we fall down...we get up...we fall down...

[endure]

reading this almost made me cry...
it messed me up inside and made me cry out to God for a change...


hosea 6.4
"O ephraim, what shall i do unto thee? O judah what shall i do unto thee?
for your goodness is as a morning cloud. and as the early dew, it goeth away.

you goodness...is as the early dew......it goeth away.

just like the dew, it comes every morning, but it always goes away.
our goodness always comes with our joy and happiness in God when we repent or go to church and feel renewed....but it always goes away...we always return to that sinful lazy tired sinner again.
the goodness in our lives....it always goes away.

i pray God will change this.
just like he was not happy with this in ephraim or judah, he isnt happy with it in us either. no amount of grace, will make this his desire.
and that....will never allow me to stop working or lay down in my sin and find anykind of contentment there.
david said "ye that love the Lord HATE SIN!"
even if i was bound to always sin, no amount of grace would ever make me happy in it....
to the christian who really knows the Lord and walks with him , a sinful life is a dreadful life.

and the fact that i will never be happy in it, will keep me preaching holiness of lifestyle, for the rest of my days.

 

[Chilldogg77]

Endure, how much time do you set aside for God every day? I'm not talking about praying throughout the day, I'm talking about time set aside spent only praying or reading and meditating, which is a form of prayer. If you truly desire a truly holy, happy lifestyle, you should do this. I am a lazy individual, but this is worth it. It shows God that you are committed. It shows him how much you love him. Maybe you do this already, but my experience has lead me to believe that if you were, you wouldn't be feeling like this.
As far as the joy and happiness that we feel when we repent, that is only God's grace, and it comes and goes. What matters is our commitment, even without that grace. This shows that we love God for him, not for the way he makes us feel. This, when you think about it, is the purpose of life on earth. God could have created us and sent us straight to heaven, but then we wouldn't be able to freely choose him, or show that we love him for him.
"Stay gold, Ponyboy."-The Outsiders

 

[endure]

yes i do that.
i generally get out of bed about 2 or 3 hours before i have to go to work.
and spend about and hour in prayer and about an hour or more meditating in the word of God.
there are times when i dont get it done, but pretty much happens consistently.

but im still bothered by something...
the fact that i still do these sinful things.
and it isnt that feel as if i cant be saved anymore or that im hopeless.
i can get back up as quickly as anybody, but the fact that these things still remain hurt me.
but im learning more everyday, about how to put these sins and all sin in general away forever.
but yeah, God is dealing with me and showing me where my weak and broken places are , and certainly one of the things hes telling me is to spend more time praying, reading and fasting than i ever have before.

 

[JDRoss]

Endure,

That verse really speaks to me and I can see where you are coming from. I feel that my goodness goes away. God is showing me though how to deal with some of the more obvious sins and how to remove them from my life. I pray for the strength to carry my cross daily because after a lifetime of living in sin it is hard to get rid of. I know it is God's will though to try to be more and more like Christ and I have faith that I can put away that old man forever. I will pray that your walk grows in strength and that you keep your eyes on Jesus. I know that this helps me when I pray it.

 

[Follower of Christ]

yes i do that.
i generally get out of bed about 2 or 3 hours before i have to go to work.
and spend about and hour in prayer and about an hour or more meditating in the word of God.
there are times when i dont get it done, but pretty much happens consistently.

but im still bothered by something...
the fact that i still do these sinful things.
and it isnt that feel as if i cant be saved anymore or that im hopeless.
i can get back up as quickly as anybody, but the fact that these things still remain hurt me.
but im learning more everyday, about how to put these sins and all sin in general away forever.
but yeah, God is dealing with me and showing me where my weak and broken places are , and certainly one of the things hes telling me is to spend more time praying, reading and fasting than i ever have before.

Your words sound so much like our beloved brother Paul in Romans 7.

I suggest reading it again and really trying to put yourself into Pauls position.
Your strugging against sin is the biggest part of the battle.

As time passes, youre will to not sin will start overriding that sinful nature in you and you will find yourself conforming more and more into His image.

This flesh cannot be perfected.
Dont let anyone fool you into buying that tripe.

Ive watched men tell me they are beyond sin more than once in the last 20 years and then watch them fall into sin deeper than before they were saved.

TAke it a day at a time.

When you wake up, tell yourself and God that you are living Holy today.
Some days youre gonna make it, most you wont for now.
When you fall, pick yourself up, tell Him youre sorry, shake the dust off and give it another shot.

YOu find yourself in the company of the greatest men of God ever known.
Those who have sinned and make everyday an attempt to overcome that sin.

Keep running the race, your effort will all be worth it.
Ill tell you something else pray for sure, but PRAISING Him and practicing His presence will help as well.
His your loving Father, not someone just waiting to zap you when you fall.
Tell Him how you feel about your sin.
Get personal with Him.
Admit your failings and He will help you.
He really wants us to come into the light with our faults.

