What's going on here?

[Kimberlyann]

[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]If its true that Peter had a different gospel message than Paul, how is it that we have both of them bringing The Gospel message to these same Churches?[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]1 Peter 1 - [/FONT]

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1 Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ,To the pilgrims of the Dispersion in Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia, 2 elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, in sanctification of the Spirit, for obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace to you and peace be multiplied.



Didn't Paul evangelize these areas?

"... departing from Athens, he [apostle Paul] came to Corinth. And, finding a certain Jew named Acquila, a native of PONTUS ..." (Acts 18:1-2).

"Paul, an apostle ... to the churches of GALATIA" (Gal. 1:2).

​

CAPPADOCIA is a district of eastern Asia Minor, south of Galatia and Pontus, East of Lycaonia, also being in the area where Paul taught. Epanetus, Paul’s beloved, "... who is the firstfruit of the province of ASIA for Christ" (Rom. 16:5).
In Acts 16:7 it is stated that on this journey Paul tried to go to BITHYNIA, but spirit didn't permit it. Paul was also forbidden to speak in the province of Asia at this time, but we know he reached Asia at a later date.


​

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If these churches were founded by Paul, Why is Peter writing them? On the other hand if they were founded by Peter why is Paul writing them?


Notice Paul wrote to them too.


2 Peter 3:15 and consider that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation--as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you, 16 as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures


Peter didn't say what Paul wrote couldn't be understood, Peter studied all of Paul's epistles, and he understood them.
Notice Peter says the untaught and unstable twist these Scripture's to suit their own interpretations. Just like they twist the rest of the Scriptures.

If these churches had already received Peter's gospel, why would they want to hear Paul's gospel? (These churches had all of Paul's Epistles)

Now lets read the next two verses:


. 17 You therefore, beloved, since you know this beforehand, beware lest you also fall from your own steadfastness, being led away with the error of the wicked; 18 but grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. To Him be the glory both now and forever. Amen.


Peter isn't talking about growing in the ability to keep the law better. But he is talking about " GROWING IN GRACE AND KNOWLEDGE of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.

 

[Tychicum]

Dispensationalism is not segregated by "who" but by "when" ...

Peter learned from Paul's revelations from the risen Saviour as evidenced by your quote ... Peter even said that they were to him hard to understand. And that those who twisted them were foolish ...

Sorry ... what was the question ...?

We do not say that Peter NEVER knew ... but that he learned even from Paul ... but Peter at the time of Pentecost had very little information to work with ... even after having spent years touring with Jesus preaching the Gospel of the Kingdom.

What part of this is hard to understand for you ...?

.

 

[Kimberlyann]

Sorry ... what was the question ...?

My question is.
If Peter and Paul taught different gospels, Why are they both evangelizing the same groups of people?

If Peter really had a different gospel than Paul, wouldn't that mean that if he preached it to the people that Paul evangelized that he would be accursed for preaching a "different" gospel? Does anyone really believe that? Peter? The HEAD APOSTLE would be accursed for teaching the very gospel he was taught by his Lord and Paul's Lord?



[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]Galatians 1 [/FONT][FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]1:8 But even if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed. [/FONT][FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]1:9 As we have said before, so now I say again, if anyone preaches any other gospel to you than what you have received, let him be accursed.
[/FONT]
And what if Paul taught the circumcision saints a gospel that was different than they received from the apostles, what would happen?


John says,



2 John 10-11 If anyone comes to you and does not bring this doctrine, do not receive him into your house nor greet him: For he who greets him shares in his evil deeds.

If anyone brought a different gospel to the circumcision saints it was a evil act. If anyone brought a different gospel to the uncircumcision saints they were to be accursed. But even 2 Peter 3:15 shows that they welcomed All the epistles of Paul which contained Paul's gospel. They didn't call Paul evil, they called him Beloved Brother Paul. How then is it even conceivable that the gospel of Peter and Paul and John were different?

 

[Kimberlyann]

Will no one answer my question?

 

[eph3Nine]

My question is.
If Peter and Paul taught different gospels, Why are they both evangelizing the same groups of people?

Kimberly ann....the ONLY time Peter ever went to a gentile is when God dragged him kicking and screaming to Cornelius's house. He never did it again. He wasnt commissioned to speak to gentiles and he KNEW it. Jesus while on the earth commanded them NOT to go to gentiles...the offer of salvation was to come THRU believing Israel ALONE under the program of Times PAST.

Once God set Israel ASIDE...and the program CHANGED, Peter preached ONLY to jews of the little flock (those already saved by the Kingdom gospel) and Paul preached to all the rest, as by this time "ALL were concluded in UNBELIEF, including the Jews".

If Peter really had a different gospel than Paul, wouldn't that mean that if he preached it to the people that Paul evangelized that he would be accursed for preaching a "different" gospel? Does anyone really believe that? Peter? The HEAD APOSTLE would be accursed for teaching the very gospel he was taught by his Lord and Paul's Lord?

Peter knew well enough what his job was. He DIDNT preach to the people saved under Pauls gospel. He limited his preaching to those already saved under the Kingdom gospel.

Peter did this until he died.Acts is a book that shows the phasing OUT of Peter and the PHASING IN Of Paul as the leader.

