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What exactly is Sorcery?

AppleGold

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The bible does mention several times that it forbids the practice of Sorcery. But Sorcery does not exist in the real world. Unless you substitute Sorcery for sleight of hand scam artist, ie. professional pickpocket. Or substitute Sorcery for psychology to trick people into doing what you want. Ie. this guy has mind control, when it really isn't magic, but he is good at convincing you at doing wrong.
 

JackRT

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The bible does mention several times that it forbids the practice of Sorcery. But Sorcery does not exist in the real world. Unless you substitute Sorcery for sleight of hand scam artist, ie. professional pickpocket. Or substitute Sorcery for psychology to trick people into doing what you want. Ie. this guy has mind control, when it really isn't magic, but he is good at convincing you at doing wrong.

I regard sorcery as a ritual of incantations and sometimes physical actions intended to invoke the supernatural for something you wish to happen. It, of course, is quite imaginary.
 
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splish- splash

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The bible does mention several times that it forbids the practice of Sorcery. But Sorcery does not exist in the real world. Unless you substitute Sorcery for sleight of hand scam artist, ie. professional pickpocket. Or substitute Sorcery for psychology to trick people into doing what you want. Ie. this guy has mind control, when it really isn't magic, but he is good at convincing you at doing wrong.

In my own understanding, I'd say sorcery is when a person uses dark powers inorder to foretell, cast spells, manipulate, oppress and harass people. Actually sorcery does exist, witchcraft to be precise.
 
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Billy UK

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The word from what I have looked at in the Strongs Bible Dictionary is referenced in Revelation 9:21 and Galatians 5:20 and is the Greek word

Pharmakeia

Phonetic Spelling Parts of Speech
far-mak-i'-ah Noun Feminine
Definition
  1. the use or the administering of drugs
  2. poisoning
  3. sorcery, magical arts, often found in connection with idolatry and fostered by it
  4. metaph. the deceptions and seductions of idolatry
In Galatians the word Pharmakeia is defined as Witchcraft

Galatians 5:20 (KJV)

20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,

In Revelation the word Pharamakeia is defined as Sorceries

Revelation 9:21 (KJV)

21 Neither repented they of their murders, nor of their sorceries, nor of their fornication, nor of their thefts.


 
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Kenny'sID

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That is a very good question and a clue is that you are concerned because there are no Sorcerers in our time, at least not real sorcerers. The next possible logical thought, "Then it must be something that is around, and around enough for the bible to mention it so often", but we just don't know what it is. Then we might back up a bit, and the next logical question we might ask ourselves, were there ever real sorcerers beyond Hollywood and what/where were they?

Clearly there must be real sorcerers, and as with many of what we might call a myth, there is a basis to it's begtinnings, so yes there were real sorcerers in Jesus time, and if for no other reason, because the bible says so. The big difference between Hollywood's and real sorcery was, the "real" magic that is done in cinema so the resulting show is more exiting/sells, and the deception that was done in real life, tricks, and such they used in biblical times. The potions weren't as powerful as they make them out to be on film, but they were real, and could be thought powerful by those who didn't understand chemistry.

Think about it, some guy in his basement making methamphetamine, is that not a potion with seemingly magic properties? I mean if we didn't understand what was going on it could be seen as magic and that and other type drugs might even be sold as say a love potion? How bout a potion to make everyone love everyone...Ecstasy?? Pretty colors...LSD? And the list goes on, all potions.

Now take that and add it to what Billy UK said in post #6 and a pretty clear picture begins to emerge.

This was brought o my attention i the mid 70's, and I've researched it plenty since. There is no doubt in my mind Sorcery is at the very least a drug dealer, and by my logic, but I'm not positive, if one is a user, are they not practicing sorcery?

And, of course, I'm talking recreational drugs.
 
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Billy UK

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Well this will most likely go down like a lead balloon but its just the facts. When we look at words you begin to dig up lots of truth .

pharmacy
/ˈfɑːməsi/
Learn to pronounce
Origin
upload_2020-1-8_22-41-53.png

late Middle English (denoting the administration of drugs): from Old French farmacie, via medieval Latin from Greek pharmakeia ‘practice of the druggist’, based on pharmakon ‘drug’.

Yes Luke from the Bible was a Physician but back in his day little white tablets pushed by Big Pharma did not grow on trees.

Its gets even deeper when you look into the meaning behind the medical industry symbol which Big Pharma also uses.