I have failures of my own i work on daily.
We all do friend.
Youre not alone in this struggle

 

[admtaylor]

Amen to what Follower of Christ just said. I find the more I focus on a holy life the more our enemy throws my way. I'm beginning to stop falling for his ploys now and recognize them for what they are. They're a testimony in themselves of the fact that I have chosen the right path. I find the biggest thing I've had to learn is not to run when I fall. Confront it immediately. Even if it takes being on your knees for long moments of time to come to that place of agreement with God, repentance. Running and ignoring the mistakes just makes life miserable. I've learned the hard way. It's not like it used to be prior to coming to Christ. Then you'd sin and not think twice about it, it wouldn't gnaw at you. Now the longer you TRY to hide from God the worse that gnawing gets until it almost feels as if He's pushing you to your knees to repent. And then once you do, whether there are ramifications for the sin or not, peace floods your soul and your ready to start anew. Ready to tackle that task that privelage, that neccessity of living holy again.

 

[endure]

praise God, thankyou both.
i do take this a day at a time, and i do always jump back up and take hold of a grace that wont let me be condemned.
but on the bright side, i will not let todays sin push perfection out of my mind.
i do beleive in the simple truth, that Jesus died that we may be set free from sin... and that those who are dead to sin, should not live in them anymore.
i really just dont beleive this doctrine thats says that "we still sin, just dont sin like we use to or dont love it or dont live in it"
not that im better than that or those who beleive that, but i beleive God can fully conquer sin in me and bring me to a place in his mercy and grace where the devil can no longer beat me, becuase sin is of the devil.

i am encouraged by what Paul said when he said in romans 6 that the body of sin has been destroyed.
i beleive that means that the old body i used to have, the old life i used to have, that couldnt help but sin, has been destroyed forever. and i am not obligated to commit sins, in Christ Jesus.

ya know, i am glad i can look back and see that paul once struggled with it too, and that other men of God struggled with it too, but i just cant find any rest here in this up and down, and im to busy pressing on and looking up, to be able to stand here in the midst of this marshy sin, to look around and see who else is doing it and HOW TO COPE WITH IT...
i dont want to cope and still be saved inspite of it....i want to be free!
i pray God will change my heart, so that i cannot think one sinful thought, without something in me crying out in pain and passion, to cast that off.
i do not want to ever find a way, to serve the Lord, inspite of sin in my life.
i dont want to cope...i want to be cured...

i praise God for what paul said in romans 7, that even he struggled, but i beleive God brought him out of that, and that was not the final state of his life... i beleive God set him free by the law of the spirit of liberty and the word of God...and i desire to be free aswell.

Godbless
Lee.

 

[Follower of Christ]

praise God, thankyou both.
i do take this a day at a time, and i do always jump back up and take hold of a grace that wont let me be condemned.
but on the bright side, i will not let todays sin push perfection out of my mind.
i do beleive in the simple truth, that Jesus died that we may be set free from sin... and that those who are dead to sin, should not live in them anymore.
i really just dont beleive this doctrine thats says that "we still sin, just dont sin like we use to or dont love it or dont live in it"
not that im better than that or those who beleive that, but i beleive God can fully conquer sin in me and bring me to a place in his mercy and grace where the devil can no longer beat me, becuase sin is of the devil.

i am encouraged by what Paul said when he said in romans 6 that the body of sin has been destroyed.
i beleive that means that the old body i used to have, the old life i used to have, that couldnt help but sin, has been destroyed forever. and i am not obligated to commit sins, in Christ Jesus.

ya know, i am glad i can look back and see that paul once struggled with it too, and that other men of God struggled with it too, but i just cant find any rest here in this up and down, and im to busy pressing on and looking up, to be able to stand here in the midst of this marshy sin, to look around and see who else is doing it and HOW TO COPE WITH IT...
i dont want to cope and still be saved inspite of it....i want to be free!
i pray God will change my heart, so that i cannot think one sinful thought, without something in me crying out in pain and passion, to cast that off.
i do not want to ever find a way, to serve the Lord, inspite of sin in my life.
i dont want to cope...i want to be cured...

i praise God for what paul said in romans 7, that even he struggled, but i beleive God brought him out of that, and that was not the final state of his life... i beleive God set him free by the law of the spirit of liberty and the word of God...and i desire to be free aswell.

Godbless
Lee.

Good Luck brother.

Its wonderful that you are so determined.
Ive found that with each passing year that it gets easier to keep control over the sin nature.
Understand, i do not condone sin, but I also do not beleive in instant sanctification.

It is a long hard road we are on, thats the way it is.

I really detest the fact that someone added those chapter breaks to the Bible.
That break at Romans 8 is in just the right spot to cause all sorts of confusion as folk look at it like its written much later when Paul finally stopped sinning.
But if you pay close attention, you can see 8:1 is just Paul realization that if we are truly walking in the Spirit and are in Christ, we are not condemned.

Remember, we DO NOT SIN....
BUT, *IF* we do sin, we have an advocate with the Father.

