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Why do you believe?

willow314159

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Ok so I've been talking to some people here and I have been getting some better understandings about other peoples beliefs. :) But the thing is, all the things Christians believe seem to stem from their belief in the Bible or in God. My question is, why do you believe in the Bible or in God in the first place? I've heard the argument that people believe in the Bible because its the inspired word of God and that they believe in God because the Bible says he exists, but this is circular reasoning. Where does your faith begin?
 

unkern

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Youtube:
"Evidence that demands a verdict"
"Everything is Spiritual"
"Case for Christ"

I believe because, If you notice everything that is considered good in his eyes always works out for the better, but everything that is wrong in his eyes does not work out. God is able to give me my true personality back, He helped me to stop everything that was destructive in my life. Without question he was the only one that said I was forgiven, the only one who showed they cared about me. The bible shows me how to believe in God and God shows me how to believe in the bible. Its an amazing circle of truth.
 
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brinny

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I believe because He is worthy. He awakened in me a far-away memory so to speak of someONE i miss desperately, someOne Who is the One Who reminds me that He rejoices over me with singing. SomeOne Who has a remedy for my 'homesickness'. SomeOne Who understands me better than I ever will, because He knit me together in the secret place. SomeOne Who knew me since before the foundation of the world, and has ordained for me a future and a hope, in spite of a wretch of a life and spiralingly dark, dank pit i found myself in. He is light. A Remedy to my darkness of which i grieved i was in.

This reverberates in my heart like eternitry and reaches my very core and beyond:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uwbps9k5Dj0

and this was my cry:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8N2hB7ENRRE

and He did. He set me free.

You are not required to believe as I do. You asked. I answered.
 
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willow314159

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I believe because, If you notice everything that is considered good in his eyes always works out for the better, but everything that is wrong in his eyes does not work out. God is able to give me my true personality back, He helped me to stop everything that was destructive in my life. Without question he was the only one that said I was forgiven, the only one who showed they cared about me. The bible shows me how to believe in God and God shows me how to believe in the bible. Its an amazing circle of truth.

How do you know in the first place what was is good in his eyes? How did he say you were forgiven or show you that he cared about you?

"The bible shows me how to believe in God and God shows me how to believe in the bible. Its an amazing circle of truth." You have to suppose one to believe the other. Where's the truth come in? It's a circular argument. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Begging_the_question


I believe because He is worthy. He awakened in me a far-away memory so to speak of someONE i miss desperately, someOne Who is the One Who reminds me that He rejoices over me with singing. SomeOne Who has a remedy for my 'homesickness'. SomeOne Who understands me better than I ever will, because He knit me together in the secret place. SomeOne Who knew me since before the foundation of the world, and has ordained for me a future and a hope, in spite of a wretch of a life and spiralingly dark, dank pit i found myself in. He is light. A Remedy to my darkness of which i grieved i was in.

I don't even know where to begin with this post. :confused: I guess I'll check out the youtube videos later, since I can't view them on the computer I'm at right now.
 
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seashale76

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Ok so I've been talking to some people here and I have been getting some better understandings about other peoples beliefs. :) But the thing is, all the things Christians believe seem to stem from their belief in the Bible or in God. My question is, why do you believe in the Bible or in God in the first place? I've heard the argument that people believe in the Bible because its the inspired word of God and that they believe in God because the Bible says he exists, but this is circular reasoning. Where does your faith begin?

That is circular reasoning, yes. I wanted to believe that the holy scriptures were what they claimed to be, but I had some difficulties, I must admit. It does boil down to the ultimate question of whether God exists or not, and how does one know?

So, since you asked, I'll give you some background info on why I believe. I don't consider what I went through to be a true deconversion. I had been a hard core believer for most of my life and never thought I'd change either. However, when it happened, it was enough for me to post a deconversion testimony on a website for former Christians.

It was heartbreaking for me and I really had a difficult time. I did go through my own dark night of the soul. At the same time, I was also overjoyed with not having to go to church anymore, as I truly lost all sense of church services etc. even being remotely useful or relevant to my life. It all seemed so pointless. I saw this huge disconnect between the Church that the New Testament spoke about and what I was seeing in the Pentecostal, Baptist, and independent Christian churches I had gone to every Sunday and Wednesday of my life.

