what is soaking?

probinson · Dec 21, 2010

AudioArtist said:
If, however, what I've shared IS simply a precious account of God's work in my life - and I have every reason to believe it is - then it is those doing the accusing who are on dangerous ground.

Every time I read one of your posts, I have to remind myself that you're only 23. You have wisdom far beyond your years. When I read your posts, I hear the heart of God.

There are many people in the body of Christ who think they are experts in the things of God that amount to nothing more than puffed up, clanging cymbals. Your posts are a refreshing contrast to that.

Yitzchak · Dec 21, 2010

ARBITER01 said:
Sorry, you're not gaining a convert here. Wigglesworth, Etter, Lake, all of our Christian greats never needed this soaking thing, as well as none of the apostles.

One of my interests is studying and reading about revival. I think you are posting out of a hunger for the real thing. I am praying for you that you will be one of those Christian greats in our time.

SpiritPsalmist · Dec 21, 2010

It's interesting to me how some talk as if they know everything there is to know about the "Christian greats" even though they have never been privy to a viewing of any of those persons entire life and/or activities. Yet they claim to know exactly what those people did and did not do while in prayer.

The "christian greats" such as the Apostles, Wigglesworth, Etter, Lake, Kuhlman, Roberts, etc., may not have called it soaking but I could pretty much guarantee they did it....whatever they called it. Reading even one of their bio's would reveal that.

Yitzchak · Dec 21, 2010

SpiritPsalmist said:
It's interesting to me how some talk as if they know everything there is to know about the "Christian greats" even though they have never been privy to a viewing of any of those persons entire life and/or activities nor have they ever even met the persons. Yet they claim to know exactly what those people did and did not do while in prayer.

The "christian greats" such as the Apostles, Wigglesworth, Etter, Lake, Kuhlman, Graham, etc., may not have called it soaking but I could pretty much guarantee they did it....whatever they called it. Reading even one of their bio's would reveal that.

Smith Wigglesworth never read any book other than the bible from the day that he learned to read and write.

Some quotes from Wigglesworth.

"I want to bring you people to a place of dissatisfaction -- a place where you will never be satisfied again. "

" I would rather have a man on my platform , not filled with the Holy Ghost but hungry for G-d , than a man who has received the Holy Ghost but has become satisfied with his experience . "

Smith Wigglesworth was hungry for G-d. He did not reach a place where he felt he had arrived. I am amazed at how little we settle for in the North American church in our generation.

I think we as the modern church would be surprised and maybe a little shocked if the great Christians like Wesley and Wigglesworth were to come and preach at our church. They were pretty intense.

SpiritPsalmist · Dec 21, 2010

Yitzchak said:
Smith Wigglesworth never read any book other than the bible from the day that he learned to read and write.

Some quotes from Wigglesworth.

"I want to bring you people to a place of dissatisfaction -- a place where you will never be satisfied again. "

" I would rather have a man on my platform , not filled with the Holy Ghost but hungry for G-d , than a man who has received the Holy Ghost but has become satisfied with his experience . "

Smith Wigglesworth was hungry for G-d. He did not reach a place where he felt he had arrived. I am amazed at how little we settle for in the North American church in our generation.

I think we as the modern church would be surprised and maybe a little shocked if the great Christians like Wesley and Wigglesworth were to come and preach at our church. They were pretty intense.

From what I've read on Wigglesworth, he was very intense. I think if he were to preach in our churches today many would be running away calling him a heretic. If I remember correctly, many in his day called him that and refused to even acknowledge that he was even part of their denomination. Yet now, he's considered one of the greats.

I do believe that not all are called in the same way that Wigglesworth was. However we are all called to serve God with all our heart, soul, mind, and spirit. While that may take form in each person differently, it will never take form in choosing to disobey God and His word.

ARBITER01 · Dec 21, 2010

Yitzchak said:
One of my interests is studying and reading about revival. I think you are posting out of a hunger for the real thing. I am praying for you that you will be one of those Christian greats in our time.

