What does it mean to be a man?

[slimfish]

This stems from another post about "men" being "men" in church. I'm wonder what it means to be a man. Is it something that is black and white; there are man things to do and woman things to do? Do these areas ever overlap? Are men supposed to react to God the same way women react? And are we making man in God's image or God in man's image? I know there are a lot of questions there, don't feel you have to answer them all, but I would appreciate your thoughts.

 

[Jenna]

In my personal opinion, when I hear someone complain about a guy not acting like a 'man', I don't think of gender specific duties or roles. Times when I have felt that someone was not being a man was when they were being less than honorable, shunned responsibilities, refused to care for those under his protection, abused a position of power, etc. Of course these all speak to areas where we should all strive to excel in, regardless of gender. Women just have different ways of exhibiting their more lovely qualities and have different things expected from them. For me, if my husband isn't living by what God's word says is righteous behavior for a man, then I am more apt to think that he isn't living as a 'man'. During those times he is lost in foolishness and is acting like a boy, instead of utilizing his God-given gifts to prosper mentally, spiritually, and physically. To me, THAT is what becoming a man is about, not so much a matter of hobbies or sports.

Now, as a separate issue, I believe that women of the world have been working real hard to win equality with men....and surpass them. I see that as usurping a man's position, and many women do that through bringing men down to a lower level, instead of trying to honestly better themselves. Unfortunately, selfishness seems to run rampant among many women these days, and we're complex enough to find manipulative ways to get what we want. Hey, and if that means slowly degrading men for their testosterone or seeking to humiliate men for enjoying what comes naturally to them, then it is done. I'm not saying that all women are like this. Shoot, there are some women who enjoy a man who is confident, assertive, generous, and loving. Not everyone likes a guy with a backbone that resembles milktoast. lol Some do though. I know lots of women who only seem to love men because of the power they have learned to exert on them. All in all, men need the freedom to act like the creatures that they were created to be, and women to have the same freedom, all without criticism. Like I said though, I think that these are two separate, but related, issues.

 

[slimfish]

Very insightful, thanks. I get the feeling that complaints about men are born when a particular man doesn't live up a certain expectation. Who knows, kind of a complex issue. One that certainly won't be understood by reading Wild at Heart alone.

 

[Jenna]

I think that people bound back and forth between expecting too much, and expecting too little. It's always important to keep in mind that no one is perfect, and we're all going to mess up. A man isn't any less of a man because he makes a mistake. We all do that. It has more to do with owning up to it, and making things 'right' as best we are able to. I think that that goes for everyone.

Like I said though, sometimes I think that we can expect too little, and withhold chances for growth because of it. This was something that happened with my husband through is growing years, something that I am trying to do serious battle with now. If no one ever gives a guy a chance to learn, express himself, and have a positive role model, it makes things more difficult by far. Some mothers (and mothering figures) enjoy having their little boys STAY little boys, that they don't allow them to have the experiences and responsibilities that will prepare them for adulthood. Each one of us grows up though, and all it does is leave each boy unprepared when he reaches his adulthood. I don't really blame mothers though, as they are only capable of giving certain things to a boy. Each boy needs his father, and the positive influence that a righteous man can have on a child who will one day lead his own family. It's no wonder that marriage and family are so important, eh? One broken link begins to tear down the whole structure.....

 

[desi]

Being a man... The Bible is the best advice you can find in this area if you have the patience to seek it.

 

[Jenna]

*nods* Of course. God's Word is the best rule that we have to measure ourselves by and learn from.

 

[bkg]

I really like what Dr. Phil says about the measure of a man...

The measure of a man isn't the amount of money he makes, how good he is at this or that, his social status, or even his activity in the church...

It's how well he treats his wife and family. If his wife can be in a room of a thousand women and know w/o a doubt that she is the most loved, cared-for, respected, and cherished woman in that room... then her husband is "a man"...

 

[charligirl]

In my personal opinion, when I hear someone complain about a guy not acting like a 'man', I don't think of gender specific duties or roles. Times when I have felt that someone was not being a man was when they were being less than honorable, shunned responsibilities, refused to care for those under his protection, abused a position of power, etc. Of course these all speak to areas where we should all strive to excel in, regardless of gender. Women just have different ways of exhibiting their more lovely qualities and have different things expected from them. For me, if my husband isn't living by what God's word says is righteous behavior for a man, then I am more apt to think that he isn't living as a 'man'. During those times he is lost in foolishness and is acting like a boy, instead of utilizing his God-given gifts to prosper mentally, spiritually, and physically. To me, THAT is what becoming a man is about, not so much a matter of hobbies or sports.

