 23, 2008

seeker777 said:
theologyonline really is a trashy place. I spent 3 minutes there and found this nearly immediately, now the poster of this trash claims that they are a former lesbian who is now saved of their wicked ways...I kid you not...now that's some serious hatred.

SO are you saying that out-n-proud [wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth] who claim to be Christians will go to heaven?

Cause if so - I don't think I want to be spending eternity with a bunch of unrepentant perverts.

Seems like if that's the case - heaven would turn into hell in a flash!

This is the hatred that I'm talking about...this is not Christianity.

I wouldn't want to spend my eternity with another who thinks they somehow deserve to be there, while others do not. It baffles me to see someone sing, "Amaaaaazing Grace, how sweet the sound, that saved a wretch like meeeeee", then point to another, show no grace, condemn them already, and say, "What a wretch! I'm so glad I'm not like THAT person!"

The bible talks about that actually:
Luke 18

9To some who were confident of their own righteousness and looked down on everybody else, Jesus told this parable: 10"Two men went up to the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. 11The Pharisee stood up and prayed about[a] himself: 'God, I thank you that I am not like other men—robbers, evildoers, adulterers—or even like this tax collector. 12I fast twice a week and give a tenth of all I get.'
13"But the tax collector stood at a distance. He would not even look up to heaven, but beat his breast and said, 'God, have mercy on me, a sinner.'

14"I tell you that this man, rather than the other, went home justified before God. For everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, and he who humbles himself will be exalted."

He also told a parable about those who refuse to forgive the debts of others. (Their forgiveness seems to be forfeited.)

seeker777 · Jun 23, 2008

Beanieboy said:
...I tell you that this man, rather than the other, went home justified before God. For everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, and he who humbles himself will be exalted."

He also told a parable about those who refuse to forgive the debts of others. (Their forgiveness seems to be forfeited.)

Good perspective.

Polly, I kid you not, I was solidly against homosexuals just a while ago. I believed it was a choice, it was sinful, it was gross, it was wrong, it was a mental disorder, it was against the Bible and it was abomination.

The change came when I honestly asked myself if I could turn my back on a loved one or good friend who announced that they lived life as a homosexual...the answer is of course NO. That's what Love can do, it can change your mind.

I now realize that I believed those things out of blind bigotry, ignorance and malice. I'm starting to also see that the biblical evidence condemning homosexuality is not quite as clear cut as many would like to believe.

I am also aware that the Bible was used to defend slavery, inequality for women and the stoning of women...among just a few things...the condemnation of same sex attraction, seems to fall in line with the above examples.

Maren · Jun 23, 2008

Polycarp_fan said:
You can't recruit dead people. Even gay adoption can't produce enough of what fuels the gay agenda.

Except homosexuals don't recruit people to become homosexual. Though Christians do actively recruit people to become Christian, so I wouldn't expect you to have a problem with recruitment. Double standard much?

Polycarp_fan said:
And, like GLBT's they have no basis of support for their behaviors from the New testament writings. They have to make theology up to support their position.

So you claim. Other Christians believe differently. Regardless, it does not matter to non-Christians, homosexual or heterosexual.

Polycarp_fan said:
I see why the hatred exists between these two camps. Falsw witness makes anyone bitter.

I don't see a lot of hatred between the two sides. I seem some, there is a Christian poster over in politics who comes to mind. I think that you see some sort of hatred has more to do with you than with homosexuals.

Polycarp_fan said:
I oppose violence even more than I do gay goals.

That is good to hear.

Polycarp_fan said:
MassResstance and Americans for Truth and the Traditional Family Values people literally do this and get labeled as hate groups for showing reality in photos and reporting of facts.

You seem to be accusing me of false witness in your post, though if I'm wrong I suppose you should tell me exactly what you are accusing me of. As such, it is ironic that I showed you that of those groups only MassResistance is labeled as a hate group.

And I'm not stating that you can't find pictures of a few gays acting badly, just as I can find pictures of Christians acting badly. The acts of a few should not be used to smear an entire group -- that would be false witness.

Polycarp_fan said:
I'll get banned from here if I use real photos from these orgs.

Again, there are plenty of photos I could likely find of Christians, such as from a Christian Nudist Camp, that would get me banned here. Again, the actions of a small group should not be used to smear the larger groups.

Polycarp_fan said:
How convenient the ways of the gay agenda. Any opposition is labeled a crime and silenced.

And there is no evidence of that occurring in the United States. No one has silenced hate groups such as MassResistance or Westboro Baptist.