I didn't consider going to those churches that were considered more 'liberal' because while social justice issues are important, I didn't see the point in calling themselves Christian if they were rejecting the fundamentals of the faith anyway. I figured I could be involved in helping others, be more honest with myself in the process, and sleep in on Sundays. Everything I had ever encountered in Christianity seemed to be well intentioned, but wrong somehow.

I began calling myself a Deist, but I wasn't satisfied with that and started researching other religions and philosophies. I liked Taoism, but I honestly didn't see anything else that I considered worth my time to believe in. I couldn't call myself an atheist because I had a few experiences in my life that made me aware of a spiritual world out there. However, knowing this didn't make finding the truth an easy process, and skeptics had a lot of good questions that I began to examine as my own.

Long story short, I was a jaded and bitter individual. I felt I had good reason to be as I had a lot of negative religious/spiritual experiences. I understand where people are coming from who are angry, because I can relate to an extent. However, my bitterness began to turn into hatred of all things Christian, to the point where I started to see that I was becoming the sort of person I didn't want to be. I didn't like myself at all.

I didn't give up my search though. I read a lot. I sent desperate, pleading prayers out for God (if He even existed) to lead me to the truth. It was coming across Orthodox Christianity on the net that piqued my interest. I thought I knew everything about Christianity- enough to know that all the groups I was familiar with weren't going to cut it for me. I found the only Orthodox book at my local Barnes and Noble and bought the beat up and bent copy of it. I read it, I was cautious about it, I tried to dismiss it (but it kept coming to mind), and I eventually decided that I wanted to go visit an Orthodox church.

I was very reluctant to go back to any sort of church again. The first Sunday my husband (who was agnostic at the time) and I even turned around in the church parking lot and went out for coffee instead. However, we eventually made our way in for Divine Liturgy.

How does one explain to someone else about experiencing the presence of God? All I knew was that it wasn't simply my own emotions wreaking havoc with me- some things come from outside of ourselves- and people who know themselves well can discern this difference. (I was raised Pentecostal and I am rather immune to situations designed to manipulate emotions.) It was like being confronted with all of the answers to my questions after my long search. I knew I had to convert. God was there. Christ is in the Eucharist- which is something I had difficulty accepting as I was raised to accept a very different thing as being the truth- but have certainly experienced beyond a doubt since my Chrismation. Can I prove this to you? No. Were our personal experiences enough to prove it to me and my husband? Yes.
 
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Because life is so much better than I could have ever hoped without Christ. I would be a Christian even if there were no reward other than the life I have. Without heaven, I would be a Christian anyways, because the peace and calm serenity that I experience now is so much better and clearer than the life I had before without loving God.
 
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willow314159

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That is circular reasoning, yes. I wanted to believe that the holy scriptures were what they claimed to be, but I had some difficulties, I must admit. It does boil down to the ultimate question of whether God exists or not, and how does one know?

So, since you asked, I'll give you some background info on why I believe. I don't consider what I went through to be a true deconversion. I had been a hard core believer for most of my life and never thought I'd change either. However, when it happened, it was enough for me to post a deconversion testimony on a website for former Christians.

It was heartbreaking for me and I really had a difficult time. I did go through my own dark night of the soul. At the same time, I was also overjoyed with not having to go to church anymore, as I truly lost all sense of church services etc. even being remotely useful or relevant to my life. It all seemed so pointless. I saw this huge disconnect between the Church that the New Testament spoke about and what I was seeing in the Pentecostal, Baptist, and independent Christian churches I had gone to every Sunday and Wednesday of my life.

I didn't consider going to those churches that were considered more 'liberal' because while social justice issues are important, I didn't see the point in calling themselves Christian if they were rejecting the fundamentals of the faith anyway. I figured I could be involved in helping others, be more honest with myself in the process, and sleep in on Sundays. Everything I had ever encountered in Christianity seemed to be well intentioned, but wrong somehow.

