Universal flood evidence

Daniel Marsh · Feb 28, 2022

OldWiseGuy said:
Why would oxygen levels and temperature drop? The ark was always at sea level throughout the event.

True sea level would change. I overlooked that. I am often tired. So, using common sense lets look at what that means. Air pressure will rapidly change too high or too low which would have some effect on breathing. YEC model has rapid movement of plates resulting in rapid increase of volcanoes which would rapidly bring the heat very hot water would be hot enough to cook all life near it to death. The Capony thing would turn the earth into a pressure cooker more living cooked to death. With the change of sea level there will be no trees or plants exchaging carbon dioxide for Oxygen. The carbon dioxide would increase to levels where animals and humans would not be able to breathe. Add to that increase of other toxic substances in the air.... death again??? Also, 12 tons per day of animal waste will kill those on the Ark, boat. With the 40 days of rain, there would be a backlog of 480 tons of animal waste.

In short, you have me on the temperature thing. But, the air quality and rapid temperature increase will kill all life.

Daniel Marsh · Feb 28, 2022

OldWiseGuy said:
The ark would have been 'fitted out' (a shipbuilding term) with a ventilation system to keep the air fresh. The animals, most of which were very small, would not produce methane rich manure, or very much manure at all, as they would be on maintenance rations *, not production rations. Some would go into hibernation and produce no waste at all. It is also likely that the animals would have been fattened up before boarding the ark. Most animals will overeat if given the opportunity. An animal living on stored fat produces very little manure.

Animals to be slaughtered are taken off feed for a day or two first to reduce the amount of manure that remains in their system. It is within reason that Noah would have done this as well, at least for the larger animals.

Most manures would simply dry up, which could then be burned (the ventilation system would be driven by furnaces whose draft would draw fresh air into the ark**) or left to simply decompose (compost) in the bedding.

The narrative suggests that the requirements of the animals were within the ability of Noah and his family to meet.

* Any deer hunter can attest to this as deer poop on winter maintenance rations of woody browse is dry, light, and odorless compared to their warm weather 'production' rations poop that is wet, heavy, and smelly. Of the dozens of different critters that scurry about in the forest very few leave easily detectable droppings.

** It was gratifying to see the large furnace within the ark in the movie "Noah", starring Russell Crowe. It would have been necessary for heat, draft, and sanitation, as well as cooking.

The YEC model has the animals creating waste at 12 tons a day. The only venuation I see in Genesis is at the top. No vents. The furnace was made up to burn off the methane in the movies. Based on the number of animals YEC put in their model, it is not managble. See, the numebers I already posted.

"The narrative suggests that the requirements of the animals were within the ability of Noah and his family to meet."

That is a better argument for a local flood because a worldwide flood requries a lot more animals.

The range of estimates for the number of animals ranges from 1,500 to 3,858,920.
I already showed that the 15,000 animals would not work. Removing the backlog of 480 tons and the new 12 tons a day could not be done.

how many animals of each species were on the ark - Lisbdnet.com.
How Many Animals Were On Noah’s Ark?

1,518,000 cu.ft. is the YEC estimate volume of the ark. http://www.[bless and do not curse]...bless and do not curse]/basicart/sizeark.html

My wife is kicking me off. God bless all and good night, don't let the bed bugs byte.

Likly the wood of the ark afterwords was used to burn and build shelter.

OldWiseGuy · Mar 1, 2022

Daniel Marsh said:
Brother, Friend -- Rainfall 40 days and 40 nights that YEC claims covered the highest mountain by 15 cubics and Volcanic Action, pluse enough heat from the plates moving rapidly which would boil everyone and every living creature on the Ark to death is not "claim water" in any strech of the immagination.

That didn't happen.

OldWiseGuy · Mar 1, 2022

OldWiseGuy · Mar 1, 2022

Daniel Marsh said:
Genesis 6:13-16
Good News Translation
13 God said to Noah, “I have decided to put an end to all people. I will destroy them completely, because the world is full of their violent deeds. 14 Build a boat for yourself out of good timber; make rooms in it and cover it with tar inside and out. 15 Make it 450 feet long, 75 feet wide, and 45 feet high. 16 Make a roof[a] for the boat and leave a space of 18 inches between the roof and the sides. Build it with three decks and put a door in the side.

Genesis 6:13-16
King James Version
13 And God said unto Noah, The end of all flesh is come before me; for the earth is filled with violence through them; and, behold, I will destroy them with the earth.

14 Make thee an ark of gopher wood; rooms shalt thou make in the ark, and shalt pitch it within and without with pitch.

15 And this is the fashion which thou shalt make it of: The length of the ark shall be three hundred cubits, the breadth of it fifty cubits, and the height of it thirty cubits.

16 A window shalt thou make to the ark, and in a cubit shalt thou finish it above; and the door of the ark shalt thou set in the side thereof; with lower, second, and third stories shalt thou make it.