What you are proposing never happened because Peter understood that God was NOW doing something different.



[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]

Galatians 1

[/FONT][FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]1:8 But even if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed. [/FONT][FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]1:9 As we have said before, so now I say again, if anyone preaches any other gospel to you than what you have received, let him be accursed.
[/FONT]
And what if Paul taught the circumcision saints a gospel that was different than they received from the apostles, what would happen?

Paul wrote Galatians to correct faulty thinking. The OTHER GOSPEL being referred to is the LAW...the gospel preached by PETER that had been set aside with its program to Israel. The any other gospel than what you have received, refers to the gospel they received from PAUL.

Paul was SENT to preach a different gospel....the MYSTERY that was HID IN GOD< and now revealed.

When Paul taught the "jews" or circumcision folks this new MYSTERY gospel, they werent "jews" in the distinctive manner of before...Israel had LOST their status and was now considered as all the other nations.

You are again proposing that Paul tried to covert those already saved by Peters gospel. That didnt happen. Those saved under Peters gospel remain members of the "little flock" and didnt change OVER to Pauls side when they heard HIS gospel.

SEPARATE the two programs, kimberlyann. God does.

John says,



2 John 10-11 If anyone comes to you and does not bring this doctrine, do not receive him into your house nor greet him: For he who greets him shares in his evil deeds.

If anyone brought a different gospel to the circumcision saints it was a evil act. If anyone brought a different gospel to the uncircumcision saints they were to be accursed. But even 2 Peter 3:15 shows that they welcomed All the epistles of Paul which contained Paul's gospel. They didn't call Paul evil, they called him Beloved Brother Paul. How then is it even conceivable that the gospel of Peter and Paul and John were different?

There you go mixing apples and oranges again.

John was not a minister to we the Body of Christ. Scripture tells us who he is a minister to...the CIRCUMCISION...ie: ISRAEL.

You are trying to figure this out with your intellect. God tells us that the epistles of Peter and paul ARE different, and for a reason. Two separate audiences with ONE LORD, but different callings and destinations. ONE earth, One heaven, one PROPHETIC< one MYSTERY revealed.

If there is a gospel of the CIRCUMCISION...which there IS.....and a gospel of the UNcircumcision, which there is...and we can readily SEE (Ive given you many charts showing the differences with scripture accompanying) that there ARE differences, then how can you continue saying they are the same?

That is my question to YOU. Stop...look at the references...LOOK at the differences and "Change your mind"...that is what repent really means today.

 

[Kimberlyann]

I am overwhelmed by all the outrageous things you say. How come you don't offer chapter and verse on the claims you make? Do you expect anyone to just take your word for it?

Here is a scripture that actually says Paul preached the same gospel as the apostles.

[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]Galatians 1 [/FONT][FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]1:23 But they were hearing only, "He who formerly persecuted us now preaches the faith which he once tried to destroy." [/FONT][FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]1:24 And they glorified God in me. [/FONT]

Paul was trying to destroy the Apostles gospel, and that is the very gospel he is now preaching!

 

[eph3Nine]

I am overwhelmed by all the outrageous things you say. How come you don't offer chapter and verse on the claims you make? Do you expect anyone to just take your word for it?

Here is a scripture that actually says Paul preached the same gospel as the apostles.

[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]Galatians 1 [/FONT][FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]1:23 But they were hearing only, "He who formerly persecuted us now preaches the faith which he once tried to destroy." [/FONT][FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]1:24 And they glorified God in me. [/FONT]

Paul was trying to destroy the Apostles gospel, and that is the very gospel he is now preaching!

Kimberlyann...stick to the topic at hand. Scriptures HAVE been given and ignored. So ....fool me once, shame on YOU, fool me twice, shame on ME.

That scripture doesnt say what you think at all. You have a very odd way of studying the scriptures. It is called PROOF texting...taking verses OUT of context to prove an otherwise unproveable point.

Paul tried to destroy the KINGDOM church. He then was met and confronted on the road to Damascus with the RISEN Lord with a NEW revelation given FIRST to him.

Do you not read the rest of the Word in Context?

Im not going to give you scripture ON DEMAND until you look at what has already been provided and change your MIND. You are all over the map with no clear cut bible study methods except look up a word thats similar and assume its the same thing. Thats NOT proper bible study.

YOU are the one who will be held accountable for poor bible study habits...not me. And I am not responsible to do YOUR homework FOR YOU. Enuff has been provided for you to make an intelligent change of mind...you have determined to go your own way. I respect that choice.

None of the statements I make are without scriptural support. It is up to YOU to get the proper information, which most of which has already been provided.

You simply arent interested. Lets be honest.

 

[Kimberlyann]

Kimberlyann...stick to the topic at hand. Scriptures HAVE been given and ignored. So ....fool me once, shame on YOU, fool me twice, shame on ME.

Ignored? You haven't posted one scripture in this thread. I'm not going to follow you around this board searching for the scriptures that you say you have given. I don't have the time to read every one of your 2,800 and some posts.