I began calling myself a Deist, but I wasn't satisfied with that and started researching other religions and philosophies. I liked Taoism, but I honestly didn't see anything else that I considered worth my time to believe in. I couldn't call myself an atheist because I had a few experiences in my life that made me aware of a spiritual world out there. However, knowing this didn't make finding the truth an easy process, and skeptics had a lot of good questions that I began to examine as my own.

Long story short, I was a jaded and bitter individual. I felt I had good reason to be as I had a lot of negative religious/spiritual experiences. I understand where people are coming from who are angry, because I can relate to an extent. However, my bitterness began to turn into hatred of all things Christian, to the point where I started to see that I was becoming the sort of person I didn't want to be. I didn't like myself at all.

I didn't give up my search though. I read a lot. I sent desperate, pleading prayers out for God (if He even existed) to lead me to the truth. It was coming across Orthodox Christianity on the net that piqued my interest. I thought I knew everything about Christianity- enough to know that all the groups I was familiar with weren't going to cut it for me. I found the only Orthodox book at my local Barnes and Noble and bought the beat up and bent copy of it. I read it, I was cautious about it, I tried to dismiss it (but it kept coming to mind), and I eventually decided that I wanted to go visit an Orthodox church.

I was very reluctant to go back to any sort of church again. The first Sunday my husband (who was agnostic at the time) and I even turned around in the church parking lot and went out for coffee instead. However, we eventually made our way in for Divine Liturgy.

How does one explain to someone else about experiencing the presence of God? All I knew was that it wasn't simply my own emotions wreaking havoc with me- some things come from outside of ourselves- and people who know themselves well can discern this difference. (I was raised Pentecostal and I am rather immune to situations designed to manipulate emotions.) It was like being confronted with all of the answers to my questions after my long search. I knew I had to convert. God was there. Christ is in the Eucharist- which is something I had difficulty accepting as I was raised to accept a very different thing as being the truth- but have certainly experienced beyond a doubt since my Chrismation. Can I prove this to you? No. Were our personal experiences enough to prove it to me and my husband? Yes.

Thank you for sharing your story. :) You say, "I had a few experiences in my life that made me aware of a spiritual world out there." Do you mind sharing these experiences? I'm curious to know.

Also, you say that after you went through your deconversion, you were bitter and angry. I hope you don't interpret all atheists, agnostics, and other non-religious people to be bitter because of your own personal experience. I for one am happier since I became atheist than I ever was when I was Catholic.

Because life is so much better than I could have ever hoped without Christ. I would be a Christian even if there were no reward other than the life I have. Without heaven, I would be a Christian anyways, because the peace and calm serenity that I experience now is so much better and clearer than the life I had before without loving God.

Well I guess if it truly makes you happy, I can't argue with it. In my own personal experience, I was never truly happy as a believer. The thoughts of people going to Hell made me sad. Spending an eternity in Heaven scared me. Thinking that God was watching every little thing I did made me uncomfortable. But most of all, my love of science and logic and reason made me unhappy with accepting God as an explanation for why everything is the way it is and believing in him without any evidence. Since I stopped believing, I've never felt so free to live life! The fact that this is the only life I get to live makes it all the more special to me. Anyways, I guess what I'm trying to say is atheism makes me happy and Christianity makes you happy and I realize there's no reason for me to judge whose happiness is more justified.
 
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unkern

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God showed me what was good in his eyes by reading the bible and seeing it apply to life. He said I was forgiven be sending his son to go through worse pain that my mind could handle, then to die for me, but you probably already knew I would say that. He showed me his love several times in instances by even saving my life countless times. I might be dead today if it werent for him. Alot of things that were very hard to explain. Just as one example I fell off of a 2 story apartment and landed in a grassy area the exact size of my body, the doctors said if I fell on the cement around that grass I would've died.
 