I will say you are exactly right with respect to that desire, and thank you for offering your prayers. I do sincerely mean that.

Wigglesworth is just one of our greats we can learn from, I actually like reading more about Maria Etter. How GOD operated through her was simply amazing.

ARBITER01 · Dec 21, 2010

SpiritPsalmist said:
It's interesting to me how some talk as if they know everything there is to know about the "Christian greats" even though they have never been privy to a viewing of any of those persons entire life and/or activities. Yet they claim to know exactly what those people did and did not do while in prayer.

The "christian greats" such as the Apostles, Wigglesworth, Etter, Lake, Kuhlman, Roberts, etc., may not have called it soaking but I could pretty much guarantee they did it....whatever they called it. Reading even one of their bio's would reveal that.

There are plenty of books out there to read on these individuals, even collected works to where you can get everything in just one. There is no need to be mean-spirited towards their record of accomplishment with GOD.

They were the real deal. There was no mistake at all, GOD was operating through them in great power, and we should learn from their lives. They had the results that people don't today.

This stuff one finds people promoting nowadays is just a bunch of junk compared to eyewitness accounts of GOD's actions through our Christian forefathers.

They walked the walk with Jesus, what more can we say.

BereanStudent · Dec 21, 2010

Can anyone provide scriptural support for this practice of soaking ? Also can anyone provide support from the history of the early church ?

Simon_Templar · Dec 21, 2010

BereanStudent said:
Can anyone provide scriptural support for this practice of soaking ? Also can anyone provide support from the history of the early church ?

First of all, I don't care for the term soaking. It has too many negative conotations for me. There is a lot of crazy whacky things that come out of the Charismatic world and "soaking" just sounds too much like one of those things.

Also, the term soaking, to me, conjures images of lounging in a bath, or soaking your feet in a pool etc... the point being that those activities are really fundamentally self-indulgent.
True waiting on God is exactly the opposite, and people who have done it with any level of commitment will tell you that they often go through times where it is a great struggle because it seems like they are getting nothing out of it etc.

Whatever you want to call it (soaking, contemplation, meditation, waiting, listening) ultimately the real point is simply that you are devoting yourself to spend time waiting on God. Focusing your mind on him and not allowing yourself to be distracted by anything else.

The point of this is that God is your desire. Not experiences, not miracles, not revelations... just God himself.

Think of it like a romantic relationship. Most people go to God and constantly talk and ask for things, or stuff like that, or they go and their minds are constantly wandering to other things...

Now imagine in a romantic relationship how the other person would feel if you never stop talking, or if you only come to ask them to do things for you, or if you constantly ignore them because something on TV or something you want to do tomorrow, or something at work, is constnatly distracting you.

I think its pretty obvious that this kind of behavior is not devoted, not really a good expression of love, etc.

Waiting on God, meditating on God, contemplating God, whatever you want to call it is basically the equivalent of simply sitting quietly and giving your undivided attention to the other person in the relationship. Simply sitting in their arms, or looking in their eyes, simply listening. An important point here is that this is done for the sake of the other person, not for your own sake.

If we go back to the bible, we find that Jesus did this at least on a number of occasions, probably regularly. We are told several times that he went off by himself, out into the wilderness, to pray. The point was simply to be alone with God and to be undistracted. To give his undivided attention to God.

This really isn't some "new technique" or revolutionary practice. Its something that everyone knows in regular relationships, but people don't often apply it to their relationship with God.

As for the early Church, there were numerous examples of this as well as various techniques and prayers that people developed to assist them in this persuit.

The most famous examples are the "desert fathers". However, the ideas involved were common through out the early Church.

Child of JC · Dec 21, 2010

AudioArtist said:
T
I actually kind of discovered it on my own, apart from any group setting. (In fact, I'm yet to do it with other believers - and I'm not sure I could find people where I'm at with enough time and patience to spend that length of time with God!)