Lets suppose for a minute that what you say is true, that Peter and Paul really did preach Different gospels. That might create a few problems. First, it would mean that not only did they have different gospels from each other, but also that each one would had to of had their own separate or different gospels as well. Peter would of had to have two different gospels and Paul would of had to of had two different gospels. Because Paul often went to the Jew first (which according to theory) would of required one gospel, and then when he taught the Gentiles, he would of needed a second different gospel. And since Peter went primarily to the Jews, he would of needed one gospel for them, but since he also was the first apostle to go to the Gentiles, he would have also need a second different gospel for them! Did Paul carry two gospels with him one in each pocket? Think about it, Picture Paul in a Synagogue in Thessalonia teaching the gospel. What gospel, or which gospel? If Paul is teaching Jews in a Jewish Synagogue, how is it that some Jews many Gentiles believed? Did Paul take the Gentiles aside and tell them the things he said to the Jews didn't have anything to do with them? That he had a different gospel for them? That's nonsense.

 

[eph3Nine]

Question: Acts 15 Are the circumcision saved the same way that the uncircumcision are?

• Acts 15:7. And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe. 8. And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us; 9. And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith. 10. Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear? 11. But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.

It sounds to me like Peter is saying there is no difference a phrase Paul himself uses when speaking on salvation " there is NOW no difference" etc. peter says both are saved by grace and faith.. we could not bare the law just as our fathers could not..

• I know other scripture points out explicitly that the circumcision believers could lose there salvation, so what am i missing here?

Answer:

1. In Acts 15:11, Peter may seem to be saying that they were saved the same way as we are, but that is true only partially. We can see three things that are the same if we consider some of the content of both gospels.

In every dispensation people are saved by God&#8217;s grace.

