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What Bible do you use?

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Epiphoskei

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That story about James sounds like a myth to me. At least I've never heard anything about it, and I'm sure there were more than 9 translators.

The text type which the KJV used is often called the recieved text, or textus receptus, however it's fallen out of use in scholarship because it's clearly errant in several places. All modern translations come from what is called a critical text, which is to say that scholars gathered all the existing texts together and tried to determine what the text most reasonably originally said. Alexandrinus is one of the texts analyzed, but it is not the source of any modern translation. And if the copyist(s) of Alexandrinus really despised the deity of Christ he certainly didn't do a good job of expunging it, since the text is largely identical.

Certain manuscripts do have more or less titles of God or Christ. Some may say "the Lord" and others "the Lord God," etc., however nothing is significantly lost or added in most any of these variants. It is more reasonable to assume that these worked their way into the text by copyists simply being accustomed to writing out fuller titles, rather than some great anti-Jesus conspiracy.
 
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BereanTodd

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Read acts 17:10-11. The Bereans were honored because they not only listened to the apostles but they daily checked to see if what they were being told was true. Do the same. Don't take your pastor's word for it. Because what he has said above is, at best, very skewed and misinformed, and at worst completely intentionally lieing.
 
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arunma

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I use ONLY the KJV. I believe that it was translated from the actual greek manuscripts

This is well and good, but belief must be based on fact. Would you agree? The Textus Receptus, from which the KJV was translated, is a compilation of several different manuscripts, none of which were very ancient. Modern Bibles are translated from manuscripts that date back as early as 250 AD. Make sure your faith is well-founded and not blind, because God never demanded blind faith from anyone. Blind faith tends to lead to false religion, and ultimately hell.

if my memory serves, the greek manuscripts were found in Spain somewhere and King James being the ruthless guy he was, had 9 scholars in groups of 3 I believe and threatened that if they wrongly interpreted the manuscripts wrongly they faced death.

Never heard this story before. The history of the KJV translation is fairly well documented, and you can read about it. It was done in a reasonably responsible manner, though King James banned the translators from adding margin notes and wanted the KJV to conform to the ecclesiology of the Anglican Church. Perhaps that's why the KJV uses words such as "bishop" (the Anglican Church was and still is episcopal in authority structure). I encourage you to do a bit of research. Can you find this story documented by any legitimate historian?

my pastor told me something about the KJV bible being the "textus receptus" the most accepted interpretation. the NIV came from I learned from the alexandrious(spelling?) texts and he despised the deity of GOD.

Ask yourself: does this conform to the word of God? Your translation of choice says,
Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost. (1 Corinthians 12:3)
Modern Bibles, based on the Alexandrian manuscripts, repeatedly teach the Lordship and divinity of Jesus Christ. I could quote scores of verses which speak to this effect, if you so desire. Attributing the works of God to Satan is blasphemy of the Holy Spirit, which is an unforgivable sin (Matthew 12:27,31). So as a brother I lovingly urge you to be careful what you say and believe about modern Bible translations. The problem with KJV-only propaganda is that it promulgates lies about modern translations, Bible translators, and Christians who use these translations. I am not a liberal Christian or a heretic. I confess the virgin birth, deity, and resurrection of Jesus Christ. I believe in the inerrency of the Scriptures. I believe that salvation comes only by faith in Jesus Christ, and that all non-Christians are condemned to hell. I hope that you will trust me as a fellow Christian. And in this capacity I am telling you that KJV-onlyism is an outright lie. There is no evidence whatsoever that the Alexandrian manuscript line is "satanic," that the Alexandrian scribes despised Christ, or that they rejected his divinity. Be reasonable: why would a satanic translation teach that Jesus Christ rose from the dead and sits at the right hand of God? Why would the devil teach that salvation is by grace through faith, apart from works? Why would Satan inspire a Bible translation which calls the devil a liar and the father of lies, and which teaches us to glorify God and obey the Gospel of his Son?