I think the thought of doing it with others is just to make everyone accountable; to actually set a date with God and to keep that weekly date. If everyone knows to put aside "Tuesdays", then it will more likely happen. When we resolve to do something alone, we're not accountable to anyone; doing something in a group makes you more accountable. And we all know how easy it is to push the "God time" out, if we need more time.

BereanStudent · Dec 21, 2010

Simon_Templar said:
First of all, I don't care for the term soaking. It has too many negative conotations for me. There is a lot of crazy whacky things that come out of the Charismatic world and "soaking" just sounds too much like one of those things.

Also, the term soaking, to me, conjures images of lounging in a bath, or soaking your feet in a pool etc... the point being that those activities are really fundamentally self-indulgent.
True waiting on God is exactly the opposite, and people who have done it with any level of commitment will tell you that they often go through times where it is a great struggle because it seems like they are getting nothing out of it etc.

Whatever you want to call it (soaking, contemplation, meditation, waiting, listening) ultimately the real point is simply that you are devoting yourself to spend time waiting on God. Focusing your mind on him and not allowing yourself to be distracted by anything else.

The point of this is that God is your desire. Not experiences, not miracles, not revelations... just God himself.

Think of it like a romantic relationship. Most people go to God and constantly talk and ask for things, or stuff like that, or they go and their minds are constantly wandering to other things...

Now imagine in a romantic relationship how the other person would feel if you never stop talking, or if you only come to ask them to do things for you, or if you constantly ignore them because something on TV or something you want to do tomorrow, or something at work, is constnatly distracting you.

I think its pretty obvious that this kind of behavior is not devoted, not really a good expression of love, etc.

Waiting on God, meditating on God, contemplating God, whatever you want to call it is basically the equivalent of simply sitting quietly and giving your undivided attention to the other person in the relationship. Simply sitting in their arms, or looking in their eyes, simply listening. An important point here is that this is done for the sake of the other person, not for your own sake.

If we go back to the bible, we find that Jesus did this at least on a number of occasions, probably regularly. We are told several times that he went off by himself, out into the wilderness, to pray. The point was simply to be alone with God and to be undistracted. To give his undivided attention to God.

This really isn't some "new technique" or revolutionary practice. Its something that everyone knows in regular relationships, but people don't often apply it to their relationship with God.

As for the early Church, there were numerous examples of this as well as various techniques and prayers that people developed to assist them in this persuit.

The most famous examples are the "desert fathers". However, the ideas involved were common through out the early Church.

I prefer the biblical terminology. It avoids confusion and makes clear the biblical support for the pratice.

Alive_Again · Dec 21, 2010

I heard a prophetic Word that mentioned that some were to "soak" before ministering. He was referring to a period where you rested and received from Him before going forth and giving out. Not just for a day either. It was for a season. We can only give from what we receive. It's cool that God prepares His people and we can wait on Him and listen and hear anointed preaching and anointed words from the body, and worship, and receive fresh oil. It ministers a spiritual sabbath.

BereanStudent · Dec 22, 2010

I think that soaking sounds similar to breaking up our fallow ground. But does it involve repentance ?

I said, 'Plant the good seeds of righteousness, and you will harvest a crop of love. Plow up the hard ground of your hearts, for now is the time to seek the LORD, that he may come and shower righteousness upon you.'

[SIZE=+1]To break up the fallow ground is to break up your hearts, to prepare your minds to bring forth fruit unto God. The mind of man is often compared in the Bible to ground, and the Word of God to seed sown therein, the fruit representing the actions and affections of those who receive it. To break up the fallow ground, therefore, is to bring the mind into such a state that it is fitted to receive the Word of God. Sometimes your hearts get matted down, hard and dry, till there is no such thing as getting fruit from them till they are broken up, and mellowed down, and fitted to receive the Word. It is this softening of the heart, so as to make it feel the truth, which the prophet calls breaking up your fallow ground.[/SIZE]

BereanStudent · Dec 22, 2010

Charles Finney speaks about breaking up the fallow ground of our heart.

