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The Roman Catholic Church teaches that one must be baptized in order to be saved.
I believe that we should want to be baptized because we are saved and water baptism is not a part of being saved.
Now in thinking about this, I tried to find a Bible verse which tells us when Peter was baptized.
You see, the RCC claims Peter as their 1st Pope and the thought occurred to me that if we go with the RCC teaching that a man must be baptized in order to be saved and their 1st Pope has no record of baptism then according to their own teaching, Peter would not have been saved.
Now wouldn't that be a hoot????
Someone will try to use John 14 to say that that event was baptism. NO friends that will not work at all so please save us the argument over it. John 14 IS NOT baptism but is "Foot washing" and the context and exegesis is not about immersion for the cleansing of sin and salvation in any way.
Who is going to explain this?
While I am not here to defend the point that Peter was baptized, so therefore he was the first pope, but I would like to question the idea of baptism altogether.
Which baptism is the one that saves us? Is it the baptism that John started by dunking people in water that will save us? According to John, he says that he baptized us with water, but there is one (Jesus) coming after me who will baptize you with fire. It seems to John, there is a different baptism that Jesus will give us, but it won't be with water, rather with fire. Well, what is this baptism with fire?
I think we can all agree that getting baptized is in direct link with receiving God's spirit (i.e., Jesus' spirit). If that is the case, then what does Jesus say is His spirit? In John 6:63 Jesus says, "It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life." It seems to state that Jesus' words (or teaching) are what gives us His spirit.
Jesus also says in both John 14 and John 16 that the Holy Spirit's job is to remind people of everything that Jesus taught. Are we starting to get the picture?
When we preach and listen to Jesus' teachings, then we are being baptized (which means 'covered') with God's spirit. This, my friends, is what being baptized with Jesus' baptism is all about.
It seems that the early Church was a little confused about this point, let's be honest, they were confused even up until Jesus' ascension to heaven by asking if He was going to restore Israel (the physical nation) to power now. This confusion on the topic of baptism caused them to continue baptizing people with water, thinking this is what pleased God. Apostle Paul was the first one to recognize and expose this error recorded in His letter to the corinthians when he says in 1 Corinthians 1, " 10 Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment.
11 For it hath been declared unto me of you, my brethren, by them which are of the house of Chloe, that there are contentions among you.
12 Now this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ.
13 Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul?
14 I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius;
15 Lest any should say that I had baptized in mine own name.
16 And I baptized also the household of Stephanas: besides, I know not whether I baptized any other.
17 For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect.
Paul rightly recognized how water baptism was one of the main issues that divided the early church, and sadly, the current church. People everywhere argue about what type of baptism we are suppose to have, and in what religious way it is suppose to carried out. This profits nothing, rather causes divisions.
Notice how Paul went on to say that he is happy he did not baptize anyone except these certain people. He then goes on to say how Jesus did not send him to baptize people, rather to PREACH THE GOSPEL. To most people, baptizing people is part of preaching the gospel; but to Paul, he didn't see it that way. What He saw was the truth that there is only one Christian baptism, and it is not with water, but with the fire of Jesus' words.
This is the true baptism that we need to share with the nations brothers and sisters.
In Peace
Keep seeking - Yahweh's Promise in His Word and in Jesus is that if you keep seeking the truth (from Yahweh, not men) and keep seeking Yahweh's Kingdom you will find it , and the truth will set you free..... but I would like to question the idea of baptism altogether.
The Roman Catholic Church teaches that one must be baptized in order to be saved.
I believe that we should want to be baptized because we are saved and water baptism is not a part of being saved.
Now in thinking about this, I tried to find a Bible verse which tells us when Peter was baptized.
You see, the RCC claims Peter as their 1st Pope and the thought occurred to me that if we go with the RCC teaching that a man must be baptized in order to be saved and their 1st Pope has no record of baptism then according to their own teaching, Peter would not have been saved.
Now wouldn't that be a hoot????
Someone will try to use John 14 to say that that event was baptism. NO friends that will not work at all so please save us the argument over it. John 14 IS NOT baptism but is "Foot washing" and the context and exegesis is not about immersion for the cleansing of sin and salvation in any way.
Who is going to explain this?
Note also that those who rejected immersion in Jesus' Name,Baptism is a sign - an outward sign that one has already been born again and is a follower of Christ.Obedience is a "fruit" in the Matt 7 case - of a tree that has already been made "good".
Luke 7 indicates that Peter was likely baptized by John the baptizer.
29 When all the people and the tax collectors heard this, they acknowledged God’s justice, having been baptized with the baptism of John. 30 But the Pharisees and the lawyers rejected God’s purpose for themselves, not having been baptized by John.
Baptism is a sign - an outward sign that one has already been born again and is a follower of Christ.Obedience is a "fruit" in the Matt 7 case - of a tree that has already been made "good".
Luke 7 indicates that Peter was likely baptized by John the baptizer.
29 When all the people and the tax collectors heard this, they acknowledged God’s justice, having been baptized with the baptism of John. 30 But the Pharisees and the lawyers rejected God’s purpose for themselves, not having been baptized by John.
John did water baptism, Jesus taught spirit baptism.The Roman Catholic Church teaches that one must be baptized in order to be saved.
I believe that we should want to be baptized because we are saved and water baptism is not a part of being saved.
Now in thinking about this, I tried to find a Bible verse which tells us when Peter was baptized.
You see, the RCC claims Peter as their 1st Pope and the thought occurred to me that if we go with the RCC teaching that a man must be baptized in order to be saved and their 1st Pope has no record of baptism then according to their own teaching, Peter would not have been saved.
Now wouldn't that be a hoot????
Someone will try to use John 14 to say that that event was baptism. NO friends that will not work at all so please save us the argument over it. John 14 IS NOT baptism but is "Foot washing" and the context and exegesis is not about immersion for the cleansing of sin and salvation in any way.
Who is going to explain this?
Acts 8:34-40:John did water baptism, Jesus taught spirit baptism.
Jesus not only taught baptism, but he explicitly directed the Apostles to administer it to converts, and he went so far as to give us an example with his own baptism in the River Jordan.John did water baptism, Jesus taught spirit baptism.
(and in the NT, it is written somewhere, that those who WERE NOT IMMERSED, did NOT accept Jesus as Messiah)
No, but completely in harmony , yes.Are you referring to Mark 16:16?
16 He who has believed and has been baptized shall be saved; but he who has disbelieved shall be condemned.
No, but completely in harmony , yes.
Somewhere it is written specifically those who rejected Jesus were not immersed and that they 'thwarted'(in one translation or in comments) God's Plan for their lives.
there is not a record of any apostles conversion account.
John did water baptism, Jesus taught spirit baptism.
AND it should be pointed out that NONE of the Apostles/Disciples were even "Christians" in the "Born again of the Holy Spirit" sense, UNTIL AFTER the Crucifixion / SIN Offering, when it became POSSIBLE to be "born again". John 20:22 records the point at which the INDWELLING Holy Spirit was imparted to the Disciples/Apostles. Acts 2:4 records the coming of the Holy Spirit UPON the disciples who were already INDWELLED by the Holy Spirit.
AND it should be pointed out that NONE of the Apostles/Disciples were even "Christians" in the "Born again of the Holy Spirit" sense, UNTIL AFTER the Crucifixion / SIN Offering, when it became POSSIBLE to be "born again". John 20:22 records the point at which the INDWELLING Holy Spirit was imparted to the Disciples/Apostles. Acts 2:4 records the coming of the Holy Spirit UPON the disciples who were already INDWELLED by the Holy Spirit.
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