1. In every dispensation people are saved by Jesus Christ&#8217;s faithfulness in going to the cross to die for our sins.
2. In every dispensation people are saved by their belief/trust in what God says.
3. But Peter&#8217;s message has something in addition to these three points. What did Peter preach as far as his sermon content? In his first sermon after Christ ascended, he showed that water baptism was necessary to these men of Israel to be saved on Pentecost in Acts 2:22-24,30-38: &#8220;Men of Israel, hear these words: Jesus of Nazareth, a Man attested by God to you by miracles, wonders, and signs which God did through Him in your midst, as you yourselves also know; 23 Him, being delivered by the determined purpose and foreknowledge of God, you have taken by lawless hands, have crucified, and put to death; 24 whom God raised up, having loosed the pains of death, because it was not possible that He should be held by it. 30 Therefore, being a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn with an oath to him that of the fruit of his body, according to the flesh, He would raise up the Christ to sit on his throne, 31 he, foreseeing this, spoke concerning the resurrection of the Christ, that His soul was not left in Hades, nor did His flesh see corruption. 32 This Jesus God has raised up, of which we are all witnesses. 33 Therefore being exalted to the right hand of God, and having received from the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit, He poured out this which you now see and hear. 34 For David did not ascend into the heavens, but he says himself: The LORD said to my Lord, Sit at My right hand, 35 Till I make Your enemies Your footstool. 36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly that God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, both Lord and Christ. 37 Now when they heard this, they were cut to the heart, and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles, &#8216;Men and brethren, what shall we do?&#8217; 38 Then Peter said to them, &#8216;Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.&#8217;&#8221;
4. Also, what did Peter preach when he went to Cornelius in Acts 10:34-43? Works of righteousness. Peter opened his mouth and said: &#8220;In truth I perceive that God shows no partiality. 35 But in every nation whoever fears Him and works righteousness is accepted by Him. 36 The word which God sent to the children of Israel, preaching peace through Jesus Christ; He is Lord of all; 37 that word you know, which was proclaimed throughout all Judea, and began from Galilee after the baptism which John preached: 38 how God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Spirit and with power, who went about doing good and healing all who were oppressed by the devil, for God was with Him. 39 And we are witnesses of all things which He did both in the land of the Jews and in Jerusalem, whom they killed by hanging on a tree. 40 Him God raised up on the third day, and showed Him openly, 41 not to all the people, but to witnesses chosen before by God, even to us who ate and drank with Him after He arose from the dead. 42 And He commanded us to preach to the people, and to testify that it is He who was ordained by God to be Judge of the living and the dead. 43 To Him all the prophets witness that, through His name, whoever believes in Him will receive remission of sins.&#8221;
5. God stopped Peter right there, before he could command them to be water baptized as part of the method of salvation. I believe God did that because He had started the new dispensation of grace with the salvation of Paul in the previous chapter.
6. Then, later, when Peter was at the council of Jerusalem in Acts 15:7-11, after there had been much dispute, Peter rose up and said to them: &#8220;Men and brethren, you know that a good while ago God chose among us, that by my mouth the Gentiles should hear the word of the gospel and believe. 8 So God, who knows the heart, acknowledged them by giving them the Holy Spirit, just as He did to us, 9 and made no distinction between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith. 10 Now therefore, why do you test God by putting a yoke on the neck of the disciples which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear? 11 But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved in the same manner as they [we believe to be saved in the same manner as they].
7. The means of our salvation is the same as theirs. Christ died for our sins as well as theirs. We have to believe. So do they. It is God&#8217;s grace in every dispensation. Those three things are necessary in every dispensation, but the method is different. The method is what changes from dispensation to dispensation. Now, let&#8217;s look at the method of salvation in that dispensation when the circumcision gospel was preached.
8. In Acts 2:37,38 Now when they heard this, they were cut to the heart, and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles, &#8220;Men and brethren, what shall we do?&#8221; 38 Then Peter said to them, &#8220;Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins&#8221;; [After they were water baptized, they received the Holy spirit, not before.] and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
9. In Peter&#8217;s first epistle, he continued with the water baptism as one point necessary for salvation under that dispensation. 1 Pet 3:21 There is also an antitype which now saves us; baptism (not the removal of the filth of the flesh, (This shows us this was water baptism. The water washing off the dirt from the body had no significance.) but the answer of a good conscience toward God, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ.
10. THEY (the JEWS/the Circumcision/the Kingdom believers and NOT the Body of Christ...that was still a MYSTERY) had to do certain things to make their election sure in 2 Peter. 2 Pet 1:10 Therefore, brethren, be even more diligent to make your call and election sure, for if (the conditional "if" was always a part of Israels program...NOT ours) you do these things you will never stumble; 11 (If they endure in these things they will get an entrance into the everlasting kingdom. We have already been transferred into the kingdom of His dear Son, Col 1:13.) for so an entrance will be supplied to you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.
11. They (the Jews/the Circumcision of times PAST and ages to come) can lose their state of salvation if they are entangled in their sins again. 2 Pet 2:20 For if, after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the latter end is worse for them than the beginning.
12. In contrast, what method of salvation did Paul preach as far as content? In Acts 13:38,39, Paul preached, &#8220;Therefore let it be known to you, brethren, that through this Man is preached to you the forgiveness of sins; 39 and by Him everyone who believes is justified from all things from which you could not be justified by the law of Moses.&#8221; Similarly in Acts 16:30-32 And he brought them out and said, &#8220;Sirs, what must I do to be saved?&#8221; 31 So they said, &#8220;Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved, you and your household.&#8221; 32 Then they spoke the word of the Lord to him and to all who were in his house.
13. No rituals of circumcision or baptism for salvation, just, &#8220;Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved, you and your household.&#8221; He wrote the same way in Romans. Rom 3:21,22 But now the righteousness of God apart from the law is revealed, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets, 22 even the righteousness of God, through faith in Jesus Christ, to all and on all who believe. For there is no difference.
14. The gospel in a nut shell is in Rom 10:9 that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.
15. Now, when we get to the method, in contrast to Peter&#8217;s &#8220;be even more diligent to make your call and election sure,&#8221; Paul wrote in 1 Co 3:15, &#8220;If anyone&#8217;s work is burned, he will suffer loss; but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire.&#8221; There are no works necessary for salvation. Titus 3:4-7 But when the kindness and the love of God our Savior toward man appeared, 5 not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit, 6 whom He poured out on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Savior, 7 that having been justified by His grace we should become heirs according to the hope of eternal life.
16. Paul also was the one who received the stewardship for today. Eph 3:1-9 For this reason I, Paul, the prisoner of Christ Jesus for you Gentiles; 2 if indeed you have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which was given to me for you (The dispensation of grace/mystery was given directly to Paul. He then told the Circumcision Apostles, and the Holy Spirit revealed it to them.), 3 how that by revelation He made known to me the mystery (as I have briefly written already, 4 by which, when you read, you may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ), 5 which in other ages was not made known to the sons of men, as it has now been revealed by the Spirit to His holy apostles and prophets: 6 that the Gentiles should be fellow heirs, of the same body, and partakers of His promise in Christ through the gospel, 7 of which I became a minister according to the gift of the grace of God given to me by the effective working of His power. 8 To me, who am less than the least of all the saints, this grace was given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ, 9 and to make all see what is the dispensation of the mystery, which from the beginning of the ages has been hidden in God who created all things through Jesus Christ.
17. So, much of the content is the same, but there is a rite of water baptism and endurance unto salvation that will be revealed, if they endure, for the circumcision believers.

 

[A Brother In Christ]

My question is.
If Peter and Paul taught different gospels, Why are they both evangelizing the same groups of people?

If Peter really had a different gospel than Paul, wouldn't that mean that if he preached it to the people that Paul evangelized that he would be accursed for preaching a "different" gospel? Does anyone really believe that? Peter? The HEAD APOSTLE would be accursed for teaching the very gospel he was taught by his Lord and Paul's Lord?



[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]Galatians 1 [/FONT][FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]1:8 But even if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed. [/FONT][FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]1:9 As we have said before, so now I say again, if anyone preaches any other gospel to you than what you have received, let him be accursed.
[/FONT]
And what if Paul taught the circumcision saints a gospel that was different than they received from the apostles, what would happen?


John says,



2 John 10-11 If anyone comes to you and does not bring this doctrine, do not receive him into your house nor greet him: For he who greets him shares in his evil deeds.