Polycarp_fan said:
How early 20th century Germany that is.

You do realize that if you violate Godwin's law, that is evidence that you've lost the argument.

Polycarp_fan said:
Ellen Degeneres and Elton John may not agree with you.

They might? Wow, that's strong evidence. Perhaps you'd like to post evidence rather than some straw man.

Polycarp_fan said:
Is that the neologism for" indoctrination" being used by the GLBT community these days?

No, but it does seem to be what you are using as a neologism to replace what we commonly understand as "indoctrination".

Polycarp_fan said:
I am not agreeing with you at all here. In fact I would say you are breaking one of the Ten Commandment's here.

If you want to accuse me of something, just accuse me. Instead, you come of as childish. Not to mention, the fact you seem to feel a need to accuse me of some "sin" would again appear to be evidence you believe you are losing the argument and cannot win.

Polycarp_fan said:
Not since the rise of the Gay Agenda from the hippy movement. That would be for the last forty or so years "BTW." Gays are saintly and Christians are whacked out freaks to Hollywood. And that hasn't changed since Inherit the Wind premiered. What's that make, sixty years?

Hyperbole. Seventh Heaven, if no other show (like Joan of Arcadia, Touched by an Angel, etc.), proves that you are wrong. I understand that you have a problem with the morals on many of the shows; yet an examination of them shows that they are almost all entirely heterosexual in nature: Two and a Half Men, Desperate Housewives, Grey's Anatomy; the list just goes on and on -- and none of those shows has had a long term homosexual character (though they have had them for an episode or maybe as a lesser part for a season). Last, television and movies are aimed at what people want. The fact is that people, including Christians, watch the shows mentioned about despite their morals rather than any of the number of Christian networks (I have about five of them on my cable, one of them being a local over the air channel, which further disprove your point about Christianity not being allowed on television).

And that is still ignoring that every morning on my local stations I can find a religious program, on Sunday mornings pretty much every local station shows a religious program -- in many cases a church service. And one of the local station routinely airs the Billy Graham crusade specials in prime time. I've never seen any sort of gay program that is equivalent to religious programs and church services shown on television.

Beanieboy · Jun 23, 2008

When I was 20, I was a pretty strong Christian, spoke in tongues, read the bible, etc. However, I began to realize that I was gay.After a long struggle with the issue, and finding little in the bible, and not having the internet in 1984, I considered committing suicide, since I realized that my attractions weren't "a phase", and was led to believe that God truly hated me. Most of society seemed to. A nonchristian friend would say, "I wish we could line up all f**s and shoot them." In the Church, gays alone were told they were not welcome, and some even claimed that God hated homosexuals, that they were an enemy of God. I remember Falwell saying that it was God's punishment, and a nurse whom I knew said that gay people get what they deserve (regarding AIDS). I felt that I couldn't even turn to God (whom I was led to believe hated me) so I thought I would do God and everyone else a favor, and off myself.

That's what that kind of message does to a person.

Maren · Jun 23, 2008

jmverville said:
That could be true.

Most people I know who do not fear it. In fact, I have met extremely few people who fear homosexuality.

Rather, most people are disgusted by it. I am one of those.

Homosexuality must be a repugnant and confusing act to most people, viewed as unnatural and probably the result of some sort of chemical disorder... There is no other explanation.

Actually, I don't believe this. Rather, I think this is something that is taught by our culture, many other cultures have not had the same problem with homosexuals as we do.

Further, it even depends on gender. Most women don't have that disgust for homosexual acts, not like guys do. From what I've observed, much of it is tied into the male psyche, that a guy allowing himself to be penetrated is not really a man. Many women I know find the idea of two guys as hot -- much as guys tend to think of lesbians. And most women are not disgusted by the idea of kissing or having sex with another woman -- though most have no desire to do such a thing.

Not to mention, I don't like spinach, it disgusts me; so why don't I find people who do like spinach to be gross?

jmverville said:
FACT: Homosexuality is not common amongst humans thus it is not 'normal.'

Neither are blond hair or blue eyes; both are no more common than heterosexuality yet for some reason we don't call them abnormal or disgusting.

jmverville said:
FACT: Most people find it unsettling and disgusting at the thought of performing a sexual act on someone of their own gender... In this sense it is sickening.

Most people find spinach disgusting, yet we don't think of people who like spinach as abnormal or unnatural.

jmverville said:
Correct. However, wanting to have sex with someone of the same gender as you is not as God intended and is a mental disorder caused by a malformation in the brain.

I think you'd have a hard time supporting this belief from the Bible.

jmverville said:

I can buy that.

