Two eucharistic miracles 1,300 years apart show same blood type and DNA.

[Gnarwhal]

Thought this was fascinating.

After scientific investigation, a eucharistic miracle in Poland was recently confirmed as authentic by the local bishop of the area. Initially, the Host had fallen on the ground, so it was placed in water, as is customarily done in such cases. Not long afterward, the Eucharist began turning red, as if bloody.

Tests subsequently done on the subject indicated it came from human tissue "most similar to the heart muscle ... as it appears under the strains of agony."
...
After that, the results of the tests were compared to samples from another eucharistic miracle that took place in Lanciano, Italy roughly 1,300 years ago. The Body and Blood from that miracle are still preserved at a church in the town. In 1970, they were examined scientifically and, like the Buenos Aires sample, found to be from a human heart with AB-positive blood.

http://www.churchmilitant.com/news/...iracles-confirm-real-presence-of-jesus-christ

 

[Tina W]

Wow! That is amazing!

 

[WarriorAngel]

 

[Cosmic Charlie]

Oh, c'mon guys:

I can find no evidence that Dr. Ricardo Castañó ever gave anything to the San Francisco Forensic Institute and even if he did there is no chain of evidence to show it was what he claims it was. If San Francisco Forensic Institute ever tested anything from this miracle they don't seem to have published anything about it.

Dr. Frederick Zugibe had an axe to grind and appears to have had a courtesy appointment as a adjunct to Columbia but spend most of his career as Rockland County, NY medical examiner.

And the whole AB- thing just reeks of urban legend. (The most rare, most cool blood of all !!)

O- (universal donor) or O+ (most common blood type and RF factor) would be more believable as the likely blood of Christ.

Seriously, miracles are miracles. Like everything else related to spirituality they can't be proven objectively. And that's part of the wonder of them.

Can stop spreading this unproven pseudo-sciencetic junk ? It's makes us look like idiots.

 

[WarriorAngel]

Oh, c'mon guys:

I can find no evidence that Dr. Ricardo Castañó ever gave anything to the San Francisco Forensic Institute and even if he did there is no chain of evidence to show it was what he claims it was. If San Francisco Forensic Institute ever tested anything from this miracle they don't seem to have published anything about it.

Dr. Frederick Zugibe had an axe to grind and appears to have had a courtesy appointment as a adjunct to Columbia but spend most of his career as Rockland County, NY medical examiner.

And the whole AB- thing just reeks of urban legend. (The most rare, most cool blood of all !!)

O- (universal donor) or O+ (most common blood type and RF factor) would be more believable as the likely blood of Christ.

Seriously, miracles are miracles. Like everything else related to spirituality they can't be proven objectively. And that's part of the wonder of them.

Can stop spreading this unproven pseudo-sciencetic junk ? It's makes us look like idiots.

The shroud of turin shows the blood was AB.
I dont know if negative or positive. I always thought positive.

As a universal receiver - He received our sins...universally.
He took upon Himself - all of us.

So it can also be symbolic of receiving us - and taking upon Himself all of our sins through His blood.

 

[WarriorAngel]

https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q=Doctor+Castañón+took+it+to+the+San+Francisco+Forensic+Institute

i pulled up his name and found several things about the miracle - even an atheist argument against it. [naturally]

 

[WarriorAngel]

http://christianity.stackexchange.c...documents-of-buenos-aires-eucharistic-miracle

a discussion on whether or not it is authentic.

As from what i understand - the Pope will decide.
As he was Bishop of Buenas Aires.

If it was real - it will become known.
A lot of Catholics argue it's authenticity.
So we wait and wonder.

 

[Cosmic Charlie]

https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q=Doctor+Castañón+took+it+to+the+San+Francisco+Forensic+Institute

i pulled up his name and found several things about the miracle - even an atheist argument against it. [naturally]

Yes, I understand there are several articles claiming Dr Castanon SFFI, all of which are virtually identically worded all of which are no websites with religious overtones.

There isn't one article from SFFI stating that they actually did this work or publishing their findings.

 

[WarriorAngel]

Yes, I understand there are several articles claiming Dr Castanon SFFI, all of which are virtually identically worded all of which are no websites with religious overtones.

There isn't one article from SFFI stating that they actually did this work or publishing their findings.

Yes, I know.
Two things could be true:
1: Done in 1996, it may well be stored on a disc of some sort and never released online.
2: It may not have occurred.

However; the only way to 'know' would be to go to the Church itself where it is stored to see.
That is the only answer among the debates.

 

[paul becke]

Oh, c'mon guys:

I can find no evidence that Dr. Ricardo Castañó ever gave anything to the San Francisco Forensic Institute and even if he did there is no chain of evidence to show it was what he claims it was. If San Francisco Forensic Institute ever tested anything from this miracle they don't seem to have published anything about it.