If anyone brought a different gospel to the circumcision saints it was a evil act. If anyone brought a different gospel to the uncircumcision saints they were to be accursed. But even 2 Peter 3:15 shows that they welcomed All the epistles of Paul which contained Paul's gospel. They didn't call Paul evil, they called him Beloved Brother Paul. How then is it even conceivable that the gospel of Peter and Paul and John were different?

awesome

 

[A Brother In Christ]

Im not going to give you scripture ON DEMAND until you look at what has already been provided and change your MIND. You are all over the map with no clear cut bible study methods except look up a word thats similar and assume its the same thing. Thats NOT proper bible study.

And I am not responsible to do YOUR homework FOR YOU. .

where is the love of scripture ... same story right back at you she did the homework and offered scripture yet you ignore God word

 

[A Brother In Christ]

Question: Acts 15 Are the circumcision saved the same way that the uncircumcision are?

eph 2:8 For by grace are you saved through faith and not of yourselves: it is the gift of God.


Noah had different object of faith than us..

• Acts 15:7. And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe. 8. And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us; 9. And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith. 10. Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear? 11. But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.

It sounds to me like Peter is saying there is no difference a phrase Paul himself uses when speaking on salvation " there is NOW no difference" etc. peter says both are saved by grace and faith.. we could not bare the law just as our fathers could not..

• I know other scripture points out explicitly that the circumcision believers could lose there salvation, so what am i missing here?

Answer:

1. In Acts 15:11, Peter may seem to be saying that they were saved the same way as we are, but that is true only partially. We can see three things that are the same if we consider some of the content of both gospels.

In every dispensation people are saved by God&#8217;s grace.

1. In every dispensation people are saved by Jesus Christ&#8217;s faithfulness in going to the cross to die for our sins.
2. In every dispensation people are saved by their belief/trust in what God says.
3. But Peter&#8217;s message has something in addition to these three points. What did Peter preach as far as his sermon content? In his first sermon after Christ ascended, he showed that water baptism was necessary to these men of Israel to be saved on Pentecost in Acts 2:22-24,30-38:

1. does not ... if one believes they will[it is logical] obey their master

   &#8220;Men of Israel, hear these words: Jesus of Nazareth, a Man attested by God to you by miracles, wonders, and signs which God did through Him in your midst, as you yourselves also know; 23 Him, being delivered by the determined purpose and foreknowledge of God, you have taken by lawless hands, have crucified, and put to death; 24 whom God raised up, having loosed the pains of death, because it was not possible that He should be held by it. 30 Therefore, being a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn with an oath to him that of the fruit of his body, according to the flesh, He would raise up the Christ to sit on his throne, 31 he, foreseeing this, spoke concerning the resurrection of the Christ, that His soul was not left in Hades, nor did His flesh see corruption. 32 This Jesus God has raised up, of which we are all witnesses. 33 Therefore being exalted to the right hand of God, and having received from the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit, He poured out this which you now see and hear. 34 For David did not ascend into the heavens, but he says himself: The LORD said to my Lord, Sit at My right hand, 35 Till I make Your enemies Your footstool. 36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly that God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, both Lord and Christ. 37 Now when they heard this, they were cut to the heart, and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles, &#8216;Men and brethren, what shall we do?&#8217; 38 Then Peter said to them, &#8216;Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.&#8217;&#8221;

   acts is transitional book between OT believer becoming NT believers and gentile who had no hope understand God... how they Got the spirit changes depending what they needed to change their minds on a certain subject

   [*]Also, what did Peter preach when he went to Cornelius in Acts 10:34-43? Works of righteousness. Peter opened his mouth and said: &#8220;In truth I perceive that God shows no partiality. 35 But in every nation whoever fears Him and works righteousness is accepted by Him.

   how does a [romans3:23,4:5]unrighteous man do works of righteousnees of God romans 6:11-13, 1 cor 7:20-24

   36 The word which God sent to the children of Israel, preaching peace through Jesus Christ; He is Lord of all; 37 that word you know, which was proclaimed throughout all Judea, and began from Galilee after the baptism which John preached: 38 how God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Spirit and with power, who went about doing good and healing all who were oppressed by the devil, for God was with Him. 39 And we are witnesses of all things which He did both in the land of the Jews and in Jerusalem, whom they killed by hanging on a tree. 40 Him God raised up on the third day, and showed Him openly, 41 not to all the people, but to witnesses chosen before by God, even to us who ate and drank with Him after He arose from the dead. 42 And He commanded us to preach to the people, and to testify that it is He who was ordained by God to be Judge of the living and the dead. 43 To Him all the prophets witness that, through His name, whoever believes in Him will receive remission of sins.&#8221;
   [*]God stopped Peter right there, before he could command them to be water baptized as part of the method of salvation. I believe God did that because He had started the new dispensation of grace with the salvation of Paul in the previous chapter.