Previously heterosexuals had much lower divorce rates -- a lot of the divorce rates could come from the drastic changes people have experienced since the sexual revolution and the amazing way our ecoomy grew.

People became far more individualist.

It is also true that the cases of depression, anxiety, etc. have increased exponentially since the sexual revolution. We live in a very odd situationr ight now.

Click to expand...

But I think it is actually because we have started to treat psychological conditions seriously. Before, if you were depressed no one cared, they only cared if you attempted suicide.

I think it is similar to the idea that no one dies of "natural causes" anymore like they did 100 years ago. Rather, people now die of cancer, heart attacks, strokes, etc. It isn't that people didn't die in the past of these things, it is rather they did not have the expertise the actual cause so they instead used a blanket "natural causes". I find it is the same with psychological illnesses today. In fact, some people that live productive lives in society today would have been in insane asylums 50 years ago; advances in medicine and psychiatry now allows us to treat people rather than just keep them locked up.

jmverville said:

Yeah, I do not think they can change because it is a mental disorder that is inherent to their birth as the studies showing the malformation of the hypothalamus demonstrate.

Click to expand...

And yet, the evidence seems relatively clear that most gays are not capable of significantly altering there sexual orientation. In fact, according to one researcher that is frequently cited by the ex-gay groups, it is no more than 3% of all gays that "[FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]might have a "malleable" sexual orientation.[/FONT]".

jmverville said:

Since kids in general have such higher instances of depression these days, I do not know. Perhaps.

Kids who are raised in other circumstances also do not necessarily have increased mental disorders.

I could probably accept that, yeah. I think it needs to be studied more but that is about it.

Click to expand...

And I'll agree that possibly more research is needed. But I will also submit that if the standards were the same now as they were even thirty years ago, I would have been diagnosed with depression and anxiety.

WhatThe · Jun 24, 2008

Beanieboy said:
so I thought I would do God and everyone else a favor, and off myself.

That's what that kind of message does to a person.

That's pretty sad Beanieboy. I totally understand where you're coming from.
I trust things are better for you now?

WhatThe · Jun 24, 2008

Seriously thou. The "Gay Agenda".
You want to know what my "Gay Agenda" is?

Step One: Fall in love, have a happy relationship; maybe raise some kids, teach them to accept all people's differences; and find something to smile about everyday.

Step Two: Stand up for the rights of people who are discriminated against, be it dues to race, sexuality, religion, culture, whatever.

That's it. Oooh, scary isn't it?

Verv · Jun 24, 2008

WhatThe said:
Seriously thou. The "Gay Agenda".
You want to know what my "Gay Agenda" is?

Step One: Fall in love, have a happy relationship; maybe raise some kids, teach them to accept all people's differences; and find something to smile about everyday.

Step Two: Stand up for the rights of people who are discriminated against, be it dues to race, sexuality, religion, culture, whatever.

That's it. Oooh, scary isn't it?

That doesn't sound bad. However, I think that homosexuality should not be recognized through a traditionally Judeo-Christian ceremony called 'marriage.' They should have another name for it.

After all, don't you guys abhor the idea of using a fundamentally Godly ceremony? Many of you guys do not believe in God. And if you did it'd probably be a different God than me so why not use a different ceremony? And if it is the same, how could you imagine being married to someone of the same gender and also being a Christian?

Maren said:
Actually, I don't believe this. Rather, I think this is something that is taught by our culture, many other cultures have not had the same problem with homosexuals as we do.

Further, it even depends on gender. Most women don't have that disgust for homosexual acts, not like guys do. From what I've observed, much of it is tied into the male psyche, that a guy allowing himself to be penetrated is not really a man. Many women I know find the idea of two guys as hot -- much as guys tend to think of lesbians. And most women are not disgusted by the idea of kissing or having sex with another woman -- though most have no desire to do such a thing.

Perhaps, then, the disgust is cultural. That could be true. However, you definitely have to agree that the desire is not there for most people as most people just do not do it -- perhaps there are amounts of natural curiosity but the notion of having outright sex with the same gender seems so utterly alien.

It is unnatural to the majority and the fact that homosexuals have correlations in their brains it does imply that it could be caused through differences in brain development. More studies need to be done.

Neither are blond hair or blue eyes; both are no more common than heterosexuality yet for some reason we don't call them abnormal or disgusting.

However, those are physical characteristics that are even common amongst certain ethnic groups. Technically, if you analyze anything in that drastic of detail you will find different preferences amongst heterosexuals/homosexuals in what they like sexually or what they look for and then theoretically we could make it so everything but the specific sex you like is 'disgusting.'