First. Not until there is thorough brokenness of heart and contrition of spirit. 2d. Not until sin is crushed out of the heart and it has become thoroughly honest with God and man. 3d. Not until it is disposed to make a clean breast of wrong-doing; to make thorough confession and restitution to God and all injured parties, who, of course, have a right to our confession and restitution. This confession and restitution, to the extent of our ability, is implied in becoming honest or penitent for sin. There is never genuine repentance where this disposition to confess and make restitution, to the extent of ability, is wanting. Nothing short of this disposition is honesty, either with God or man. God knows this. Hence, he cannot forgive until he see a voluntary disposition in the soul to set itself right with God and with men; a disposition that sets itself humbly and resolutely to make confession and restitution, to the extent of ability, thoroughly and without delay. If one has stolen, can he expect to be forgiven while he retains the stolen property? If one has slandered, can he expect to be forgiven while the calumny remains uncorrected? If one has committed a wrong of any kind, against God or against a neighbor, can he expect to be forgiven, while he neglects or refuses to make reparation, to the extent of his ability? In the presence of the universe, could God ever justify the forgiveness of such a dishonest soul? Has he not said, "He that covereth his sins shall not prosper"? "But whoso confesseth and forsaketh them shall find mercy." But what is it to cover sin? 1st. To justify wrong-doing.

What is needed is for people to get up after their "soaking " and go and return what they have stolen or reconcile the relationships they have broken. The good soil brings forth fruit. Who cares if someone crys crocodile tears all day long ? If soaking produces fruit , it is good. If it is barren and only makes people feel like they are facing their sins when they are just playing with them , then it is worse than useless. It is a distraction from real repentance.

2 Corinthians 7 :8-10

8) For even if I made you sorry with my letter, I do not regret it (though I did regret it), for I see that the letter grieved you, though only for a while. 9) As it is, I rejoice, not because you were grieved, but because you were grieved into repenting; for you felt a godly grief, so that you suffered no loss through us. 10) For godly grief produces a repentance that leads to salvation and brings no regret, but worldly grief produces death.

All my talk about repentance is because biblically , how can one expect to break up their hard heart and draw closer to The Lord without repentance ?

I am afraid that at least some of the "soaking" is lacking fruit. If a person wants true spirtuality , they need to become holy. How can someone "soak" and then go out and live an unholy life ? They may have caught some glimpses of the real thing but they have not really been changed until there is fruit in their life.

I am not saying I am against Soaking. But I think that a call to holiness is better. Does anyone have some examples of changed lives from this practice of soaking ?

Simon_Templar · Dec 23, 2010

BereanStudent said:
I prefer the biblical terminology. It avoids confusion and makes clear the biblical support for the pratice.

I like the word contemplation. It means to attentively look at. The idea is that you are intently looking at or observing, with undivided attention.

However, I think the best biblical term, and probably the best term in general is communion.

The end goal of all of this is communion, to share unity, or to be united with.

Also, your point in your later post about repentance is very good. That is also one of the problems I have with modern movements like soaking (and I don't know much of the actual soaking teaching so this in part is just my impression), but they seem to make everything easy. Not in a good way, but in a bad way.

False man made religions make things difficult by making it about rules and technique... if have to do this just right, you have to follow all these rules, you have to have the right technique etc. People react against that by stripping away all requirement.

Real divine religion is paradoxical in that it is both easier and also harder than the false religions. It is easier because it doesn't require the right form, or the right set of rules etc in order to approach, and receive. It is, however, on another level infinitely harder because it requires complete surrender and it requires selflessness. It requires us to put our 'natural' self on the cross.

In the end, even though they are often difficult, the surfacy, legalistic requirements of the false religions are easier than what true divine religion asks of us.