I live everyday in a honest attempt to not sin.
Some days I pretty much make it, some days I dont.
I dont deny it, I pray and ask our Father to forgive me, then I move on.

Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus. Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before, I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.

KJV (Phi 3:12-14)

Not that I have already obtained, or have already been made perfect; but I press on, if also I may lay hold of that for which I was laid hold of by Christ Jesus. Brothers, I do not count myself to have laid hold; but one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forward to those things which are ahead, I press toward the goal for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.

English Majority text version(Phi 3:12-14)

Take note that Phillipians was written about 61 AD
About 4 years AFTER Romans chapter 8 would have been written (spring of 57 AD).
Paul as this point still did not consider himself to be without sin as many commonly proclaim.

But the thing I love about that passage is Paul says he presses on.
He tries to attain the Goal.

No Hes not perfect, he admits, so when he does stumble he understands and accepts exactly what has happened.

When we understand our ourselves and how God is working in and with us, it makes it much easier to break away from those lies of satan that try to condemn us.

If you believe that your flesh can be perfected (as my friends in my first post) what happens when you truely believe that you are sanctified and Holy and THEN you stumble?

Have you lost your salvation as one ''second works'' gentleman told me would be the case with him if he ever sinned again.
He told me this and then proceeded to be caught up in some sexual sin against his wife.
Instead of being able to come to us (who would have taken him in with open arms ), He felt he was forced to hide himself as Adam and Eve did in thier shame.

These have helped me understand a bit better.

My little children, these things I write to you, that you may not sin.
And if someone should sin, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous.
(1Jo 2:1)

and

If we claim that we have fellowship with Him, and we are walking in the darkness, we are lying, and are not practicing the truth.

But if we are walking in the light, as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin.

If we claim that we have no sin, we are deceiving ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
If we claim that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.
(1Jo 1:6-10)

written between 85-90 AD, John still is not teaching anything that even remotely sounds like instant sanctification (second work of grace).

 

[endure]

well i dont have time to reply to everything you said
but i will say this

it is always an encouragement and inspiration to me to see paul say the body of sin has been destroyed and Jesus has set us free from sin.
and how peter said that those who suffer can cease to sin.

yeah if i mess up i get back up, but i am pressing to a better place.
a place that i beleive is very attainable in this life.
and if im not there, then theres a problem in me, but not my potential.

 

[water_ripple]

Amen to what Follower of Christ just said. I find the more I focus on a holy life the more our enemy throws my way. I'm beginning to stop falling for his ploys now and recognize them for what they are. They're a testimony in themselves of the fact that I have chosen the right path. I find the biggest thing I've had to learn is not to run when I fall. Confront it immediately. Even if it takes being on your knees for long moments of time to come to that place of agreement with God, repentance. Running and ignoring the mistakes just makes life miserable. I've learned the hard way. It's not like it used to be prior to coming to Christ. Then you'd sin and not think twice about it, it wouldn't gnaw at you. Now the longer you TRY to hide from God the worse that gnawing gets until it almost feels as if He's pushing you to your knees to repent. And then once you do, whether there are ramifications for the sin or not, peace floods your soul and your ready to start anew. Ready to tackle that task that privelage, that neccessity of living holy again.

I must say amen! to this as well..This has been my experience...exactly.

 

[Follower of Christ]

well i dont have time to reply to everything you said
but i will say this

it is always an encouragement and inspiration to me to see paul say the body of sin has been destroyed and Jesus has set us free from sin.
and how peter said that those who suffer can cease to sin.

yeah if i mess up i get back up, but i am pressing to a better place.
a place that i beleive is very attainable in this life.
and if im not there, then theres a problem in me, but not my potential.

you dont have to reply, it wansnt my intent to debate you.

Only to let you know youre facing what we're ALL facing. Ourselves.

Dont get discouraged.
Fight sin with every ounce of strenth in you.

this passage always helps strengthen me:

You have not yet resisted to the point of bloodshed, struggling against sin.

(Heb 12:4)

and its the truth, I havent.
Most of us havent.

Keep pressing on bro. You'll reach the mark

 

[Galadriel]

Hmm, what does it mean to resist to the point of bloodshed?
You mean resist sin till you start hurting people? (sorry, confused)

Well, its true enough that we all fight with ourselves. I often feel that my biggest enemy going is myself, and I bet many know what thats like.

 

[Follower of Christ]

Hmm, what does it mean to resist to the point of bloodshed?
You mean resist sin till you start hurting people? (sorry, confused)

Well, its true enough that we all fight with ourselves. I often feel that my biggest enemy going is myself, and I bet many know what thats like.

Its just saying that they had not resisted against sin to the point of their own bloodshed.

We need to be willing to show self sacrifice if needed in resisting sin.

 

[Galadriel]

Its just saying that they had not resisted against sin to the point of their own bloodshed.

We need to be willing to show self sacrifice if needed in resisting sin.

Ah okay gottcha.
Thanks for ah, setting me straight.