But we need to treat it as it is... A topic where it is both normal and sensical to be heterosexual; it serves the purpose of procreation for the species and the preservation of the species. Homosexual is counterproductive as it goes against the natural instinct to reproduce.

Most people find spinach disgusting, yet we don't think of people who like spinach as abnormal or unnatural.

Spinach is not as important an issue as... Reproducing. Spending your life with a partner.

If someone said something as extreme as "I do not like eating anything but corn," that would be more tantamount as this is something that is incredibly extreme when it comes to human personality; it is the sacrifice of a defining desire for humanity, the desire of procreation.

I think you'd have a hard time supporting this belief from the Bible.

The Bible is a big part of our beliefs but imagine how history would've been different if God provided neurological explanations of the way our body works in the OT.

But I think it is actually because we have started to treat psychological conditions seriously. Before, if you were depressed no one cared, they only cared if you attempted suicide.

That seems true but it is not -- people when asked about their life and asked if they had ever been "severely saddened" by something respond ifferently; people these days take the deaths of their parents and other loved ones much harder. When I was in a Psychology class I learned about this extensively and retained most of it because it was utterly fascinating. We later brought it up in a social sciences class where we dealt specifically with the generational differences in political viewpoints.

It was really hammered to all hell and it became pretty obvious:

The previous generation simply had a different attitude towards things. Lt's put it simply:

Can you ever envision yourself really relating to and understandign where teh average German was coming from in 1936?

Significant differences in attitude and society exist. They are facts.

Today Americans are horrified at 4,000 deaths in Iraq; in Japan in the 1940s and in america as well families were even displaying monuments to their dead kids that were like badges of honor.

And yet, the evidence seems relatively clear that most gays are not capable of significantly altering there sexual orientation. In fact, according to one researcher that is frequently cited by the ex-gay groups, it is no more than 3% of all gays that "[FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]might have a "malleable" sexual orientation.[/FONT]".

God calls homosexuals to be celibate as God calls portions of other heterosexuals to be as such.

Those who have no desire to be with women in the conventional sense are called to be God's. It is an honor.

Beanieboy said:
When I was 20, I was a pretty strong Christian, spoke in tongues, read the bible, etc. However, I began to realize that I was gay.After a long struggle with the issue, and finding little in the bible, and not having the internet in 1984, I considered committing suicide, since I realized that my attractions weren't "a phase", and was led to believe that God truly hated me. Most of society seemed to. A nonchristian friend would say, "I wish we could line up all f**s and shoot them." In the Church, gays alone were told they were not welcome, and some even claimed that God hated homosexuals, that they were an enemy of God. I remember Falwell saying that it was God's punishment, and a nurse whom I knew said that gay people get what they deserve (regarding AIDS). I felt that I couldn't even turn to God (whom I was led to believe hated me) so I thought I would do God and everyone else a favor, and off myself.

That's what that kind of message does to a person.

The fact is that God loves all sinners and wants them to turn away from sin. Biblically you coul dnever prove that He hates gays. However, Biblically the most clear thing in the NT is the call for sinners to repent.

God wants repentence. Not death.

CCGirl said:
jmverville said:

That could be true.

Most people I know who do not fear it. In fact, I have met extremely few people who fear homosexuality.

Rather, most people are disgusted by it. I am one of those.

Homosexuality must be a repugnant and confusing act to most people, viewed as unnatural and probably the result of some sort of chemical disorder... There is no other explanation.

<snip>

Why do you boil it all down to the sex act? Do you also think about every straight persons sexual life? Do you go to a wedding and think "oh boy, lots of sex tonight"? How bizarre. :o

You do understand that a homosexual relationship is exactly the same as straight relationships, except for the genders? That they have hopes and dreams and possibly want to have a family?

Click to expand...

Well, you cannot really think fo what defines homosexuality from heterosexuality without thinking of the act.

Do not try to turn this around.

You know just as much as me that the average person cannot envision the idea of having some non-sexual, purely platonic relationship with their wife.

Where is your sense of romance and passion for the husband/wife?

When I go to a wedding I do not think "Let's have sex" but I would definitely not go to my own wedding and forget that part, if you know what I mean.

Why the 'obsession' with homosexuality?

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Thinking is not a sin.

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Resident Commie

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Resident Commie

Senior Veteran

Resident Commie

Thinking is not a sin.

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Senior Veteran

Thinking is not a sin.

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WhatThe

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WhatThe

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