Rod of Asclepius

The caduceus is the traditional symbol of Hermes and features two snakes winding around an often winged staff. It is often mistakenly used as a symbol of medicine instead of the Rod of Asclepius, especially in the United States.

caduceus-medical-symbol-260nw-320999165.jpg


Strongs Bible word refference 5331 from KJV Revelation 9:21 ( SORCERIES )
 

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The Righterzpen

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But Sorcery does not exist in the real world. Unless you substitute Sorcery for sleight of hand scam artist,

Yes Luke from the Bible was a Physician but back in his day little white tablets pushed by Big Pharma did not grow on trees.

Some rather interesting points have been brought up here that I never thought about.

I would agree with @AppleGold that much of what we see today are magicians parlor tricks; which is probably true of history in general.

Much of what we see today as magic is entertainment.

Anyone who knows much about Harry Houdini though can get a glimpse of the other side of this. Harry had become part of the spiritist movement of the day and really wanted to contact his deceased mother. He so wanted to believe this was possible that he'd participate in seances and soon became quite disillusioned with the whole movement because as an entertaining magician; he knew all the tricks.

So Houdini posed a challenge to anyone willing to take him up on it. He would give them X amount of money if he could not prove they were a fraud. In the beginning, he had many who took him up on this offer. He exposed every single one of them and before too much longer there weren't any more challengers. Consequently the public interest in the spiritist movement died pretty quickly.

So in that sense, I think Houdini taught us all a valuable lesson about spiritual truth even. The question he brought to the forefront of exposure actually has to do with the closing of Scripture cannon and whether or not God is still bringing additional revelation. (Subject of another thread though.)

What Houdini apparently demonstrated though is that there was no more breaking of the supernatural burier between demonic forces and the material living world. Not to say that Satan or his minions aren't alive and well and actively attempting as well as deceiving people; they certainly are. They just do so via "lying signs and wonders". None of it is real, as far as breaking the burier between natural and supernatural world.

And here is where I always understood genuine "sorcery" to be referenced in the Scripture as. (The breaking of the burier between natural and supernatural as opposed to magician parlor tricks.)

Now obviously very dark things continue to happen that are incredibly deceptive. There's rumors of trafficking, pedophilia, human sacrifice, cannibalism etc. alleged to be connected to people of power. Which... does that represent supernatural events or as @Billy UK has pointed out; people manipulated by use of drugs?

The evil is certainly real. What more does it amount to than abject wickedness? I don't know?

@Billy UK does bring up a point I'd never put together before, in speaking of use of drugging the victim. I never knew that was the basis of the Greek word.

And that's an interesting connection, because I do remember watching a documentary about an African Christian preacher who'd been a tribal "medicine man". And he was talking about the process of "zombification". This is obviously something quite well entrenched in traditional African culture and he'd brought a lot of people to saving faith by exposing how these "medicine men" do this. (They use drugs that make the person appear to be dead; and then they bring them back as "zombies".) Now of course this is all done to control the community and to make the people support these "witch doctors". Obviously it's all a scam though because these people aren't really dead. They are just in a drug induced stupor.

So.. if I were to give my hypothesis on this; concerning "legitimate supernatural" or "drug induced". I'd say one is used as a gate way to believing the other. I don't believe Satan has the legitimate ability to break the burier between the natural and supernatural world. That being said though; he's certainly capable of deceiving people!

Now of course the use of medicine and the pharmaceutical industry is a whole other subject. I don't think human invented drugs are wrong, depending on what they are used for. I certainly wouldn't want to have surgery without anesthesia.

But again; parsing of knowledge God has given us. What man uses for evil; God meant for good.
 
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LiquidCat

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The bible does mention several times that it forbids the practice of Sorcery. But Sorcery does not exist in the real world. Unless you substitute Sorcery for sleight of hand scam artist, ie. professional pickpocket. Or substitute Sorcery for psychology to trick people into doing what you want. Ie. this guy has mind control, when it really isn't magic, but he is good at convincing you at doing wrong.

Sorcery does exist put such person has to be indwelled or using spirits to do such things / posessed.
 
