What is the antichrist?

timothyu said:

Perhaps can't see it but can know it. The Kingdom is not just a future physical place but God's government over man, clearly stated in the Lord's Prayer.

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If it can't be seen, how can it show the unregenerate world anything?

Clare73 said:

If it can't be seen, how can it show the unregenerate world anything?

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The Tempter took Jesus to a place where this world could be seen. Hence man relies upon this method., But Jesus rejected it for the unseen. But as I said in knowing that our ways are backwards to the ways of the Kingdom, reversing our thinking gives us a good idea of what to expect and how to act. (including taking sides, not in the world but outside of it)

timothyu said:

The Tempter took Jesus to a place where this world could be seen. Hence man relies upon this method., But Jesus rejected it for the unseen. But as I said in knowing that our ways are backwards to the ways of the Kingdom, reversing our thinking gives us a good idea of what to expect and how to act. (including taking sides, not in the world but outside of it)

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The tempter did not show Jesus the invisible kingdom of God.

Clare73 said:

The tempter did not show Jesus the invisible kingdom of God.

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I did not say that did I

The seat of the papacy is the antichrist, the many is the many popes that have lived. The term antichrist means in " place of christ" and the Pope puts himself in between christ and God and claims the only way for forgiveness of sins is through his" church". Aka him. Even though God says the is medicator between him is but christ.

They have even claimed themselves to be christ in the flesh (blasphemy) and this statement has never been retracted so it applies for all popes until it is.

Roachyy87 said:

They have even claimed themselves to be christ in the flesh (blasphemy) and this statement has never been retracted so it applies for all popes until it is.

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Citation needed.

JSRG said:

Citation needed.

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Roachyy87 said:

Did the Catholic National say the Pope's Christ? - BibleAsk

The quote from the Catholic National is shared around on the internet. But since we don’t have the primary resource documentation

bibleask.org

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So let's review what your claim was. Referring to popes, you said:

"They have even claimed themselves to be christ in the flesh (blasphemy) and this statement has never been retracted so it applies for all popes until it is."

This claim of "it applies for all popes until it is" seems rather questionable, but as no pope has made such a claim--as far as I can tell--I suppose that doesn't matter. So let's look at the quotes on your page which for the most part are not even quotes by popes. First, it begins with describing the claim of "The Pope is not only the representative of Jesus Christ, but he is Jesus Christ, Himself, hidden under the veil of flesh" attributed to the "Catholic National". This doesn't seem to be an actual statement by a pope. But the larger problem is that this is one of those quotes that floats around the Internet that is very difficult to verify. Even your link admits it can't confirm it. So that one's out.

Now let's look at the other quotes it offers.

A- In the Time Magazine, the article entitled Hand of Terrorism, By George J. Church, et al… It stated: “shooting the Pope—It’s like shooting God.”

This quote, from the May 25 1981 edition of Time Magazine on page 17, is not a quote by a pope. In fact, it's attributed to a Jewish businessman in Jerusalem! See The TIME Vault: May 25, 1981 (lower right corner)

B-Cardinal Sarto, who became Pope Pius X said, “The Pope represents Jesus Christ Himself…”

This one actually is a quote from him. Two issues, however. First, this was said before he was pope, so it's not really accurate to say a pope made the claim. Second, saying one is a vicar (representative) of Christ does not mean they are, as you claimed, "christ in the flesh." Indeed, it means the very opposite, as being a vicar/representative of someone inherently means you are not that person.

C-In 1512 Christopher Marcellus said this to Pope Julius II:
“Take care that we lose not that salvation, that life and breath which thou hast given us, for thou art our shepherd, thou art our physician, thou art our governor, thou art our husbandman, thou art finally another God on earth …”

Not a quote by a pope. That should dispense with it immediately. Additionally, The Truth About Papal Claims to be God argues that when examined in context, "it's not a compliment. The speaker is chiding Julius for caring too much about other things. He's not flattering him. He's reminding him of the responsibilities he has to take care of souls by ruling and guiding the Church justly, a responsibility that belongs to Julius because he has the place of God on earth insofar as God has entrusted the care of souls to him. It's not flattery. It's not a call to worship. I don't imagine that Julius was all that happy to hear it."