   So did the OT believers have God inside of them... I thought that since Jesus stated this would be a sign of a new dispensation. john 14:20-21 acts 2:2-14 yet Paul was not saved yet ... not a big deal ..God is Good

   [*]Then, later, when Peter was at the council of Jerusalem in Acts 15:7-11, after there had been much dispute, Peter rose up and said to them: &#8220;Men and brethren, you know that a good while ago God chose among us, that by my mouth the Gentiles should hear the word of the gospel and believe. 8 So God, who knows the heart, acknowledged them by giving them the Holy Spirit, just as He did to us, 9 and made no distinction between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith. 10 Now therefore, why do you test God by putting a yoke on the neck of the disciples which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear? 11 But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved in the same manner as they [we believe to be saved in the same manner as they].
   [*]The means of our salvation is the same as theirs. Christ died for our sins as well as theirs. We have to believe. So do they. It is God&#8217;s grace in every dispensation. Those three things are necessary in every dispensation, but the method is different. The method is what changes from dispensation to dispensation. Now, let&#8217;s look at the method of salvation in that dispensation when the circumcision gospel was preached.
   [*]In Acts 2:37,38 Now when they heard this, they were cut to the heart, and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles, &#8220;Men and brethren, what shall we do?&#8221; 38 Then Peter said to them, &#8220;Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins&#8221;; [After they were water baptized, they received the Holy spirit, not before.] and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
   [*]In Peter&#8217;s first epistle, he continued with the water baptism as one point necessary for salvation under that dispensation. 1 Pet 3:21 There is also an antitype which now saves us; baptism (not the removal of the filth of the flesh, (This shows us this was water baptism. The water washing off the dirt from the body had no significance.) but the answer of a good conscience toward God, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ.
   [*]THEY (the JEWS/the Circumcision/the Kingdom believers and NOT the Body of Christ...that was still a MYSTERY) had to do certain things to make their election sure in 2 Peter. 2 Pet 1:10 Therefore, brethren, be even more diligent to make your call and election sure, for if (the conditional "if" was always a part of Israels program...NOT ours) you do these things you will never stumble; 11 (If they endure in these things they will get an entrance into the everlasting kingdom. We have already been transferred into the kingdom of His dear Son, Col 1:13.) for so an entrance will be supplied to you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.
   [*]They (the Jews/the Circumcision of times PAST and ages to come) can lose their state of salvation if they are entangled in their sins again. 2 Pet 2:20 For if, after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the latter end is worse for them than the beginning.
   [*]In contrast, what method of salvation did Paul preach as far as content? In Acts 13:38,39, Paul preached, &#8220;Therefore let it be known to you, brethren, that through this Man is preached to you the forgiveness of sins; 39 and by Him everyone who believes is justified from all things from which you could not be justified by the law of Moses.&#8221; Similarly in Acts 16:30-32 And he brought them out and said, &#8220;Sirs, what must I do to be saved?&#8221; 31 So they said, &#8220;Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved, you and your household.&#8221; 32 Then they spoke the word of the Lord to him and to all who were in his house.
   [*]No rituals of circumcision or baptism for salvation, just, &#8220;Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved, you and your household.&#8221; He wrote the same way in Romans. Rom 3:21,22 But now the righteousness of God apart from the law is revealed, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets, 22 even the righteousness of God, through faith in Jesus Christ, to all and on all who believe. For there is no difference.
   [*]The gospel in a nut shell is in Rom 10:9 that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.
   [*]Now, when we get to the method, in contrast to Peter&#8217;s &#8220;be even more diligent to make your call and election sure,&#8221; Paul wrote in 1 Co 3:15, &#8220;If anyone&#8217;s work is burned, he will suffer loss; but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire.&#8221; There are no works necessary for salvation. Titus 3:4-7 But when the kindness and the love of God our Savior toward man appeared, 5 not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit, 6 whom He poured out on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Savior, 7 that having been justified by His grace we should become heirs according to the hope of eternal life.
   [*]Paul also was the one who received the stewardship for today. Eph 3:1-9 For this reason I, Paul, the prisoner of Christ Jesus for you Gentiles; 2 if indeed you have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which was given to me for you (The dispensation of grace/mystery was given directly to Paul. He then told the Circumcision Apostles, and the Holy Spirit revealed it to them.), 3 how that by revelation He made known to me the mystery (as I have briefly written already, 4 by which, when you read, you may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ), 5 which in other ages was not made known to the sons of men, as it has now been revealed by the Spirit to His holy apostles and prophets: 6 that the Gentiles should be fellow heirs, of the same body, and partakers of His promise in Christ through the gospel, 7 of which I became a minister according to the gift of the grace of God given to me by the effective working of His power. 8 To me, who am less than the least of all the saints, this grace was given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ, 9 and to make all see what is the dispensation of the mystery, which from the beginning of the ages has been hidden in God who created all things through Jesus Christ.
   [*]So, much of the content is the same, but there is a rite of water baptism and endurance unto salvation that will be revealed, if they endure, for the circumcision believers.

Never mind I am too tired

 

[eph3Nine]

where is the love of scripture ... same story right back at you she did the homework and offered scripture yet you ignore God word

Something can be scriptural but NOT dispensational. Noah building an ark is scriptural but not applicable to ME today...NOT my instructions. Peters message and ministry was wonderful and TRUE...but NOT true for ME today. I beg to differ...she didnt do her homework. Her homework is to preach Jesus Christ ACCORDING TO THE REVELATION of the MYSTERY...to make all men SEE what IS the revelation of the MYSTERY...to acknowledge PAUL as her apostle and not Peter....to line up under Gods LAST revelation to mankind and not preach another gospel and another jesus.