Genesis 6:13-16
Easy-to-Read Version
13 So God said to Noah, “Everyone has filled the earth with anger and violence. So I will destroy all living things. I will remove them from the earth. 14 Use cypress wood[a] and build a boat for yourself. Make rooms in the boat and cover it with tar inside and out.

15 “This is the size I want you to make the boat: 300 cubits long, 50 cubits[c] wide, and 30 cubits[d] high. 16 Make a window for the boat about 1 cubit[e] below the roof.[f] Put a door in the side of the boat. Make three floors in the boat: a top deck, a middle deck, and a lower deck.

Definition of ark

(Entry 1 of 2) 1a : a boat or ship held to resemble that in which Noah and his family were preserved from the Flood. b : something that affords protection and safety. 2a : the sacred chest representing to the Hebrews the presence of God among them.
Definition of ARK

By definition a ship must have a means of propulsion, and be able to navigate. The ark had neither. It was certainly a vessel of transport but it was not a ship, according to nautical terms. Interesting as well is the fact that no nautical terms were used in regard to the ark. Stories, rooms, doors, windows, etc. are not terms used in ship building. These are terms used in the construction of stationary buildings.

Biblical (Hebrew) definition of ark,

Outline of Biblical Usage Abbreviations
† תֵּבָה noun feminine ark (properly chest, box (compare Late Hebrew תֵּבָה); probably Egyptian loan-word from T-b-t, chest, coffin (Brugsch, ErmanZMG xlvi (1892), 123); > Babylonian word JenZA iv (1889), 272 f. HalJAssyr., 1888 {Nov.-Dec.}, 517); — absolute ת׳ Genesis 7:1 +; construct תֵּבַת Genesis 6:14; Exodus 2:3; — vessel in which infant Moses was laid among reeds Exodus 2:3 (made of papyrus, גֹּמֶא), Exodus 2:5 (both E;

θῖβις, θήβη, compare LewyFremdw. 100); vessel which saved Noah and his family, with animals, during flood (

OldWiseGuy · Mar 1, 2022

Daniel Marsh said:
No I am not a latter day saint aka mormon. See how many bad or funny ideas you see in the chapter I posted.

OldWiseGuy · Mar 1, 2022

Daniel Marsh said:
The YEC model has the animals creating waste at 12 tons a day. The only venuation I see in Genesis is at the top. No vents. The furnace was made up to burn off the methane in the movies. Based on the number of animals YEC put in their model, it is not managble. See, the numebers I already posted.

"The narrative suggests that the requirements of the animals were within the ability of Noah and his family to meet."

That is a better argument for a local flood because a worldwide flood requries a lot more animals.

The range of estimates for the number of animals ranges from 1,500 to 3,858,920.
I already showed that the 15,000 animals would not work. Removing the backlog of 480 tons and the new 12 tons a day could not be done.

how many animals of each species were on the ark - Lisbdnet.com.
How Many Animals Were On Noah’s Ark?

1,518,000 cu.ft. is the YEC estimate volume of the ark. http://www.[bless and do not curse]...bless and do not curse]/basicart/sizeark.html

My wife is kicking me off. God bless all and good night, don't let the bed bugs byte.

Likly the wood of the ark afterwords was used to burn and build shelter.

I must apologize. I just realized that the debate/argument is between science and YEC's. I have my own ideas that don't fit within this argument as the flood I discovered is a completely different flood than the one commonly debated.

OldWiseGuy · Mar 1, 2022

Daniel Marsh said:
The YEC model has the animals creating waste at 12 tons a day. The only venuation I see in Genesis is at the top. No vents. The furnace was made up to burn off the methane in the movies. Based on the number of animals YEC put in their model, it is not managble. See, the numebers I already posted.

"The narrative suggests that the requirements of the animals were within the ability of Noah and his family to meet."

That is a better argument for a local flood because a worldwide flood requries a lot more animals.

The range of estimates for the number of animals ranges from 1,500 to 3,858,920.
I already showed that the 15,000 animals would not work. Removing the backlog of 480 tons and the new 12 tons a day could not be done.

how many animals of each species were on the ark - Lisbdnet.com.
How Many Animals Were On Noah’s Ark?

1,518,000 cu.ft. is the YEC estimate volume of the ark. http://www.[bless and do not curse]...bless and do not curse]/basicart/sizeark.html

My wife is kicking me off. God bless all and good night, don't let the bed bugs byte.

Likly the wood of the ark afterwords was used to burn and build shelter.

The instructions for the ark don't include stairways between floors either. Do you think there were no stairways? And if there were stairways what other features were not included in the narrative that would be perfectly reasonable given the story as a whole?

Daniel Marsh · Mar 1, 2022

OldWiseGuy said:
That didn't happen.

That fact proves the YEC Model is not true and that the flood was not universal, but was Local.