Dr. Frederick Zugibe had an axe to grind and appears to have had a courtesy appointment as a adjunct to Columbia but spend most of his career as Rockland County, NY medical examiner.

And the whole AB- thing just reeks of urban legend. (The most rare, most cool blood of all !!)

O- (universal donor) or O+ (most common blood type and RF factor) would be more believable as the likely blood of Christ.

Seriously, miracles are miracles. Like everything else related to spirituality they can't be proven objectively. And that's part of the wonder of them.

Can stop spreading this unproven pseudo-sciencetic junk ? It's makes us look like idiots.

It's you that's looking like an idiot, and that by your own words. Scientism should have died a natural death with the discovery of the quantum world. Are you seriously suggesting that these people are fraudsters and their dupes ? Wake up to yourself.

"I can find no evidence that Dr. Ricardo Castañó ever gave anything to the San Francisco Forensic Institute and even if he did there is no chain of evidence to show it was what he claims it was. If San Francisco Forensic Institute ever tested anything from this miracle they don't seem to have published anything about it."

Why should they bend over backward to impress someone who has been taken in by the necessary pedantry of journeyman science, compounded by the long-prevailing secular-fundamentalist paradigm, which has an 'a priori' aversion to physical science, if it's not mechanistic and reductionist ? If we had had to rely on the pillars of the scientific establishment to discover quantum mechanics, we would still be waiting and, indeed, would wait forever. Too many mysteries - what honest people call paradoxes.

Atheist science - scientism - is so smitten by its own narcissism, it avoids acceptance of paradoxes whenever it can by calling them, 'counter-intuitive', instead of 'counter-rational', repugnant to reason, 'oxymorons' that happen to be true. If you want to be jerked around by those nits, read from their play-book, follow their agenda, feel free, but don't claim it's us who are the gullible simpletons. It seems God has left 'wriggle-room' for even his own more credulous children to be taken in by the absurd hyperscepticism of the Enlightenment's Finest.

The fact is that the Catholic authorities know better than to court the belief of the secular- fundamentalist scientists, jumping through hoops to notify them of all their findings. The French writer, Emil Zola, said that he'd have to witness a miracle, before he'd believe in Lourdes. He did, but he still didn't. And I don't believe he was the only one to do that, though I can't remember any details of the other secular 'fundie' who had deluded himself that he was a disinterested seeker after the truth.

Read this :

http://www.faithandfamily.org.uk/publications/jack_traynor.htm

and more on the miraculous Host :

http://www.ncregister.com/daily-news/polish-bishop-hopes-amazing-sign-of-red-host-will-increase-eucharistic-devo/

 

[Cosmic Charlie]

It's you that's looking like an idiot, and that by your own words. Scientism should have died a natural death with the discovery of the quantum world. Are you seriously suggesting that these people are fraudsters and their dupes ? Wake up to yourself.

"I can find no evidence that Dr. Ricardo Castañó ever gave anything to the San Francisco Forensic Institute and even if he did there is no chain of evidence to show it was what he claims it was. If San Francisco Forensic Institute ever tested anything from this miracle they don't seem to have published anything about it."

Why should they bend over backward to impress someone who has been taken in by the necessary pedantry of journeyman science, compounded by the long-prevailing secular-fundamentalist paradigm, which has an 'a priori' aversion to physical science, if it's not mechanistic and reductionist ? If we had had to rely on the pillars of the scientific establishment to discover quantum mechanics, we would still be waiting and, indeed, would wait forever. Too many mysteries - what honest people call paradoxes.

Atheist science - scientism - is so smitten by its own narcissism, it avoids acceptance of paradoxes whenever it can by calling them, 'counter-intuitive', instead of 'counter-rational', repugnant to reason, 'oxymorons' that happen to be true. If you want to be jerked around by those nits, read from their play-book, follow their agenda, feel free, but don't claim it's us who are the gullible simpletons. It seems God has left 'wriggle-room' for even his own more credulous children to be taken in by the absurd hyperscepticism of the Enlightenment's Finest.

The fact is that the Catholic authorities know better than to court the belief of the secular- fundamentalist scientists, jumping through hoops to notify them of all their findings. The French writer, Emil Zola, said that he'd have to witness a miracle, before he'd believe in Lourdes. He did, but he still didn't. And I don't believe he was the only one to do that, though I can't remember any details of the other secular 'fundie' who had deluded himself that he was a disinterested seeker after the truth.

Read this :

http://www.faithandfamily.org.uk/publications/jack_traynor.htm

and more on the miraculous Host :

http://www.ncregister.com/daily-news/polish-bishop-hopes-amazing-sign-of-red-host-will-increase-eucharistic-devo/

Well, as I oft time say on this forum:

On OBOB science isn't and facts are negotiable.