Scripture for the sake of posting a verse is NOT spiritual if the person has NO understanding of what it MEANS. God intends for all of us to KNOW what His plan and purpose IS for us today....we dont have to GUESS. Many here are "enemies of the Cross of Christ"...I dont make that evaluation, God does in His Word. These are BELIEVERS who refuse to line themselves up with Gods appointed spokesman to we the Body of Christ TODAY, and they focus on the earthly ministry of Christ and think its OUR MARCHING ORDERS, with NO study and much fanfare and feelings of horror at being told that they have been simply taught WRONGLY.

 

[A Brother In Christ]

so since we are in the dispensation of Grace

when did the law end...
when will this dispensation end...

what is the rule in this dispensation...

How does one get saved...

scripture please

 

[biblebeliever123]

Romans 10:4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

Romans 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

Colossians 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

Galatians 3:24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.Galatians 3:25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

This dispensation started with the 'appearing' of the Lord to Paul on the road to damascus (Acts 9). 1 Timothy 1:14 And the grace of our Lord was exceeding abundant with faith and love which is in Christ Jesus.
1 Timothy 1:15 This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief.
1 Timothy 1:16 Howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy, that in me first Jesus Christ might shew forth all longsuffering, for a pattern to them which should hereafter believe on him to life everlasting.

This dispensation will end with another 'appearing' of the Lord...at the rapture, the catching away of the church which is His body. (1 Thess. 4:13-18, 1 cor. 15:51-52)
Also Philippians 3:20 For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ Philippians 3:21 Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself.

The 'rule' of this dispensation is found in the body of truth (the preaching of Jesus Christ according to the revelation of the mystery Romans 16:25) given to the apostle Paul...found in Romans through Philemon.
Romans 11:13 For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles, I magnify mine office:
1 Corinthians 14:37 If any man think himself to be a prophet, or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord.
Titus 1:2 In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;
Titus 1:3 But hath in due times manifested his word through preaching, which is committed unto me according to the commandment of God our Saviour;
(If you will read through Romans through Philemon you will see repeatedly that Paul's instructions came directly to him from the risen, ascended, glorified Lord, that he has been given the ministry to the body of Christ)
Paul is God's spokesman to the church the body of Christ; just as the 12 were God's spokesman with the gospel of the kingdom to the nation Israel; just as Moses was God's spokesman to the nation of Israel the church in the wilderness.

The gospel of salvation for this dispensation is by grace alone through faith alone in the finished crosswork of Christ alone.

1 Corinthians 15:3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;1 Corinthians 15:4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:Romans 4:25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:Ephesians 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

The good news is that Christ died for your sins, was buried, and rose again for your justification. Believing that good news a person is saved by grace through faith apart from works.

 

[eph3Nine]

aaaaaamen, biblebeliever!

 

[A Brother In Christ]

Romans 10:4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

Romans 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

Colossians 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

Galatians 3:24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.Galatians 3:25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

This dispensation started with the 'appearing' of the Lord to Paul on the road to damascus (Acts 9). 1 Timothy 1:14 And the grace of our Lord was exceeding abundant with faith and love which is in Christ Jesus.
1 Timothy 1:15 This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief.
1 Timothy 1:16 Howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy, that in me first Jesus Christ might shew forth all longsuffering, for a pattern to them which should hereafter believe on him to life everlasting.

So what is different between OT believers and NT believers

This dispensation will end with another 'appearing' of the Lord...at the rapture, the catching away of the church which is His body. (1 Thess. 4:13-18, 1 cor. 15:51-52)
Also Philippians 3:20 For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ Philippians 3:21 Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself.

Amen

The 'rule' of this dispensation is found in the body of truth (the preaching of Jesus Christ according to the revelation of the mystery Romans 16:25) given to the apostle Paul...found in Romans through Philemon.
Romans 11:13 For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles, I magnify mine office:
1 Corinthians 14:37 If any man think himself to be a prophet, or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord.
Titus 1:2 In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;
Titus 1:3 But hath in due times manifested his word through preaching, which is committed unto me according to the commandment of God our Saviour;
(If you will read through Romans through Philemon you will see repeatedly that Paul's instructions came directly to him from the risen, ascended, glorified Lord, that he has been given the ministry to the body of Christ)
Paul is God's spokesman to the church the body of Christ; just as the 12 were God's spokesman with the gospel of the kingdom to the nation Israel; just as Moses was God's spokesman to the nation of Israel the church in the wilderness.

The gospel of salvation for this dispensation is by grace alone through faith alone in the finished crosswork of Christ alone.

1 Corinthians 15:3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;1 Corinthians 15:4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:Romans 4:25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:Ephesians 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

The good news is that Christ died for your sins, was buried, and rose again for your justification. Believing that good news a person is saved by grace through faith apart from works.

in Daniel eternal life was offered at the 2nd coming...

Bible states that we have eternal life right now..

why is this? what has changed

 

[eph3Nine]

Brother....do you READ the scriptures and compare?

Obviously NOT...so I will do it FOR YOU!

Romans 10:4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

OT saints , IE; the program Peter taught and Christ while on the earth, were under the LAW. Christ taught the law and lived it while on earth...His ministry was TO the nation Israel alone.
COMPARE: NOW, under Pauls gospel, the RISEN Christ is the END of the law...uh oh....heres a major difference, do you see it? BELIEVING this is all that is necessary.