A common KJV-only charge is that the Bible claims that nothing good can come from Alexandria. This is not true, because the Bible states that Apollos, who was well-known among the apostles, was a native of Alexandria (Acts 18:24). Saint Athanasius, who was the bishop of Alexandria in the fourth century, was one of the most vehement defenders of Christ's divinity, and opposed the Arian heresy at the Council of Nicea in 325 AD. But proponents of KJV-onlyism will neglect these facts because they are liars.

KJV-onlyism is based on blatently fradulent claims about history and on gross misinterpretations of Scripture. It shuts the Kingdom of Heaven in men's faces by forcing Christians to read an archaic translation written in a form of English which has a very different meaning than the current vernacular. I strongly encourage you to do as Todd suggested. If KJV-only doctrine is true, then you should be able to find it in the Bible. KJV-onlyists will usually cite Biblical passages in which God has promised to preserve his word. Remember: every one of those passages is also found in modern Bibles. God's promise to preserve his word does not mean that he has promised to preserve it in the form of the King James Bible. Formulating doctrine without a Scriptural basis leads to heresy, and often to hell. I have the utmost respect for church authority, but don't believe something just because a pastor says it's true.
 
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Beckyy25

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Nice idea this thread Cody

I use the NKJV because that's the only English Bible I have at home. But in the net I mostly use the NIV from Biblegateway, but sometimes also KJV.

My mother tongue is Romanian, so I also have several Romanian Bibles (the Cornilescu version) at home. Also I have a German Bible, Martin Luther version and an Italian one, the second edition of 'Nuova Riveduta'.

I prefer the Romanian Cornilescu version because it's the most accurate translation I've read until now, but I often compare the texts with all other Bibles I have, this helps in understanding better things or clarifying certain unclear issues.
 
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edie19

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that dreaded message
You have given out too much Reputation in the last 24 hours, try again later
but I'll be back later
 
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the particular baptist

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Amen brother very well said.
 
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LovebirdsFlying

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mlqurgw

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I use the KJV for several reasons: I believe it is as good a translation as most, the language is rich and often the best at conveying the meaning of many words when actually studied out in both the Greek, Hebrew and English. One example is the word translated charity. When you actually consider what the word charity meant to the KJV translators rather than what it means in modern English it makes the meaning much richer than just translating to love. Because I have used it for many years now it is the one I am most familiar with. As with all translations there are words and phrases that could be better translated in it. I use other translations as well in study but abhor all those paraphrased versions that aren't translations such as the Message and The Living Bible. The translation I dislike the most is the NIV.
 
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Epiphoskei

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Admittadly the KJV has richer language, however sometimes that can get you into more trouble than it's worth.

For instance, I've heard a Catholic priest defend indulgences using that very example you gave, the translation of love as charity. "Charity covers over a multitude of sins," he said. That's beyond the bound of agape, and if had just said love, we wouldn't have this problem.
 
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edie19

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it's funny - a few of us just happened to be talking about this after church today. One of the gentlemen who attends my church is of Greek background - he mentioned that Greek has words for everything and how sometimes folks just have to do the best they can when translating from Greek because no other language has the all the same words. One of his examples John 1:18
KJV
No man hath seen God at any time, the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.
NASB
No one has seen God at any time; the only begotten God who is in the bosom of the Father, He has explained Him.
According to Jim the Greek correctly translates to only begotten God.

But that's beside the point.

My pastor pointed out some things that hadn't occurred to me re: the KJVO discussion.

1. KJVO onlyism tends to be debated most among Baptists.

2. As the British monarch King James was the head of the Church of England. Historically Baptists believe in separation of church and state and state that the church has only one head - Jesus the Christ. Anyone who stands in His stead is considered an antiChrist.

3. The Textus Receptus (upon which the KJV translation is based) was compiled by a paedobaptist Roman Catholic (Erasmus).

Neither of those things make the KJV a bad translation - but it is interesting.
 
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arunma

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Very interesting, I didn't know that Erasmus was a Roman Catholic. It's a bit disturbing, I think, because the Catholic Church had more or less plunged into apostasy by this time in history (and it remains there to this day). Anyway, all of this makes for strange bedfellows, I think. We can see that churches that lean KJV-only may even be committing many other follies that for a long time distinguished the Catholic Church. Our old friend RichardT, who used frequent this forum and who was a staunch defender of KJV-onlyism, attended a church which also taught that the Sun and solar system orbit the earth! I think that KJV-onlyism requires a certain suspension of disbelief which leads to a rejection of the very notion of truth. Church dogmas then fill the spiritual vacuum. It's a very dangerous doctrine indeed.
 