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Gregory Thompson

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The bible does mention several times that it forbids the practice of Sorcery. But Sorcery does not exist in the real world. Unless you substitute Sorcery for sleight of hand scam artist, ie. professional pickpocket. Or substitute Sorcery for psychology to trick people into doing what you want. Ie. this guy has mind control, when it really isn't magic, but he is good at convincing you at doing wrong.
Sorcery is a way of doing things. Even prayer can be sorcery. The difference between prayer and sorcery. is prayer connects to God through our trust in Him and we have a conversation, sorcery projects the will of the person "praying" onto their object of change and has prayer language as a pretense.

An example of a prayer meeting going dark is when the group begins to pray for someone to agree with the church doctrine. Even if they were correct in their doctrinal assertions, they are 1) stepping in to do God's Job, and 2) Are robbing the person of the opportunity to geniunely repent i.e. change their mind and life. If repentance comes because of prayer based mind control, it's not real and does not connect to God.
 
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Billy UK

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Sorcery is a way of doing things. Even prayer can be sorcery. The difference between prayer and sorcery. is prayer connects to God through our trust in Him and we have a conversation, sorcery projects the will of the person "praying" onto their object of change and has prayer language as a pretense.

An example of a prayer meeting going dark is when the group begins to pray for someone to agree with the church doctrine. Even if they were correct in their doctrinal assertions, they are 1) stepping in to do God's Job, and 2) Are robbing the person of the opportunity to geniunely repent i.e. change their mind and life. If repentance comes because of prayer based mind control, it's not real and does not connect to God.

.
 
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Billy UK

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I think when we begin to get into the area of the will we don't fully realise how deep the subject is.

I believe we have free will in the sense of possesing the power to choose to do what we desire in the spectrum of choice that we possess.

That ability to choose is the determining factor that decides the path we in the present moment choose to follow. It is the conscious being inside which right now as you read is deciding whether to choose or reject what I say as right or wrong .

At the core of our being that power of choice is affected by the factors which in turn influence our will which operates through our beliefs and perceptions of reality. These choices are then again influenced through the 5 fleshly senses of taste sight hearing touch and smell.

A sorcerer who uses evil spirits through witchcraft and drugs by sorcery
uses them to exploit this area of choice and will in order to control others by manipulation. The person under this control will most likely have no idea that behind their choices is satanic and demonic influence . A person under a delusion has no idea their under one and in their pride believe they are in control of their life. Hence why God sits in the heavens and laughs at those who somehow have became so delusional in darkness that they have come to believe they will overthrow God.

Psalm 2 (KJV)

2 Why do the heathen rage, and the people imagine a vain thing?

2 The kings of the earth set themselves, and the rulers take counsel together, against the Lord, and against his anointed, saying,

3 Let us break their bands asunder, and cast away their cords from us.

4 He that sitteth in the heavens shall laugh: the Lord shall have them in derision.
 
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ItalianStallion

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AppleGold

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Alchemy is wrong? So I shouldn't learn my periodic table of elements? Nostradamus turned lead into gold.
You mean astrology, horoscope and planet meditations actually work in seeing your future? It has never helped me of course I tried it along time ago and only once or twice before it was pointed out to me it is against god.
 
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Billy UK

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It depends in the end how God judges Alchemy as its man trying to play God through believing they can interfear with or rather pervert his creation into something it was not meant to be in many cases. if one reads the book of Enoch we see that this was what happened in Noahs day and like God said as in the days of Noah so it will likewise be in the days of his second coming . Remember that in revelation its the ones who take the Mark that recieve from the Plagues.

Psalm 106:29 KJV)

29 Thus they provoked him to anger with their inventions: and the plague brake in upon them.

Transgenderism is a prime example of how man changes the creation of God from one thing into the other.

Changing Lead into Gold through Alchemy is a Satanic Philosophy hence why they used the Philosophy in Harry Potter and the Philosophers Stone as changing Lead into Gold has an esoteric meaning to initiated ones of witchcraft and sorcery.
 
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hedrick

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There doesn't seem to be a clear definition. However it seems to involve using the supernatural in a harmful ways. I would say that ethically it's sorcery even if the power it attempts to use doesn't exist. The kinds of things we usually think are involve trying to use supernatural power to kill or otherwise harm someone. But could prayers to the real God that call on him to do something harmful be considered sorcery? Since God judges by intent I'd say only if the person realizes they are harmful.
 
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JackRT

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But could prayers to the real God that call on him to do something harmful be considered sorcery? Since God judges by intent I'd say only if the person realizes they are harmful.

I would agree. But a lot of Christians are likely guilty of unintentional sorcery.
 
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