If you were to study the history of Christian mystics who have saught God in this way, you would find that without exception they all say that the first steps are to seek purity of heart through repentance and prayer.

without a pure heart, everything that you do outwardly is largely useless.
This is part of what Jesus said, blessed are the pure in heart, for they shall see God.

Also, I want to add, that purity of heart is not moral perfection. Its not defined by not having made or making mistakes etc. It is defined by having a repentant heart, and by asking God, and ernestly seeking to have him purify your heart. To cleanse the things in you that are not right or to remove them.

JimB · Dec 24, 2010

Jared R said:
Hi everyone. I was wondering if you could explain soaking to me. I have come across this term and was wondering if you could explain what it's about. I'm just curious how it compares to the ancient practice of resting in God's presence.

Thank you.

Soaking is just a term coined by some preacher to tickle the ears of gullible people and advance some new doctrine of pop-theology. It means absolutely nothing. I dont think the term, as it is popularly used, is even in the Bible.

~Jim

Love God. Love people. Period.

imperfectchristian · Dec 24, 2010

My wife loves soaking in the bathtub and that is most certainly self indulgent.

There are some who believe you should refrain from pleasurable practices and others that believe God created life to be enjoyed in the way He intended it.

C.S. Lewis pointed out in Mere Christianity that sin is really at its root an attempt to gain some type of pleasure in a way God did not intend.

Sex outside of marriage for example, while physically might be pleasurable, robs an individual of intimacy within a life long intimate love relationship. It really is a major step down and abandonment of the whole enjoyment God intended.

Soaking is just a word. If it works for you great, if it doesn't then don't use it, but I think we should be careful in making judgment calls and what is and isn't God particularly over some trivial use of a modern word applied to spiritual things. It is meant to be descriptive, not hocus pocus.

Remember the disciples in the upper room were accused of being drunk. It is easy to judge from a distance and arrive at the wrong conclusion.

I have sat for hours in church services and personal worship times "soaking" in the presence of God and I know some cessationist types who would accuse me of unknowingly practicing some type of eastern demonic cult ritual. It is easy to demonize things at a distance based on exteriors, but God looks on the heart and to Him it's the heart that matters.

Alive_Again · Dec 24, 2010

“Soaking” is just a term coined by some preacher to tickle the ears of gullible people and advance some new doctrine of pop-theology. It means absolutely nothing. I don’t think the term, as it is popularly used, is even in the Bible.

It's not in the Bible as termed "soaking". Neither is "Trinity". I believe in the Trinity.

The Lord recently used the term "soak" as if to wait and receive as if for a season to prepare for ministry. Witness to it as you may.

JimB · Dec 24, 2010

Alive_Again said:
It's not in the Bible as termed "soaking". Neither is "Trinity". I believe in the Trinity.

The Lord recently used the term "soak" as if to wait and receive as if for a season to prepare for ministry. Witness to it as you may.

And neither is the word Bible, but thats not the point. But Trinity and Bible are biblical concepts Soaking (as in soaking prayer, soaking praise, soaking pick-a-topic) isnt.

BTW, where did "the Lord" ever "recently" say "soak" as "if to wait and receive as if for a season to prepare for ministry"? I couldn't find it in my Bible.

~Jim

Love God. Love people. Period.

imperfectchristian · Dec 24, 2010

JimB said:
And neither is the word Bible, but thats not the point. But Trinity and Bible are biblical concepts Soaking (as in soaking prayer, soaking praise, soaking pick-a-topic) isnt.

BTW, where did "the Lord" ever "recently" say "soak" as "if to wait and receive as if for a season to prepare for ministry"? I couldn't find it in my Bible.

~Jim

Love God. Love people. Period.

"On one occasion, while he was eating with them, he gave them this command: Do not leave Jerusalem, but wait for the gift my Father promised, which you have heard me speak about." - Acts 1:4

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