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willow314159

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God showed me what was good in his eyes by reading the bible and seeing it apply to life. He said I was forgiven be sending his son to go through worse pain that my mind could handle, then to die for me, but you probably already knew I would say that. He showed me his love several times in instances by even saving my life countless times. I might be dead today if it werent for him. Alot of things that were very hard to explain. Just as one example I fell off of a 2 story apartment and landed in a grassy area the exact size of my body, the doctors said if I fell on the cement around that grass I would've died.

Hmm... I wonder why God saved you but not everyone else who has fallen off a building. Sorry, I just never understood "miracles." Why when one person survives something its a miracle, and when someone else dies from the same thing, its just like oh that kind of thing just happens. I find it hard to believe God is actively choosing to save some people over others.
 
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suzybeezy

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Hmm... I wonder why God saved you but not everyone else who has fallen off a building. Sorry, I just never understood "miracles." Why when one person survives something its a miracle, and when someone else dies from the same thing, its just like oh that kind of thing just happens. I find it hard to believe God is actively choosing to save some people over others.

I was just watching a documentary last night on the tallest man in the world, Leonid Stanik. He had a Pituitary Tumor which caused his excessive growth. When he was like 12 he had brain surgery, but for some reason the doctors did not remove the tumor (this was in the Ukraine in like the 1970s). Anyway, he had such a bad experience from that he didn't go to a doctor again for like 20 years until his extreme height caused debilitating problems for him and he feared if he continued to grow he would surely did (which was true). Anyway, to make a long story short, after alot of exams and tests the doctor found that the tumor had miraculously spontaneously died on its own, meaning his growing has stopped and he was no longer in eminent danger of dying. The doctor was so astonished, cause there's no logical reason why this would happen. But Leonid knew why, and he thanked God for the miracle.

Why did he get a miracle when others seemingly don't. Its all in God's wisdom. I have a son with cerebral palsy - why does he have this infliction when his brother doesn't? I don't know but I trust God's wisdom in it. When my son was just a baby they said he'd be in a wheelchair by 3 years of age. We prayed diligently for my son, and he grew up praying that the Lord would help his legs. Again, long story short, he walks and you can only barely notice anything off with his gait. My son has learned the power of prayer and we have learned that God is the ultimate physician. Did we get a miracle? I firmly believe we did. So did God give my child CP for a reason? I believe yes, and oddly enough CP has been a blessing that I don't know I would ever change.

I say this cause God uses variety of situations to make himself real to us. Since each person is different, he does different things. I don't question him, I trust him. He has never let me down.
 
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Jon0388g

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Ok so I've been talking to some people here and I have been getting some better understandings about other peoples beliefs. :) But the thing is, all the things Christians believe seem to stem from their belief in the Bible or in God. My question is, why do you believe in the Bible or in God in the first place? I've heard the argument that people believe in the Bible because its the inspired word of God and that they believe in God because the Bible says he exists, but this is circular reasoning. Where does your faith begin?


Prophecy.



No offense to anyone who has answered already, but we cannot all have the same life experiences and blessings. Only the objective truths of the Bible will stand from whatever frame of reference.



Willow, take out any reputable encyclopedia, a good internet connection, and start reading the books of Daniel and Revelation. From no other source did my faith spring to life than from the amazing, amazing foresight of these books. It has to be seen to be believed, trust me!



I believe God has given enough to base faith on. Faith is to be based on evidence, not demonstration!




Your friend,



Jon:cool:
 
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ebia

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Ok so I've been talking to some people here and I have been getting some better understandings about other peoples beliefs. :) But the thing is, all the things Christians believe seem to stem from their belief in the Bible or in God. My question is, why do you believe in the Bible or in God in the first place? I've heard the argument that people believe in the Bible because its the inspired word of God and that they believe in God because the Bible says he exists, but this is circular reasoning. Where does your faith begin?
Nobody arrives at their worldview by entirely objective means - you cannot. Worldviews are a product of stories heard and experienced and (if Christianity is right) in our case a product of God the Holy Spirit acting through the prayerful telling of the gospel.

Whatever worldview one holds to ones reasons are somewhat circular, and rarely do we explicitly know them unless we do some careful and well informed reflection on the matter - post-enlightenment rationalism or postmodernism no less than anything else.
 
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