Which Day of the Week is the Sabbath?

BrightCandle said:

What it comes down to is this: Do you as a Christian base your faith on tradition and commandments of men, or on the Commandments of God?

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Bright, the philosophy of the Roman Catholic Church and how they deal with Scripture and Tradition is quiet diferent than how protestants deal with it, so I would think in order to resolve at least the communication problem is to learn the others philosophies.

Chris

Well if that's true, we have a problem. The Bible says Jesus died on Preparation Day (that is what Friday is called in the Bible). That He was in the grave (hades) on Sabbath and His mother and Mary M. had to leave to rest for the Sabbath (according to the commandment) and that as the Sabbath was ending it dawned toward the first day of the week.

So PJW, what day of the week do you think Jesus rose? If you say Sunday then you cannot deny that Saturday is the seventh day, the Sabbath. The Bible verifies it.

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but that still doesn't mean that resting and worshipping on the last day of the week was part of the Creation ordinance. it was the Jewish practice. the Creation ordinanace was merely to rest on one out of every seven days, and to keep that day holy to God.

What day do you think the 7th day of Creation is?

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that's irrelevant. the command is to rest the '7th day,' not the 'last day.' the seventh day is the day after any period of six days.

pjw said:

but that still doesn't mean that resting and worshipping on the last day of the week was part of the Creation ordinance. it was the Jewish practice. the Creation ordinanace was merely to rest on one out of every seven days, and to keep that day holy to God.

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I think you are missing the mark some here. When God rested on the seventh day and then He blessed it, and made it holy. When we read the commandment in Exodus 20 we see the Him telling the Hebrews to KEEP it holy, you can keep something holy unless it already is holy. Then God goes on to tell them:

Exodus 20:10-11 10 but the seventh day is a Sabbath to the LORD your God. On it you shall not do any work, you, or your son, or your daughter, your male servant, or your female servant, or your livestock, or the sojourner who is within your gates. 11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy.

it says it is a sabbath to the Lord, in verse 11 it points back to creation and God tells us about His blessing and making holy the sabbath, which is the sabbath He is speaking of in the commandment. So, I wouldn't call it a jewish ordinance, but a command from God. Now, which day it is can be found in Ex 16 where GOD picked the day for them to follow, not the jews, it wasn't a custom of theirs nor something they just pick on their own, it was a day that God decided they were to keep.

So, from this, the Sabbath is creational, it was made holy on the seventh day of creation, we are to keep it holy and God picked the day.

ok, so do we agree with this?

Chris

Cliff2 said:

I do believe you have the right day of the week.

Now what we need to keep in mind that a statement such as this needs some Biblical support.

When it comes to Saturday being the Sabbath it can be shown from Ex. 20:8-11 and earlier in Gen. 2:1-3

Just wondering what Bibles verse you would use to show that the Sabbath is

"no longer an obligation for anyone. Jew or Gentile"

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Why does it need Biblical support?

It was noted, even by strict biblicists such as Luther that traditionally, the early church worshipped on Sunday.

Cliff2 said:

How were people saved from Old Testament times?

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They were not saved then ,But went to a place,to await the LORD JESUS CHRIST.Then they were to be reborn ,just like us.Eph 4:9 (Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth
1Pe 3:19 By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;
1Pe 4:6 For for this cause was the gospel preached also to them that are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit.
Joh 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

1Pe 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth forever.
THIS IS A REAL BIRTH.
But this time?Of our spirits .GOD is a spirit and we are spirits!
Before the new birth?Our spirits are full of sin! Once born of GOD!our spirits are once again perfect.But MADE after our LORD JESUS CHRIST.A new spirit.JUST LIKE HIS! 1Jo 4:17 Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as he is, so are we in this world.



Joh 1:13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.


2Co 5:17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.
Gal 6:15 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature!

1Co 6:17 But he that is joined unto the Lord is one spirit.

Jam 2:10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.

Jam 2:8 If ye fulfill the royal law according to the Scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself, ye do well:
2Co 4:18 While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.

Gal 5:18 But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law. Rom 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
Heb 10:38 Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.
2Co 5:7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight

Heb 8:13 In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away.

Heb 11:40 God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us should not be made perfect.


Rev 1:6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion forever and ever. Amen.
Rev 5:10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth. Eph 4:24 And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.

Heb 4:9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.
Heb 4:10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.
Heb 4:11 Let us labor therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.

2Co 5:17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.
ASK THE HOLY GHOST TO OPEN YOUR EYES TO THESE TRUTHS!
Either these scriptures are true? or not!
I accept them as TRUTH!
Do you???

