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srev2004 said:I joined a Christian website, because there was gross misunderstanding about Hinduism and I am on the receiving end of these stereotypes, and this one way seemed right for me to correct those beliefs. I have never tried to preach Jesus as false and Krishna as right, if anything we Hindu's are pluralistic and believe God is in everything including Jesus, and who knows maybe he was the Son of God. Evangelising is trying to convert, educating is teaching what is correct so people aren't ignorant. I won't complain if you teach me what Jesus preached, I would be more than happy to listen, but when you say your religion is right and mine wrong and I'm going to hell, that's when it's crossing the lines of tolerance.
Christianity doesn't teach us to treat non-christians with contempt, and disrespect, and I am very certain you couldn't demonstrate that it does using the bible. From my experience, most christian kids turn out caring indivudals.Just step out of your shoes for one second, and realize the effects of such agressive thinking, or if you teach kids such things. Would they treat everyone as equal or respect everyone equally? Wouldn't it promote segregation? And tell me personally, do you believe God would get jealous over what we think or do you think he would be just based on our time on Earth?
srev2004 said:The real questions is, does evangelism lead to racism and intolerance?
And the answer is yes.
Nahienga said:Do you think Hitler considered his work as evil?
elijah115 said:Evangelising to a christian is proclaiming the truth (what we believe to be the truth), and letting the Holy Spirit do the rest. We are not commanded thought to forcefully convert people. People must accept the gospel freely otherwise they won't grow.
Regarding Jesus as the way, the truth and the life and salvation through following christ. It is what christians believe. It is not intolerant to be a christian, and be honest about what we believe. Christianitu is a pluralist faith. To say we should believe in Heaven and Hell and Judgement Day is intolerant in itself.
Christianity doesn't teach us to treat non-christians with contempt, and disrespect, and I am very certain you couldn't demonstrate that it does using the bible. From my experience, most christian kids turn out caring indivudals.
On the subject of God eternal justice, Paul said this just a little under 2000 years ago. Roman 3:5-8.
RO 3:5 But if our unrighteousness brings out God's righteousness more clearly, what shall we say? That God is unjust in bringing his wrath on us? (I am using a human argument.) 6 Certainly not! If that were so, how could God judge the world? 7 Someone might argue, "If my falsehood enhances God's truthfulness and so increases his glory, why am I still condemned as a sinner?" 8 Why not say--as we are being slanderously reported as saying and as some claim that we say--"Let us do evil that good may result"? Their condemnation is deserved.
Notice the bit where He says I'm using a human argument sarcastically a little under 2000 years ago. It's quite funny stuff. Anyway, I think that God is just in judging us in light of everything we have done over the period of our life time. It think it is wrong for human beings to know they are doing something wrong, and then willingly decide they will continue doing so until they die; and then after that call God unjust for repaying their willful transgression.
We could go on about this subject, but I am not sure if you'll learn anything new.
elijah115 said:Who's Mr Morey?
srev2004 said:The followers of Santana Dharma were the victims of Kashmir actually, there are 500,000 Hindu pandit refugees who had to lock their homes and flee because they feared their daughters were going to get raped and son's killed.
Santana Dharma is to be rewarded for the existance of Kashmir, and Pakistan.
Do you see my reasoning, it is because of Hindu tolerance that Pakistan, Nepal, Sri Lanka, and Bangladesh exist. It is because of our secular beliefs that our Prime Minister is a Sikh, the President a Muslim, and the leader of the Congress Party a Christian leading a Hindu majority nation of 80%. We judge based on criteria, not religion.
As of today India is under siege from Azad Kashmir, the explosions were in one of the most holy cities on the eve of Holi in Varanasi. Is this not tolerance, we know they came from Pakistan, yet we didn't attack back. Likewise the USA, for 2,000 people took over two coutries and killed more than 300,000 people. That is the difference in tolerance and the amount of suffering a person can endure. Yet the people only concentrate only on economic development and poverty upliftment. The terrorists are getting so arrogant they are starting to attack universities and other economic tools of India. A IISc professor has been killed. And legally the whole of Kashmir was signed over to India by it's king, and it's India's duty to defend it's territory and it's citizens. But it let Pakistan have the land up and until the line of control for fear of losing the lives of it's citizens. It is a very humble and peaceful country.
Santana Dharma is what gave the world Pluralism, Yoga, and many scientific systems.
elijah115 said:It seems to me that the christian view of evangelising and your view are pretty different. I don't see how evangelism leads to racism and intolerance. If anything I think non-evangelism increases ignorance. You've come to a christian forum to preach "True Hinduism" so that we are not ignorant about what you believe. How does that lead to racism and intolerance? The answer, to me, is it doesn't.
elijah115 said:You didnt need to apologise for Kashmir. I don't think you got the "I am using your logic here" comment.
srev2004 said:I'm not apologizing, I'm correcting your ignorance on Kashmir.
Secondly my logic is different, I see it happening today under the church's blessing in India. The people holding kashmir are part of the Indian government not the temples.
Evangelising is what is holding India down, and people who preach religious intolerance. Pluralism is why India was so powerful and eventually invaded and taken advantage of in the past. India will just have to wait till everyone else adopts pluralism to be able to function by itself without getting attacked.
Elijah, do you tolerate Hinduism?
I tolerate Christianity.
