Distinguish between "plan" and "will". God's plans include planning for creating little gods and giving them the dignity and freedom of being able to thwart His will. His will can be thwarted because he planned for that.
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Distinguish between "plan" and "will". God's plans include planning for creating little gods and giving them the dignity and freedom of being able to thwart His will. His will can be thwarted because he planned for that.How can any of God's plans stand if they are so easily thwarted?
Anything he didn't plan for? No?Distinguish between "plan" and "will". God's plans include planning for creating little gods and giving them the dignity and freedom of being able to thwart His will. His will can be thwarted because he planned for that.
Again, I believe if he truly wishes for something to happen, it will.
But I think it a rare scenario that he -forces- something to happen.
He may set you up for something good, but it is still up to you to make the correct choices to get to that point. If you let selfish desire influence your decisions, then whatever God may have had planned for you will not come to fruition.
what about...
5. Supernatural agency thats not 'divine' but instead malevolent or at least undesirable.
"Diabolical agency", I suppose.
If there is no plan or purpose then how can we explain the order that we find in the universe that we did not put there ourselves?
Don't you see the paradox here? If he planned for it, it must have been His will that His will could be thwarted; so by thwarting His will you'd be acting in accordance with His will... His will can be thwarted because he planned for that.
We use science.If there is no plan or purpose then how can we explain the order that we find in the universe that we did not put there ourselves?
How would you distinguish between that and God setting you up for something bad in anticipation of your selfish choices making it good? Or God not setting up anything for you and just letting you get on with it?He may set you up for something good, but it is still up to you to make the correct choices to get to that point. If you let selfish desire influence your decisions, then whatever God may have had planned for you will not come to fruition.
Yes, it's unfortunate that some people have difficulty or even refuse to accept what is demonstrably true.I think science is great, but it can only point us to what's true, we still have to accept the truth on an individual level.
Not necessarily in just a superficial causal way. I'm getting more at ultimate responsibility. What should be praised or blamed for the various events, good and bad, that happen in our lives?
How does this play out in your relationships? When someone treats you unjustly do you seek justice?
Or do you simply chalk it up to fate and accept fate? Do you attempt to resist fate or fight against fate when things aren't turning out in your favor?
If there is no plan or purpose then how can we explain the order that we find in the universe that we did not put there ourselves?
I think science is great, but it can only point us to what's true
, we still have to accept the truth on an individual level.
As another poster already stated.... Order is a label imposed on a system by humans. It's not a thing that exists ouside of our brains.
Also, I don't see why there must be a "plan or purpose" in order for patterns to exist in the universe..
Are you 100% certain about that?
Because patterns that exist that we did not put in place suggest intelligence, this is common sense
It takes an extra unnecessary leap to say a pattern does not come from intelligence.
What is SETI searching for if not recognizable patterns in signals that suggest intelligent life?
As certain as can be.
Is it, really?
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Is there an "intelligent" factory somewhere producing sand ripples and trillions of snowflakes? Or are these patterns that "just happen" by blind natural forces working on physical matter?
Are you saying the fundamental laws of nature are evidence of intelligence? If not, what are you saying?I understand you view these patterns as natural, but what I'm saying is that there is intelligence behind how and why nature behaves the way it does. These patterns that we see in nature is evidence of this intelligence. You don't view it that way and that's your position, but it doesn't mean your position is true.
Let the evidence point to what's true.
I understand you view these patterns as natural, but what I'm saying is that there is intelligence behind how and why nature behaves the way it does.
These patterns that we see in nature is evidence of this intelligence.
You don't view it that way and that's your position, but it doesn't mean your position is true.
Let the evidence point to what's true.
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