D-This ancient Catholic document, Extravagantes Johannes, refers to the Pope as “Our Lord God the Pope.” Source: John Treat, The Catholic faith, or, Doctrines of the Church of Rome contrary to Scripture (1888) : 536.

Again not a quote by a pope. That basically dispenses with it, but for a bit more detail on it, see http://blog.theotokos.co.za/pdf/The Truth about the title Lord God the Pope.pdf.

E-John Paul II have said statements such as:
“Have no fear when people call me the “Vicar of Christ,” when they say to me “Holy Father,” or “Your Holiness,” or use titles similar to these, which seem even inimical to the Gospel.” -From “Crossing the Threshold of Hope”, by John Paul II, © 1994 by Arnoldo Mondadori Editore.

“… we readily understand the devotion of Saint Francis of Assisi for “the Lord Pope“, the daughterly outspokenness of Saint Catherine of Siena towards the one whom she called “sweet Christ on earth“, the apostolic obedience and the sentire cum Ecclesia of Saint Ignatius Loyola,and the joyful profession of faith made by Saint Teresa of Avila: “I am a daughter of the Church” – Pope John Paul II, Apostolic Exhortation VITA CONSECRATA, (On The Consecrated Life And Its Mission In The Church And In The World), March 25, 1996.

Finally we get to actual quotes by a pope while they were actually pope. The fact that it was so necessary to quote a bunch of people who weren't popes is perhaps a sign of how unsupported the claim is. However, the first quote doesn't have him claiming to be Christ in the flesh, but referring to how people refer to the pope as "Vicar of Christ" which again merely makes someone the representative of Christ, which is considerably different from "Christ in the flesh" and in fact I would say contradictory to that claim.

The second quote is the closest one comes to providing an actual quote by a pope claiming to be "Christ in the flesh" but it still falls considerably short. The first thing to note is this is him quoting someone else rather than his own words. But someone might say that it still qualifies as he doesn't seem to be taking issue with it. However, it seems clear to me that the usage (both by Catherine and by John Paul II) is metaphorical, saying the pope is akin to being a sweet Christ on Earth, but not that he is literally Christ in the flesh as was your claim. Certainly, if John Paul II was actually trying to make a claim as bold as him being Christ in the flesh, one would expect more than such a passing statement on the subject.

So nothing showing any pope actually claimed to be Christ in the flesh. Most of them aren't even quotes by popes at all!

“And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.” 1 John 4:3

The New Age movement gave birth to the idea that there was no historical Jesus, which is the spirit of antichrist. Notice it says, “it” should come, indicating a thing, not a person, which brings us to those that do confess that Christ “is come in the flesh,” proclaiming that they are Christ, which Jesus warned us about. “Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.” Matthew 24:23. Believe it not, because Christ, which has become synonymous with Jesus, is not a person. Christ is a healing power. We are all antichrist (against christ) as long as we resist the power that heals us on a soul-level. "Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye." Acts 7:51. The instruction for activating the christ healing power from within, is found in both the Old and New Testament.

Sandra L. Butler said:

“And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.” 1 John 4:3

The New Age movement gave birth to the idea that there was no historical Jesus, which is the spirit of antichrist. Notice it says, “it” should come, indicating a thing, not a person, which brings us to those that do confess that Christ “is come in the flesh,” proclaiming that they are Christ, which Jesus warned us about. “Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.” Matthew 24:23. Believe it not, because Christ, which has become synonymous with Jesus, is not a person. Christ is a healing power. We are all antichrist (against christ) as long as we resist the power that heals us on a soul-level. "Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye." Acts 7:51. The instruction for activating the christ healing power from within, is found in both the Old and New Testament.

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"Christ "means "Messiah," which means "Anointed One."
Scripture presents it as a person, not an object.

Clare73 said:

"Christ "means "Messiah," which means "Anointed One."
Scripture presents it as a person, not an object.

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And more specifically when referring to "the" messiah...

Mark 15:32 Let Christ the King of Israel descend now from the cross, that we may see and believe. And they that were crucified with him reviled him.

The person to become the Antichrist must be anointed the King of Israel - instead of the rightful King of Israel, Jesus.