Now, as a separate issue, I believe that women of the world have been working real hard to win equality with men....and surpass them. I see that as usurping a man's position, and many women do that through bringing men down to a lower level, instead of trying to honestly better themselves. Unfortunately, selfishness seems to run rampant among many women these days, and we're complex enough to find manipulative ways to get what we want. Hey, and if that means slowly degrading men for their testosterone or seeking to humiliate men for enjoying what comes naturally to them, then it is done. I'm not saying that all women are like this. Shoot, there are some women who enjoy a man who is confident, assertive, generous, and loving. Not everyone likes a guy with a backbone that resembles milktoast. lol Some do though. I know lots of women who only seem to love men because of the power they have learned to exert on them. All in all, men need the freedom to act like the creatures that they were created to be, and women to have the same freedom, all without criticism. Like I said though, I think that these are two separate, but related, issues.

*Nodding in agreement!* absolutely!

 

[GirlieGirl]

I heard someone say that the lack of good true men in society is to be blamed on women. Women have raised boys and then never insisted they become men by accepting responsibility for their actions and especially for taking care of their families. And women who date and then marry basically grown boys do further harm by tolerating their behavior. In a nutshell, if we (meaning us girls) are overrun with sissiess instead of men, it's our own darn faults.

While I'm still thinking about it, I think I agree.

 

[Jenna]

I think that to some extent, I agree. However, if we all had fathers (or father figures) in our lives who showed us how men were to be, more women would have an idea as to what they want in a spouse or in their susequent children. The breakdown of the importance of marriage and family have left a lot of women parenting on their own, and they don't have a clue on how to really raise a boy. I know that I wouldn't have a good idea as to what a boy really needs, being that I'm such a vastly different creature by design. I do think that women perpetuate the problem though. So many women are into proving that they can do everything without a man that they forget that there are some things that women just can't teach on their own. Of course, if you smell something burning, that's probably just me, tied to a stake after making comments against extreme feminism. *chuckles* I don't think that it is all the fault of women though. It isn't like men don't have the Word of God to guide them into behavior that is fitting for a man. If they choose to ignore it and do their own thing, then they are just as much at fault; as are women who don't choose to do as the Lord calls for our gender.

 

[charligirl]

'Wild at Heart' by John Eldridge is a must read on this subject. He teaches that masculinity can only be bestowed from man to boy (usually father to son) and if that does not occur the boy will grow up either with some sort of mask to the world that he is macho or can have serious issues inside his head about whether he is 'good enought' as a man.

He uses the example of his 10 year old rock climbing, he was watching from below and the boy shouts out "look at me dad", his father shouts back "wow you're a real wild man up there". When he has finished and speaks to his father later he looks up with shinig eyes and asks "did I REALLY look like a wild man dad?" That moment is so crucial, if his afther had dismissed him he would have been wounded in the heart of his young, growing masculinity.. his Dad said 'yes son you were a real wild man!'

Simple stuff but alot of power in that.

 

[nuarc]

...
The measure of a man isn't the amount of money he makes, how good he is at this or that, his social status, or even his activity in the church...
It's how well he treats his wife and family. If his wife can be in a room of a thousand women and know w/o a doubt that she is the most loved, cared-for, respected, and cherished woman in that room... then her husband is "a man"...

 

[WolfGate]

I heard someone say that the lack of good true men in society is to be blamed on women. Women have raised boys and then never insisted they become men by accepting responsibility for their actions and especially for taking care of their families. And women who date and then marry basically grown boys do further harm by tolerating their behavior. In a nutshell, if we (meaning us girls) are overrun with sissiess instead of men, it's our own darn faults.

While I'm still thinking about it, I think I agree.

I don't agree entirely. If women have raised boys and never insisted they become men - then where were the fathers? Men and women are equal before God, but we are not identical. How can women intuitively understand how to lead a boy to grow into a man.

Fathers need to grow up themselves and take responsibility for raising men. Men who aren't passive, who accept responsibility, who lead courageously and who expect to love God and be rewarded for their faithfulness.

 

[Jenna]

Amen!!

 

[Tuffguy]

Boys take after their fathers and their mothers. The #1 thing that boys want from there dads is to be accepted, praised, and made to feel like there dad is proud of them. Boys need caring love from there mom. Thats really about it. If a boy can get those things from their parents then they have about 99% of what they need.

Women are bossy and men are lazy. That is what womens/mens roles all boils down to. 'Men' are often times lazy and all to willing to let 'women' boss them around and take the leadership role. After all,,,if you really are good at something that means you are the one that people will push into that role. That role = more work. Lots of guys don't like to work so they would rather trade off their own personal pride then get off there butts and step up to the plate.
In the worst case, the women need to make the husbands realize that they are the ones that need to step up. Clearly, this is a bad situation on both parts. It is equally bad when the woman is not doing her job in the home and the man has to do everything from working full time to garbage, lawn, car, kids, shopping,,,ect. duties.
I think alot of the times women lock heads with there husbands and form the worst type of power struggle on who will do what. Rather they should just define what each person will do,,and then stick too it. Sure there are always exceptions to be made every now and then, but rules/roles are made on the norm, not the exception.
Thats my $.02.