Daniel Marsh · Mar 1, 2022

OldWiseGuy said:
By definition a ship must have a means of propulsion, and be able to navigate. The ark had neither. It was certainly a vessel of transport but it was not a ship, according to nautical terms. Interesting as well is the fact that no nautical terms were used in regard to the ark. Stories, rooms, doors, windows, etc. are not terms used in ship building. These are terms used in the construction of stationary buildings.

Biblical (Hebrew) definition of ark,

Outline of Biblical Usage Abbreviations
† תֵּבָה noun feminine ark (properly chest, box (compare Late Hebrew תֵּבָה); probably Egyptian loan-word from T-b-t, chest, coffin (Brugsch, ErmanZMG xlvi (1892), 123); > Babylonian word JenZA iv (1889), 272 f. HalJAssyr., 1888 {Nov.-Dec.}, 517); — absolute ת׳ Genesis 7:1 +; construct תֵּבַת Genesis 6:14; Exodus 2:3; — vessel in which infant Moses was laid among reeds Exodus 2:3 (made of papyrus, גֹּמֶא), Exodus 2:5 (both E;

θῖβις, θήβη, compare LewyFremdw. 100); vessel which saved Noah and his family, with animals, during flood (

nautical terms did not come into existence until the 1600s and from your quote we see those did not exit until about the 1880s. I am sure some of those terms likely existed by the time of the Paul ---- likely some were used during Paul's ship wreck.
Two are found in the book of James Nautical Terms 2 | What does the Bible say about it?
40 Bible verses about Sailing
Ships And Boats Definition and Meaning - Bible Dictionary
a study of the bible's nautical terminology in... (PDF)
** best link *** Acts 27

Thanks for bringing up an interresting study Brother, friend.

Daniel Marsh · Mar 1, 2022

OldWiseGuy said:

I posted Ether 2 from the book of mormon for the humor of it. It acted more like a submarine with a hole in the top and bottom. It was the length of a tree, tight like a dish, and the god of the bom used occultic means to light the boats. Scroll back to find the post it is very entertaining reading. Also, 3 Nephi 28 is fun to read too.

Daniel Marsh · Mar 1, 2022

OldWiseGuy said:
I must apologize. I just realized that the debate/argument is between science and YEC's. I have my own ideas that don't fit within this argument as the flood I discovered is a completely different flood than the one commonly debated.

It is all good Brother, since I know I can be wrong sometimes, espically doing the math in my head learning how and what others thinks can only work to improve me. My Father taught me to observe other people to learn from their mistakes. I was taught never to do drugs or get drunk. When I was in the USAF, I observed those doing both and they were often entertaining in the stupid mistakes they did. One time, I had to drag a guy off the roof of a thousand man dorm building because he convinced himself while high that he would walk on air. After, I handcuffed him in the main lobby, I called the SPs and told them what had happened. He was restrained at the Hospital and treated for drug abuse. At a later date he came to Christ. Feel free to explain your ideas, viewponit. Daniel

Daniel Marsh · Mar 1, 2022

OldWiseGuy said:
The instructions for the ark don't include stairways between floors either. Do you think there were no stairways? And if there were stairways what other features were not included in the narrative that would be perfectly reasonable given the story as a whole?

Ramps with carts would make more sense to haul the animal waste on deck to throw overboard.

Daniel Marsh · Mar 1, 2022

OldWiseGuy said:
The instructions for the ark don't include stairways between floors either. Do you think there were no stairways? And if there were stairways what other features were not included in the narrative that would be perfectly reasonable given the story as a whole?

"Stairs that were constructed many thousands of years ago still exist today in structures around the world. Ancient settlements that have been excavated, such as Mohenjo Daro in Pakistan, have stairs featured as part of the structure, and it is believed that they were built around 2500 BCE. That means that there is physical evidence of the architectural element of stairs dating back to at least 4000 years ago." Who Invented the Staircase?.

"The spiral shape was ideal to save space, and although the oldest example dates back to the 5th century BC, it was only in the wake of the influential design of the Trajan’s Column that this type of stair shape became a trend in Roman architecture. "
The History of Stairs: From Fascinating Architecture to Access Barriers | Stannah

"The ancient Greeks constructed a paved ramp known as the Diolkos to drag ships across the Isthmus of Corinth."
The History of the Wheelchair Ramps - MedPlus

That is all I could find, my wife will kick me off computer soon.

Daniel Marsh · Mar 1, 2022

read to here good night all

Wyatt A. · Apr 27, 2022

sweetycakes1 said:
Genesis is one of my favorite Bible books.

If people can discredit Genisis then they can discredit the entire Bible. We have a historical record written by God Himself. I'll believe God over any man who thinks he can account for the past by interpreting data in the present. If you want to know about the past you need a history book not a science book. Science books change from day to day, the Bible never changes and it has upheld everything that it has claimed until this day.

Universal flood evidence

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