Montalban said:

Why does it need Biblical support?

It was noted, even by strict biblicists such as Luther that traditionally, the early church worshipped on Sunday.

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Why believe anything about how to obey our Father if you can't find it in His Word?

Isaiah 8:20 - To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

A person can be absolutely sincere and still be absolutely wrong.

That's why we're told to study and show ourselves approved. Many things we are "taught" did not come from the Word of God. Sincere men can be sincerely wrong.

The Sabbath is Saturday, did we really need 63 pages to know that?

elijah115 said:

The Sabbath is Saturday, did we really need 63 pages to know that?

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Apparently some folks did.

Montalban said:

Why does it need Biblical support?

It was noted, even by strict biblicists such as Luther that traditionally, the early church worshipped on Sunday.

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If I may make a quick note regarding this:
Do you know who Andreas Rudolph B. Karlstadt is? He was a personal friend and co-worker with Martin Luther but strenuously opposed him on the Sabbath issue. In his book, Against the Celestial Prophets, Luther is quoted as saying
''Indeed, if Karlstadt were to write further about the Sabbath, Sunday would have to give way, and the Sabbath—that is to say, Saturday—must be kept holy."

"It cannot be denied that in many respects Carlstadt was in advance of Luther, and doubtless the Reformation owes him much good for which he has not the credit" (McClintok and Strong's Cyclopedia, Volume 2, page 123).

In a nutshell, if only Karlstadt had pressed the issue more then Saturday would have been the norm of nearly all Protestants today.

It would make the topic at hand a lot easier to follow it you would shorten your posts and cover one topic at a time. To long of posts and complex arguments confuses the issue. It is not that complex.

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Bright Candle you come into this thread 62 pages into and then say to me that it is my length of posts that are confusing the issue when indeed it is not because it is indeed that we have been posting this way to each other all throughout the thread .....

Assuming things ... well you know what they say ...

And I notice that palehorse did not answer that last post ..... it had nothing to do with the length of my post I assure you.... as palehorse's posts have been as long if not longer at times to me ....It was exactly what I said .... so I called it rightly

Montalban said:

Why does it need Biblical support?

It was noted, even by strict biblicists such as Luther that traditionally, the early church worshipped on Sunday.

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Not all tradition is correct tho. Because someone ignores the sabbath doesn't mean they are right. We know the change happened about 135 A.D. as can be shown in the Ep. Barnabas. Prior to that we see the sabbath being kept as well as celebrating the resurrection day. There isn't any Apostolic change that has happened, no command to move the day of rest from one to another, no attempt of the Apostles to spiritualize away the sabbath. The bible is just silent, and it was the early church that on their own authority moved which day is their day of rest. The authority of these men didn't come from God but from their own being.

For me, I am Sola Scriptura...not to be confused with solo scriptura(new category for modern protestants) And believe the bible is the Regula Fide of the Faith. And all that the Apostles passed down was eventually written down to pass on through the ages.

Chris

PaleHorse said:

And you would find over 70 examples of seventh-day Sabbath keeping by Christians in the NT.

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Where in the N.T. did they keep Saturday?

The word Saturday is not in the Bible at all!

Normann

elijah115 said:

The Sabbath is Saturday, did we really need 63 pages to know that?

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I find no place in the Bible that says Saturday is the Sabbath, and you don't either.

Normann

Cliff2 said:

There is one problem with this conclusion.

You cannot go to the Bible and show me where you can get support for Sunday as being the Sabbath.

Jesus never cganged the Sabbath, the Apostles never changed the Sabbath.

Sunday as the Sabbath is only a man made delusion.

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Anything to draw people away from the Blood of Jesus. The Sabbath is the next day after you work six days. Twice a year the Jews changed the Sabbath to the following day.

The calendar we use was not designed until the middle 1500's at that time we lost 10 days, off-setting the 7 day week. That if we wanted to start a new false religion would make the Sabbath on Fridays.

If that don't help you, then try crossing the International Date Line, West to East or East to West. You will either miss the Sabbath all together or you will have two back to back!

IN THE MASTER'S SERVICE,
Normann

Seems these 7th day people know a lot about the calendar and nothing at all about the Bible. I have ask several times to show me the scripture that says Saturday is the Sabbath, or even where the word Saturday is in the Bible or even where it says that Saturday is the seventh day!

Now I certainly don't want to be unkind but I am one of those KJV people who go by scripture only and nothing else.

If you want me to go in the right direction (as per your teaching) then give me a chapter and verse.

IN THE MASTER'S SERVICE,
Normann