Do you SEE the difference?


Romans 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

Under Israels program sin DID have dominion over them, as a person could NEVER justify themselves by their performance. To do so, one must obey all the law 100% if the time from birth to death...God knew this was impossible, but the nation Israel thot they could DO IT! God had to show them otherwise.

Paul tells US that in this dispensation, sin doesnt have dominion over "us". The sin issue is a done deal. ALL sin, past present and future has been paid for. We arent UNDER the law as they WERE...but under GRACE. The dispensation and program has changed.

Do you see the difference?


Colossians 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

The ordinances being spoken of here IS the law that the nation Israel in the OT WAS under.

That LAW has been REMOVED, being nailed to the Cross. This information is found ONLY in Pauls epistles to we the Body of Christ.

Do you see the difference?


Galatians 3:24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.Galatians 3:25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster"

The LAW "WAS" Israels schoolmaster to bring them to a dependence on their promised Messiah...that they might be justified by believing in their promised Messiah. AFTER they believed in THAT fact, they no longer needed the schoolmaster...but they NEVER believed as a NATION.

We have come to Christ and ARE justified by faith in His finished work on the Cross.

Do you see the difference?


This dispensation started with the 'appearing' of the Lord to Paul on the road to damascus (Acts 9). 1 Timothy 1:14 And the grace of our Lord was exceeding abundant with faith and love which is in Christ Jesus.
1 Timothy 1:15 This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief.
1 Timothy 1:16 Howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy, that in me first Jesus Christ might shew forth all longsuffering, for a pattern to them which should hereafter believe on him to life everlasting.

So what is different between OT believers and NT believers

If the scriptures dont show you the differences...then you wont EVER see it!

Now stop wasting our time having to spoon feed you and study the verses that are posted.

 

[A Brother In Christ]

Brother....do you READ the scriptures and compare?

Obviously NOT...so I will do it FOR YOU!

Romans 10:4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

OT saints , IE; the program Peter taught and Christ while on the earth, were under the LAW. Christ taught the law and lived it while on earth...His ministry was TO the nation Israel alone.
COMPARE: NOW, under Pauls gospel, the RISEN Christ is the END of the law...uh oh....heres a major difference, do you see it? BELIEVING this is all that is necessary.

Do you SEE the difference?


Romans 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

Under Israels program sin DID have dominion over them, as a person could NEVER justify themselves by their performance. To do so, one must obey all the law 100% if the time from birth to death...God knew this was impossible, but the nation Israel thot they could DO IT! God had to show them otherwise.

Paul tells US that in this dispensation, sin doesnt have dominion over "us". The sin issue is a done deal. ALL sin, past present and future has been paid for. We arent UNDER the law as they WERE...but under GRACE. The dispensation and program has changed.

Do you see the difference?


Colossians 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

The ordinances being spoken of here IS the law that the nation Israel in the OT WAS under.

That LAW has been REMOVED, being nailed to the Cross. This information is found ONLY in Pauls epistles to we the Body of Christ.

Do you see the difference?


Galatians 3:24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.Galatians 3:25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster"

The LAW "WAS" Israels schoolmaster to bring them to a dependence on their promised Messiah...that they might be justified by believing in their promised Messiah. AFTER they believed in THAT fact, they no longer needed the schoolmaster...but they NEVER believed as a NATION.

We have come to Christ and ARE justified by faith in His finished work on the Cross.

Do you see the difference?


This dispensation started with the 'appearing' of the Lord to Paul on the road to damascus (Acts 9). 1 Timothy 1:14 And the grace of our Lord was exceeding abundant with faith and love which is in Christ Jesus.
1 Timothy 1:15 This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief.
1 Timothy 1:16 Howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy, that in me first Jesus Christ might shew forth all longsuffering, for a pattern to them which should hereafter believe on him to life everlasting.

If the scriptures dont show you the differences...then you wont EVER see it!

Now stop wasting our time having to spoon feed you and study the verses that are posted.

since Jesus Christ died on the cross... cancelled the law... very general statement

what has God given to us that the Jews did not have... in our daily living

example Matt 6:9-18 lord prayer for Law believers vs 13
james 1:2 difference

why is this ...
who cares what church this is
this is a major difference ... what has changed..

this was prophecied in a covenant in Genesis, luke, and in gal we find out this ....

 

[eph3Nine]

since Jesus Christ died on the cross... cancelled the law... very general statement

what has God given to us that the Jews did not have... in our daily living

example Matt 6:9-18 lord prayer for Law believers vs 13
james 1:2 difference

why is this ...
who cares what church this is
this is a major difference ... what has changed..

this was prophecied in a covenant in Genesis, luke, and in gal we find out this ....

Until you acknowledge that there ARE indeed two programs represented in scripture...ONE for Israel and one for we the Body of Christ, and that the Body of Christ was NOT in existance when Peter and the boys and Christ was on the earth, and that the MYSTERY message ABOUT the Body of Christ wasnt part of Peters ministry and message...then we cant have a conversation.

The Mystery is UNTRACEABLE, the Bible says, anywhere in the OT. So it wasnt part of prophecy at ALL! So you wont find it it LUKE or Genesis.