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  • CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.

Unforgiveness is unforgivable...

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RDKirk

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I would say that Jesus was presenting a teaching moment to His disciples--that salvation was for all by faith rather than by inheritance. Yes, he was posing an agreement with the sentiment expressed by the disciples, setting them up for a lesson that the truth was other than they supposed.

This wasn't the only time He did that. He did that as well with the story of Lazarus and the rich man. In that, Jesus sets up a situation in which His listeners would surely conclude that the rich man--obviously blessed for his righteousness, and the poor man obviously cursed for his unrighteousness--and then reversed their expectations with the truth that actually the rich man was cursed and the poor man blessed.
 
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Guojing

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It is indeed interesting for me to learn how people can come to the conclusion that Jesus did not really meant what he said in Matthew 15:24.

But let me get it straight, despite other verses implying the same meaning as Matthew 15:24, such as Matthew 10:5-6, John 4:22, Romans 15:8, Ephesians 2:11-12 and so on and so forth, you are willing to believe that Jesus was "joking" (posing an agreement with the sentiment expressed by the disciples), when he stated Matthew 15:24, so that he can present "a teaching moment to His disciples--that salvation was for all by faith rather than by inheritance"?
 
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RDKirk

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Your characterization of "joking" is merely your own idea of a clever rhetorical trick.
 
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Guojing

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RDKirk said:
Your characterization of "joking" is merely your own idea of a clever rhetorical trick.
Click to expand...

Okay, if you are offended by that term, what if I use your own words "posing an agreement with the sentiment expressed by the disciples"?

Would those other verses affect your understanding of what Jesus really meant when he stated Matthew 15:24? Why not?
 
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RDKirk

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Guojing said:
Okay, if you are offended by that term, what if I use your own words "posing an agreement with the sentiment expressed by the disciples"?
Click to expand...

I would say that Jesus was presenting a teaching moment to His disciples--that salvation was for all by faith rather than by inheritance. Yes, he was posing an agreement with the sentiment expressed by the disciples, setting them up for a lesson that the truth was other than they supposed.

This wasn't the only time He did that. He did that as well with the story of Lazarus and the rich man. In that, Jesus sets up a situation in which His listeners would surely conclude that the rich man--obviously blessed for his righteousness, and the poor man obviously cursed for his unrighteousness--and then reversed their expectations with the truth that actually the rich man was cursed and the poor man blessed.
 
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Guojing

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What about other verses implying the same literal meaning as Matthew 15:24, such as Matthew 10:5-6, John 4:22, Romans 15:8, Ephesians 2:11-12 and so on and so forth?
 
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Carl Emerson

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The word hate in this context is prioritise.

The Spirit does not bear witness to wrong understanding.
 
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