Unsubstantiated Claims...

[stan1980]

There are so many flying around at the moment and it's a constant frustration for me and I bet many of you, when someone makes a claim, presents it as fact and fails to produce a source, or produces a source that says nothing of the sort, but they continue to perpetuate their downright lies.

Could we just copy and paste (and link) all these unsubstantiated claims into one thread, where these people can be named and shamed? Maybe we could keep a tally chart too, so there is an easy to glance at league table hall of shame.

Good idea or unworkable?

 

[Andreusz]

I think that's an excellent idea. Perhaps this thread can be the archive of these claims?

We can start with HolyRoller's claim that most gays get married to make a political statement.

 

[QuakerOats]

Unworkable. I certainly understand your motivations; it's frustrating talking to people who appear to have blinders on, however, I don't think it would say much about you or I if we called them out so publicly, and it no doubt wouldn't earn us any respect from them, though I could be wrong. I just think the thread would likely turn into a match of personal attacks. Perhaps if you simply addressed the claims and left the names of the authors out of it? They know who they are anyhow, and that should be good enough.

 

[brinny]

There is so many flying around at the moment and it's a constant frustration for me and I bet many of you, when someone makes a claim, presents it as fact and fails to produce a source, or produces a source that says nothing of the sort, but they continue to perpetuate their downright lies.

Could we just copy and paste (and link) all these unsubstantiated claims into one thread, where these people can be named and shamed? Maybe we could keep a tally chart too, so there is an easy to glance at league table hall of shame.

Good idea or unworkable?

what unsubstantiated claims are you referring to stan?

 

[stan1980]

I think that's an excellent idea. Perhaps this thread can be the archive of these claims?

Sure

Perhaps if you simply addressed the claims and left the names of the authors out of it? They know who they are anyhow, and that should be good enough.

Could do. I was hoping the idea might reduce the false claims and lies that are pedalled constantly, by making it public.

what unsubstantiated claims are you referring to stan?

Well, they are everywhere! And most of them made by the same 3 or 4 posters (uh oh, is that an unsubstantiated claim?). Hehe, I'll try and copy paste a few of them in a bit.

 

[brinny]

Sure



Could do.



Well, they are everywhere! And most of them made by the same 3 or 4 posters (uh oh, is that an unsubstantiated claim?). Hehe, I'll try and copy paste a few of them in a bit.

thank you. i look forward to what you post.

 

[stan1980]

thank you. i look forward to what you post.

Here are 3, all made by the same poster in separate threads recently:

"No, but 98% of the Atheists that frequent this message board overwhelmingly make blanket associations about Christians"

"90% of the posters on this forum alone either practice or support adultry, polygamy, sex without committment and so fourth"

"Well most gay eople will marry just to make a political statement. It has nothing to do with love or a family or any other factor related to marriage."

 

[brinny]

stan, how might you suggest they be substantiated?

 

[Andreusz]

How about a rule that if the person provides substantiation for the claim, the original 'charge' will be edited to reflect this?

 

[stan1980]

stan, how might you suggest they be substantiated?

I would suggest not making claims that can't be substantiated.

How about a rule that if the person provides substantiation for the claim, the original 'charge' will be edited to reflect this?

Of course, no harm done if a source is eventually provided.

 

[cantata]

stan, how might you suggest they be substantiated?

I think, more to the point, if they can't be substantiated then they should only be uttered with a clear indication that they are opinion.

 

[stan1980]

I think, more to the point, if they can't be substantiated then they should only be uttered with a clear indication that they are opinion.

indeed

 

[brinny]

ok, how would you establish fact, take a poll?

 

[stan1980]

ok, how would you establish fact, take a poll?

It's a good question. If someone's claim is clearly stated as opinion, as cantata pointed out, then there is no problem. Clearly, there will be other problems, which is why it did occur to me that maintaining a 'hall of shame' tally chart might be unworkable, as for example, someone could claim "2 million Jews were killed in the holocaust". I wouldn't consider that to be an outlandish claim, even though different sources might not agree on the number, which is why we need to sensible about it, so to solve this problem I hereby elect myself as judge and jury on what goes and what doesn't

Edit: Actually, it's probably best if I'm not judge and jury.

 

[brinny]

It's a good question. If someone's claim is clearly stated as opinion, as cantata pointed out, then there is no problem. Clearly, there will be other problems, which is why it did occur to me that maintaining a 'hall of shame' tally chart might be unworkable, as for example, someone could claim "2 million Jews were killed in the holocaust". I wouldn't consider that to be an outlandish claim, even though different sources might not agree on the number, which is why we need to sensible about it, so to solve this problem I hereby elect myself as judge and jury on what goes and what doesn't

Edit: Actually, it's probably best if I'm not judge and jury.

of what, the hall of shame?

 

[cantata]

ok, how would you establish fact, take a poll?

Honestly? I just wouldn't go there in the first place.

The statistics were clearly just pulled out of the poster's backside. If they'd said, "It seems to me that most..." (or even "I would say that about 90% of..."), it would have been a whole lot less mendacious than "98% of...". Made-up statistics (without a clear indication that they are made up) are dishonest.

 

[BlackSabb]

There are so many flying around at the moment and it's a constant frustration for me and I bet many of you, when someone makes a claim, presents it as fact and fails to produce a source, or produces a source that says nothing of the sort, but they continue to perpetuate their downright lies.

Could we just copy and paste (and link) all these unsubstantiated claims into one thread, where these people can be named and shamed? Maybe we could keep a tally chart too, so there is an easy to glance at league table hall of shame.

Good idea or unworkable?

Hey, that sounds fun. Any chance of me getting into the hall of shame? I'd be all for it. Name me and shame me I say.

More naming, less flaming, go the shaming is my motto.

 

[brinny]

hmmm....sounds like what i was thinkin'...yeah, put me in there while you're at it stan...i'm sure i'd make some good fodder....

 

[jcook922]

Next thing you know we'll be pinning stars to their chests. Idiots or not, they have their right to a voice, besides, they are entertainment.

 

[tapero]

MOD HAT

Thread Closed
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