tindomerel said:
You didnt answer me to what you wanted God for and what made you sure He wasnt there . I answered your pm although it didnt contain one contradiction.
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tindomerel said:What do you mean, what I didn't answer? I did PM you, though I admit I didn't really go into the detail of why I changed my faith. If you want, I'll explain it to you, but I think Biblical contradictions are plenty to talk about for tonight.
*Raises eyebrow* I think it did. But that's a whole different discussion. Where God hasn't been there for me was when I was spiritually stagnated, then found myself being drawn (almost literally) irresistably to Wicca. A couple friends of mine persuaded me to give Christianity a second chance, but I still feel no need to believe that Jesus is the only way to life.Angel4Truth said:You didnt answer me to what you wanted God for and what made you sure He wasnt there . I answered your pm although it didnt contain one contradiction.
tindomerel said:*Raises eyebrow* I think it did. But that's a whole different discussion. Where God hasn't been there for me was when I was spiritually stagnated, then found myself being drawn (almost literally) irresistably to Wicca. A couple friends of mine persuaded me to give Christianity a second chance, but I still feel no need to believe that Jesus is the only way to life.
Edit: Oh, and I forgot to make one minor clarification. Since becoming Wiccan, opportunities for spiritual growth have been so numerous that sometimes I think I could do with less.
Let me clarify some more: By "giving Christianity a second chance" I didn't mean return to following the Bible, I just meant going to church and being open to God's work in my life. I apologize for any misconceptions, but if what I just said doesn't explain my "dishonesty" then I don't know where I was being dishonest.Angel4Truth said:Actually you didnt answer me either here or on pm and since you arent being honest now , id say our discussion is over . Hint ; if you need to be dishonest about what you claim to believe or not believe ,chances are you arent beleiving anything resembling truth .
HRE said:Angel4Truth, what do you think of the responses to your question?
A huge portion of them simply ask for any evidence whatsoever of Biblical veracity or Christ's divine existence.
How do you respond to these answers?
Please tell me where I was being dishonest in my beliefs, and I will explain. I was not being deliberately deceptive.Angel4Truth said:Tindomerel , good day and I hope for your sake you dont harden yourself to the truth . I do not discuss things when people have shown me they arent willing to be honest .
I wasn't meaning to proselytize either. I just anticipated being asked if things were any better where I am now, so I thought I would answer that question ahead of time and save everyone the trouble.Angel4Truth said:Timdromel, you know what you did on pm , we are finished .You never said anything about 'giving christianity another chance ' and you are saying one thing there and another thing publically and I do not play games . I offered to speak to you sincerely and since you are not so , we are done . One reminder however , prostylizing wiccan is not allowed on this board.
Angel4Truth said:What would it take to trust Christ for all of you who are not believers?
Angel4Truth said:There were over 500 witnesses that Christ was resurected but not any living today...
Im curious , the same can be said for almost all of history too then couldnt it? That its not accurate because we didnt witness it ourselves? Why would the disciples show themselves to be cowards if they made it up? Why would women be the ones to find the empty tomb of Christ when it was almost impossible in that day an age for anyone to put any stock in the testimony of women as a witness? Lasty you are assuming its all a lie , then bearing false witness yourself by claiming that people that believe in the God they have evidence of in their own lives lie about it . Doesnt make sense . If you want to know the truth , start with studying the jews and jewish history as compared to what the bible says and the reimergance of Israel a nation . Its something you can get your mind around since Israel came back into being this century and that cannot be disputed .tocis said:Aaaah, but where there really?
If the bible tells the truth then yes, there were hundreds of witnesses. But as I see it, the bible can easily have been written by men, and those witnesses can easily have been invented just to impress unbelievers.
I have been given much "proof" for the bible being more than just a book written by men (or rather a collection of books), but so far none of it turned out to be valid. And the sad fact that especially fanatics and fundamentalists reuse that debunked stuff over and over again... suffice it to say that it makes me wonder whether they really try to follow their faith's commandments. Wasn't there a "Thou shalt not bear false witness" somewhere?
Angel4Truth said:Im curious , the same can be said for almost all of history too then couldnt it?
Angel4Truth said:Lasty you are assuming its all a lie , then bearing false witness yourself by claiming that people that believe in the God they have evidence of in their own lives lie about it .
when you claimed that followers of Christ bear false witness to Christ , then you called them liars , thats what bearing false witness is . Just because you have seen no objective evidence to what you consider that to be , it doesnt mean that other people have not received the evidence they require , lastly its not up to anyone to prove anything about their own relationship with God , its up to you to seek God for yourself , you alone are accountable to God for yourself not anyone else . Dont assume because you 'honor' and worship something that you have no evidence of by your own admission that it is the case for others . Id have to wonder why you waste your time on worshiping anything you have no evidence of unless you just like creating your own God by then why not , then you have a god weaker than you are and can change the rules as you see fit . If anything , the latter is the real trick of the mind.tocis said:Generally, what historians consider true is backed up by a tiny little bit more evidence than a sentence in one book that is known to be not too trustworthy in everything (take the biblical flat earth and firmament for example).
But you're welcome to present examples for your point.
If you let this stand as it is, it's merely an unsupported assertion (that evidence exists). Plus, please show me where I mentioned "lie" in my posting.
But anyway:It all depends on the evidence.
I have yet to see objective evidence for the existence of any Divine force, including the Deities I honor. Personal truth a la "I had a vision of Jesus" et cetera is perfect proof for the one who had the vision, but how do you think you can prove to someone else that your vision was true and not some trick of the mind?
Boy have I seen some objective stuff with other people!tocis said:But anyway: It all depends on the evidence.
I have yet to see objective evidence for the existence of any Divine force, including the Deities I honor. Personal truth a la "I had a vision of Jesus" et cetera is perfect proof for the one who had the vision, but how do you think you can prove to someone else that your vision was true and not some trick of the mind?
Im curious as to when anyone here posting (on this thread) has called you evil?Ninja Turtles said:Boy have I seen some objective stuff with other people!
Crazy I tell you, crazy. If only you'd been there. But what's crazier to me is the fundies coming after me later on calling me evil, I get a kick out of that.
Especially when they cleave the book they consider to be the Truth. Then why pare the sentences?No one likes it when you turn their tools of persuasion around on them, but it is fun.
That's why I've come to the conclusion that I'm not to fond of most missionaries. The Catholic ones seem cool though, much better than they were back in the old days, but fundamentalist and Mormon missionaries, can someone save me from these people? LOL
Angel4Truth said:What would it take to trust Christ for all of you who are not believers?
thirstforknowledge said:It would have to be shown that he is a real person and that the bible is not myth like all other religions.
Angel4Truth said:Do you believe that Julious Ceasar existed? There is more evidence that Christ existed than Juilous Ceasar
and even the orthodox jews who reject Jesus Christ agree that He existed , but that He was no who He claimed himself to be .
Im curious as to why you believe he didnt exist at all , when even most secular sources agree that He did in fact exist , but also not as the bible defines Him .
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