 

[paul becke]

Whether the plural of anecdote is data or not (only scientism's finest deny it), God's relationship with us is not via tabulated data, but is as anecdotal as can be. The deepest truths are often expressed by Jesus in parables and challenging metaphors, because God, we, ourselves, and our mutual relationships are as profound as it can get.

Imagine Jesus say : 'He who eats my flesh and drinks my blood..' It was a message only for the eventual understanding of those who didn't think they knew it all, but were sufficiently humble to have been impressed enough by the teachings they had already heard from him, to put their questions re eating his flesh and drinking his blood 'on the back-burner'.

We should be grateful that it isn't our intellects that will get us into heaven, but our hearts, the seat of spiritual wisdom, what Aldous Huxley seemingly most appositely called the unitive intelligence. This, he taught, is modified from the base, worldly, analytical intelligence, by the adoption of a chaste, reasonably ascetical life and obedience to such age-old spiritual precepts as they might entail for the individual.

He did specify, however, the primacy of mortification of the will. Surely, a very important point. Not necessarily in terms of epic endeavours, but in the small things God requires of us and small things we decide to take on, ourselves, in our daily lives. Of course, small things can have large implications, too. if they lead us in a direction the world disdains.

 

[MoonlessNight]

And the whole AB- thing just reeks of urban legend. (The most rare, most cool blood of all !!)

O- (universal donor) or O+ (most common blood type and RF factor) would be more believable as the likely blood of Christ.

Whatever blood type Jesus had, that was the blood type that He had. There was only one Jesus, so the sample size of his blood was 1.

You can make an argument that if he had to guess a blood type, and we knew nothing of His blood type other than it was a human blood type, we would find the more common blood types to be more likely. But this is a very poor form of estimate which would be overturned by any additional information whatsoever that we found about the blood type. And the claim here in this thread is that we have found multiple pieces of evidence pointing in the same direction, which makes discussions about the overall commonality of blood types irrelevant.

I doubt that there's anyone who has gotten away with murder because his defense attorney argued that the killer's blood type at the scene was AB, and that's too rare a blood type for it to have been his client (but please don't actually check his blood type).

You can certainly criticize the authenticity of the evidence, and you have done some of that (I don't know enough about the case to comment on that part). But to say that it is impossible for it to be Jesus's blood because AB blood is too rare is asinine.

 

[Alonso_Castillo]

Oh, c'mon guys:

I can find no evidence that Dr. Ricardo Castañó ever gave anything to the San Francisco Forensic Institute and even if he did there is no chain of evidence to show it was what he claims it was. If San Francisco Forensic Institute ever tested anything from this miracle they don't seem to have published anything about it.

Dr. Frederick Zugibe had an axe to grind and appears to have had a courtesy appointment as a adjunct to Columbia but spend most of his career as Rockland County, NY medical examiner.

And the whole AB- thing just reeks of urban legend. (The most rare, most cool blood of all !!)

O- (universal donor) or O+ (most common blood type and RF factor) would be more believable as the likely blood of Christ.

Seriously, miracles are miracles. Like everything else related to spirituality they can't be proven objectively. And that's part of the wonder of them.

Can stop spreading this unproven pseudo-sciencetic junk ? It's makes us look like idiots.

Well, perhaps it is easier to believe in the virginal Birth of Christ or in his Resurrection.

Look I understand that what it is your point. We should try not to elaborate miracles out of science, to prove our point, I agree. But it is also true that We believe in miracles.

 

[concretecamper]

Oh, c'mon guys:

I can find no evidence that Dr. Ricardo Castañó ever gave anything to the San Francisco Forensic Institute and even if he did there is no chain of evidence to show it was what he claims it was. If San Francisco Forensic Institute ever tested anything from this miracle they don't seem to have published anything about it.

Dr. Frederick Zugibe had an axe to grind and appears to have had a courtesy appointment as a adjunct to Columbia but spend most of his career as Rockland County, NY medical examiner.

And the whole AB- thing just reeks of urban legend. (The most rare, most cool blood of all !!)

O- (universal donor) or O+ (most common blood type and RF factor) would be more believable as the likely blood of Christ.

Seriously, miracles are miracles. Like everything else related to spirituality they can't be proven objectively. And that's part of the wonder of them.

Can stop spreading this unproven pseudo-sciencetic junk ? It's makes us look like idiots.

And after eight days again his disciples were within, and Thomas with them. Jesus cometh, the doors being shut, and stood in the midst, and said: Peace be to you. Then he saith to Thomas: Put in thy finger hither, and see my hands; and bring hither thy hand, and put it into my side; and be not faithless, but believing. Thomas answered, and said to him: My Lord, and my God. Jesus saith to him: Because thou hast seen me, Thomas, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and have believed.