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Epiphoskei

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Of course there isn't any problem if you like it and can understand it. No one is "bashing" the KJV, it just has its faults like every translation. What is a problem is the KJV only movement, and since two different KJV only-ers have posted in this thread, we've had to adress that error here.
 
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arunma

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I read the KJV, but I have no problem with the other versions. It's just easier for me to stick with one version of the bible. That being said, why are you people bashing the KJV?? THERE'S NOTHING WRONG WITH READING THE KJV!!

No one here is saying there's anything wrong with reading the KJV. I have a KJV on my bookshelf (though I rarely use it these days). And no one should bash the translation. For well over two hundred years it was the Bible for English-speakers. There is, however, a severe problem with saying that God specially inspired the KJV Bible, that other manuscripts of the Bible that Christians worked to preserve are inspired by Satan (= blasphemy of the Holy Spirit). Such a belief is founded on lies and mislabels good as evil (which is sin according to Isaiah 5:20). Therefore we must vehemently oppose this heresy and lovingly correct our brothers who have strayed into it. We must also attack the beliefs of pastors and authors who write to support these doctrines, because they have lying tongues and hate the truth. They cause divisions in the church with their foolish doctrines: this is a work of the flesh according to Galatians 5:20, and Jude 1:19 says that people who do this are devoid of the Spirit. We can't let Christ's church be destroyed by such a groundless and arbitrary doctrine. This isn't an issue of agreeing to disagree. KJV-onlyism is just plain wrong. It hasn't a Scriptural leg to stand on, and must be purged from the church.
 
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DeaconDean

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Brother, I agree whole-heartedly with all you said except for your last sentence.

As a Southern Baptist, we have dealt with just this type of arguement in seminary.

What it really boils down to is that as you said, the KJV Bible has served the church well, and faithfully since 1611. And I dare say, that if this world continues, it will continue to serve the church well for another 400 years.

But I personally see nothing wrong with a church deciding for itself that it wants the KJV (or amy other version for that matter) as its default version.

If you don't like a church that uses the KJV, find another. Personally, I don't like the NIV, and if I ever attend or go looking for another church, you can bet it won't be a church that uses the NIV. But I don't condemn that church for using it, and likewise, I don't look down my nose at them either, if that is what they feel most comfortable with, God Bless 'em.

But I will add this, if you can show me one single version that don't have translation errors in it, I convert to that one.

Sure the language is archaic, sure its not taught anymore. But the KJV has been said to be the most beautiful version ever written.


Here is what others have said:


Now I have said and I'll always maintain that the proper version for each individual is as Erwin Lutzer said is the version you pick up and read and study, whether it is the KJV, the NIV, RSV, ASV, etc.

But personally, I still see nothing wrong with a church deciding for itself whichever version it wants as its default version. (Should it matter that it is the KJV? No, but some make it a matter.)

Which brings up another question. Would people complain if there was a movement that started which called for RSVism only. Would people gripe about that as much as they do about KJV onlyers?

KJV onlyism, is it right? No. But is it completely wrong? No.

God Bless

Till all are one.
 
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the particular baptist

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Greetings brother. I dont think the beef is that churches use the KJV for uniformity but that the agenda of KJVonlyism is that the KJV is superior over all others because it is advanced revelation. We recommend the ESV at our church for uniformity but how many here would correct me if i said we insist that the ESV is superior to all others because since Grudem and Piper worked on it it is advanced revelation ?
 
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BereanTodd

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Dean, come on you are smarter than that. No one here has a problem with a church deciding to use the kJV as its default version. That is not what KJOism is. KJOism says not just that "we choose to use the kJV" but that the KJV is the ONLY inspired version and that all others are wrong/sinful/demonic/in error whereas the KJV is perfect and free of error. THAT is the lie from Satan that we are fighting here.
 
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