That is where we differ. Please answer my simple questions above, and you can see where our tolerance is on two different levels. In Indian catholic schools, 95% of the kids are Hindu's, but the schools don't preach and are not allowed to but the students have the option of educating themselves about Christianity. That's how it should be, not NGO's driving around in vans with megaphones yelling your all going to hell across villages.
srev2004 said:say you are a scientifically oriented person, and deny the existance of God but help all of humanity with some medicine to cure a disease, lets say AIDS. Now would you go to hell?
I don't have any right to say who goes to hell.
And what determines truth, it is relative, you can't proclaim something as truth unless you can prove it, and to me you can't prove Christ as the only path to salvation. You can't prove to me that a hell exists.
To christians, truth is an absolute, and it is according to what God says. I don't care to prove to you that hell exists anymore than you care to prove to me that reincarnation exists. My guide as to truth is what God ordained and what Jesus taught in the gospels.
And you can't also proclaim that my belief of multiple instances of God exist is false. So what other way can you evangelise? By citing a Book? Well Hinduism has the Gita, but we don't go around evangelising and claiming we are the only true path.
Hindus proclaim pluralism based on what Krishna said in the Vedas. I preach non-pluralism based on what God said about Himself in the scriptures. So Yes, I can proclaim that your believe of God in everything is false. It is your choice (up to your heart) whether you believe that or not.
Your example doesn't correlate, because you are comparing evil and good. It is not evil to deny Jesus, but it is evil to kill someone. Your relative evil is different than mine. So you can't use that example to justify evangelising or label something as evil, because it is not a common sense belief.
What example? First, I don't think any christian would disgree with you saying it is evil to kill someone. Secondly, if it is not evil to deny Jesus Christ, who was the Word of God and in his nature God, and if this is true, then it is not evil to deny Krishna. I have blatantly made it clear I don't believe in relative evil.
So for my instance or example, lets say I don't believe or grasp the idea of only one instance of God, I believe that maybe Jesus came and spread his message, but I also believe that many other occurances have occured millenia after millenia to correct the path of spiritual growth. Would I go to hell?
Believing that Jesus existed is not what saves you from Hell. It is obeying the Word of God. By repenting of past sins, and learning to sin no more. Living each day in fellowship with God, and with reverence for human life. God will judge you according to what your deeds deserve. And what you really believe is what controls what your deeds become. Christian does just believe Christ spread his message. It's more difficult to get into Heaven than that. Narrow is the gate the leads to salvation.
And how can you say my belief is false without being intolerant?
Do I stop you from practising Hinduism, because I am a christian?
Secondly, the bible preaches to make friends amoung Christians so someone wouldn't get bad ideas or satanic ideas by hanging out with heathens and idolators..?
Christians can be friends with non-Christians, in the modern sociologically sense of the word "Friends", but aren't supposed to have fellowship with non-Christian. This comes back to the non-pluralism issue again. We believe in one God, and we follow the example He has set for us. It's nothing to me what other religions teach.
The reason for that is this is that the requirements for love and obeying God are quite clear, and obvious. By making the lessons of the Holy Spirit our sole source of knowledge we are compelled to be good according to the standard set by God, not the relative standard of the word. If we only fear God and are taught by God, what influences the world matters little to christians. That is how God works.
And explain why having an Icon for God is bad?
God is spirit. He therefore should be worshipped in spirit and truth, not through the use of created things.
Why does having something that represents the infinite reality of God bad?
If God is infinitely incomprehensible, with what created thing could you represent God?
We humans can't grasp or fathom God's reach and full understanding so we need something to correlate or connect with a God.
What you need is the Holy Spirit, not the icon. That is what the Spirit of God does. What is impossible with man is possible with God. Only God himself can provide a means for us to connect with him - not You or I, and certainly not an icon.
This is the Christian iconand this is the Hindu icon . Now why can't we just be tolerant and coexist and pray to our own beliefs so we end up in heaven or being one with God according to our beliefs and let God decide, instead of out which religion is true or false and being mad at each other, and ending up .
In christianity God decides who goes to Heaven, not christians. He has made his existence and justice known from the beginning so that no man can claim ignorance as a reason for sin. By calling sin sin, christians are not judging you but equipping you to know how to choose good. Man looks at the outside (the decorations) but God looks at the heart. And combined the motivation with the deeds - hence the doctrine of belief/trust and obedience. If you're lacking in any of the two, you're in trouble.
Skillganon said:Your bedoiun. Evangelic christian missionary, Bob Morey.
Author of book's such as:
1.Battle of the Gods: The Gathering Storm in Modern Evangelicalism.
2. Death and the Afterlife: The Biblical doctrine of the immortality of the soul and eternal conscious punishment.
3.The Encyclopedia of Practical Christianity.
4.How to Answer a Mormon.
5.The Islamic Invasion
6.Is The Sabbath for Today? .
Skillganon said:Ho! Ho! why do you take everything as a threat!
hey, we use the word in slang, not dictionary meaning.
Anyway I was only asking will you call someone who led thousands believeing in a lie, via deciet, lie's, misqouting, & still mantain's it without admitting he was wrong, a christian?
elijah115 said:You're not a very knowledgeable person.
elijah115 said:I don't care what Hitler thought; what he did was evil, period.
Skillganon said:Ho! Ho! why do you take everything as a threat!
hey, we use the word in slang, not dictionary meaning.
Anyway I was only asking will you call someone who led thousands believeing in a lie, via deciet, lie's, misqouting, & still mantain's it without admitting he was wrong, a christian?
I would call him mohammed .Anyway I was only asking will you call someone who led thousands believeing in a lie, via deciet, lie's, misqouting, & still mantain's it without admitting he was wrong
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