What do you think of progressive Neo-Marcionism?

[Pink Spider]

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What do you think of progressive Neo-Marcionism?
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- Yes, it was declared a Heresy in AD 144.

- No, it's not another gnostic belief, although some
think it is.

- No, it's not anti-Semitic, although some have
interpreted that it is (to support their own
warped agenda).

If you don't know what I'm talking about check
out Marcion of Sinope - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia.


I personally believe, that the Marcionist position
solves more problems than it creates, which
of course is a good thing.
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[lesliedellow]

I think Marcion was talking nonsense. He doesn't think the Old Testament God was the same God as the New Testament, and yet Jesus clearly thought otherwise. It is almost inconceivable that any first century Jew would not have regarded Yahweh as being the one true God.

Yet Marcion wanted to claim that he was a follower of Jesus, whilst at the same time rejecting a central belief of Jewish monotheism which Jesus, along with his contemporaries in Judea, simply took for granted.

 

[ViaCrucis]

I would say it creates more problems than it solves.

Jesus as the Messiah/Christ is a meaningless idea outside of the context of the history of Yahweh's covenant promises.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[dcalling]

From the short wiki version, I think he is incorrect. OT God and the Heavenly Father Jesus is talking about is the same, from the 10 commandments, to the way the prophets calls the Jews to turn back to him, it should be the same God (i.e. God let Cain go after he murders Abel, Jesus let the woman with sin "go and sin no more").

 

[jacks]

Interesting idea, I've never heard of it before. Thanks for posting; for me however, it seems a bit inconsistent with what I think the Bible is saying.

 

[football5680]

It creates more problems than it solves because to accept this you must reject what Jesus said and at that point what are you supposed to believe?

For if you believed Moses, you would believe me; for he wrote of me. But if you do not believe his writings, how will you believe my words?” (John 5:46-47)

 

[ebia]

. . . What do you think of progressive Neo-Marcionism? . - Yes, it was declared a Heresy in AD 144. - No, it's not another gnostic belief, although some think it is. - No, it's not anti-Semitic, although some have interpreted that it is (to support their own warped agenda). If you don't know what I'm talking about check out Marcion of Sinope - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. I personally believe, that the Marcionist position solves more problems than it creates, which of course is a good thing. .

Well, in so far as it is different from gnostism it shares many of that's problems. I really don't see how it solves much at all. I'm not sure how throwing away everything Jesus was about in his context could.

 

[Faulty]

It creates two gods when there is only a single God. That's a problem.

It also attempts to separate Jesus from the OT, when it was the OT that foretold the details of his coming in a great variety of detailed prophecies, when Jesus Himself stated the OT scriptures were all about Him, when Jude stated that Jesus was the God of the OT who spoke and walked with Moses and gave him the commandments and laws, and when Hebrews and John tie Him directly to Genesis as the sole Creator.

 

[Pink Spider]

Thanks for your replies!

I will answer tomorrow - but this part of
the forum is not for debating mind you!

I'm a bit surprised that nobody has asked
what the 'Neo' and the 'Progressive' in
Progressive Neo-Marcionism is all about!

 

[lesliedellow]

I'm a bit surprised that nobody has asked
what the 'Neo' and the 'Progressive' in
Progressive Neo-Marcionism is all about!

If the original was up the wall, the new version is unlikely to be an improvement. Why name it after Marcion otherwise?

 

[Lukaris]

Another major issue to consider is that Marcion denies the humanity that the Lord assumed from incarnation, life, death, to resurrection. Notice the Lord always healed our sinful wounds of death & moral decay on a human level, without sin, so we could have everlasting life. Marcion claims to uphold the preaching of Sts. Paul & Luke but they are the major fathers of orthodox doctrine of the Lord's divinity traditionally held by Trinitarian Christians. Also see Luke 24:43-44 re the Lord's own testimony to the Scriptures.

 

[Pink Spider]

If the original was up the wall[...]

'Up the wall' by a small margin - I read somewhere that it was
close to create a schism in the early church.
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[...]the new version is unlikely to be an improvement. Why name it after Marcion otherwise?

Because he was one of the first to say out loud what many
people thought and still think:

Why is the OT god so different from the NT god?.
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[lesliedellow]

Why is the OT god so different from the NT god?.
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He isn't. People who think otherwise haven't read Revelation, or Luke 16.19-24, lately. The God of the New Testament is no more tolerant of sin than is the God of the Old Testament.

Learn to do well; seek judgment, relieve the oppressed, judge the fatherless, plead for the widow.

You might expect to hear some such sentiment as that from Jesus, but it is the God of the Old Testament who is there speaking.

 

[football5680]

Why is the OT god so different from the NT god?.
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There is no difference if you understand the context and message that is being presented. The Old Testament covers thousands of years, nations rise and fall and the Israelites obey and disobey God at certain points. The New Testament is about Jesus and his fulfillment of the Old Testament prophecies and what this means for the people today.

In both the Old and New Testament God is loving but he will not tolerate sin. In the Old Testament because it takes place over such a long time frame, we can see the actions that God took to punish the Israelites. In the New Testament it still speaks about the punishment that will be inflicted by God on people who sin but it is in prophecy. Some Christians just want Jesus to be a free ticket to heaven with no obligation on their part but this isn't what Jesus promised. People who truly love him and truly follow him listen to his commandments and obey, the people who deny him through their beliefs or actions will be dealt with.

 

[theophilus777]

Why is the OT god so different from the NT god?[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT].
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Enough people have decried this false statement that it is time to address the merit that it has. And that is simple to do. The way God relates to man changed from OT to NT. Specifically, we can differentiate 4 major Covenants God has made available for our species to enter into with Him, each building on the one before it.