Trump claims the USA has a $300 billion trade deficit with EU. WRONG! He is weakening the western world!

[eclipsenow]

Trade is good. It lets me produce the thing I can produce the cheapest, and you do the same, and we swap so we all get richer. Cheaper stuff means we all win. I guess I’m a ‘globalist’ in terms of supply lines!

But Trump doesn't seem to have read a book in his adult life.
Even his marks way back in his so called 'Economics Degree' are kept secret!
Gee - I wonder why?

The real geopolitical threat is China making a move on Taiwan.
They want it for historical reasons.
They want it to compensate for their 'century of shame' and regain face.
And they want it for TMSC - for computer chips.

Faced with this threat, what does Trump do about China? Put high tariffs on them only - to encourage more secure long term trade with democratic allies?
Don't be silly!
This is TRUMP we are talking about!
He has a myopic view of the world.
Everything is 'unfair' to him.
Forget the economic and geopolitical strategies of friend-shoring.
Trump cannot even quote the correct balance of trade with the EU!
He just quotes goods.
But when you include services, the EU actually runs a trade deficit with the USA!
The reality on the ground is exactly the opposite to the mess Trump carries around in his 'mind'.

Trump has a new goal.
Reduce trade with friends.
Raise prices at home.
Weaken the west as fast as he can!

Yay!
(It's time to build a fallout shelter.)

 

[ozso]

Yay!
(It's time to build a fallout shelter.)
View attachment 361187

Considering how many rumors and so much doomsday predicting and panic there was over Trump starting WW3 during his first administration, they should already be fully assembled.

 

[A2SG]

Considering how many rumors and so much doomsday predicting and panic there was over Trump starting WW3 during his first administration, they should already be fully assembled.

True, there were many concerns about Trump's instability in office during his last term...but things are different now. For one thing, he has SCOTUS guaranteed immunity from prosecution for any "official acts," so he doesn't have to fear legal reprisals this time around. Also, he's (currently) ineligible for reelection, so politically, he has nothing to lose. Further, while there were some possible indications that Trump has cognitive issues before, none of those have exactly gone away. In fact, with age, they could possibly be worse. Who knows?

Also, he's got a handy scapegoat in Elon Musk. Not only can Musk take the heat for any illegal acts that Trump cannot be prosecuted for, unlike past advisers, Musk can afford all the legal representation money can buy.

Plus, let's not forget...when he gets out of office, there is still the possibility that the previous indictments that were dropped could be reinstated, and those would not fall under the umbrella of presidential immunity. And he won't have the same get out of jail free card he had last time, since he can't run for president again. Well, for the moment, anyway.

So, let's just say, there are reasons to be concerned.

-- A2SG, not that any of the previous ones have been allayed, exactly....

 

[essentialsaltes]

The U.S. goods trade deficit with the European Union was $235.6 billion in 2024, a 12.9 percent increase ($26.9 billion) over 2023.

Opinions about what (if anything) to do about it differ.

 

[trophy33]

The U.S. goods trade deficit with the European Union was $235.6 billion in 2024, a 12.9 percent increase ($26.9 billion) over 2023.

Opinions about what (if anything) to do about it differ.

I wonder how is it possible. Almost everyone in Europe uses Microsoft windows, google maps... Almost every company uses Outlook office, Google/Amazon clouds... Every even small town has mcdonalds, kfc, that coffee chain I forgot the name or similar American junk brand. Youtube, Instagram...

After the sanctions against Russia, a lot of natural gas is also imported from the USA.

How can you still be in such trade deficit? What EU goods do you import in such large amounts? Cars?

 

[essentialsaltes]

How can you still be in such trade deficit? What EU goods do you import in such large amounts? Cars?

That looks like a good call. Per the EU

The EU imports raw materials and energy from the US, and exports chemicals machinery & Vehicles and other manufacture goods.

I guess you could say Europe 'adds value' to the raw material and energy it gets from us, and sells that back to the US at the higher price.

 

[RocksInMyHead]

I wonder how is it possible. Almost everyone in Europe uses Microsoft windows, google maps... Almost every company uses Outlook office, Google/Amazon clouds... Every even small town has mcdonalds, kfc, that coffee chain I forgot the name or similar American junk brand. Youtube, Instagram...

After the sanctions against Russia, a lot of natural gas is also imported from the USA.

How can you still be in such trade deficit? What EU goods do you import in such large amounts? Cars?

Medical products/pharmaceuticals and vehicles are the two biggest categories: https://www.euronews.com/my-europe/...is-the-balance-of-trade-between-the-eu-and-us

 

[trophy33]

Are services (MS, Google, Amazon...) or the profits of the US companies generated in the EU (food chains...) even counted in these trade deficits? Or is it just about physical goods crossing physical borders?

 

[essentialsaltes]

Are services (MS, Google, Amazon...) or the profits of the US companies made in the EU (food chains...) even counted in these trade deficits? Or is it just about physical goods crossing physical borders?

It doesn't seem to be. Maybe this only refers to things that might have export duties. Possibly services and software just don't apply.

 

[RocksInMyHead]

Are services (MS, Google, Amazon...) or the profits of the US companies made in the EU (food chains...) even counted in these trade deficits? Or is it just about physical goods?

No, services are tracked separately. Overall, it's still a net deficit when combining goods and services, but it's only about 3-5%

EU trade relations with United States

Facts, figures and latest developments.

policy.trade.ec.europa.eu

 

[Fantine]

I wonder how is it possible. Almost everyone in Europe uses Microsoft windows, google maps... Almost every company uses Outlook office, Google/Amazon clouds... Every even small town has mcdonalds, kfc, that coffee chain I forgot the name or similar American junk brand. Youtube, Instagram...

After the sanctions against Russia, a lot of natural gas is also imported from the USA.

How can you still be in such trade deficit? What EU goods do you import in such large amounts? Cars?

Would that we could import their common sense social responsibility.
Priceless. Sigh.

 

[trophy33]

No, services are tracked separately. Overall, it's still a net deficit when combining goods and services, but it's only about 3-5%

EU trade relations with United States

Facts, figures and latest developments.

policy.trade.ec.europa.eu

I am surprised that the EU even exports services to the US. I live in the EU and I cannot think of any EU-based service to buy, except of local ones.

 

[RocksInMyHead]

I am surprised that the EU even exports services to the US. I live in the EU and I cannot think of any EU-based service to buy, except of local ones.

"Services" is a pretty broad category. Plenty of European software and development companies, and any time you have EU subsidiaries collaborating with US subsidiaries, that's an exchange of services. If a US company pays an EU law firm for assistance in setting up an EU subsidiary, that's an import of services, and so on. Basically, any time that an exchange is made that doesn't involve physical products.

 

[trophy33]

"Services" is a pretty broad category. Plenty of European software and development companies, and any time you have EU subsidiaries collaborating with US subsidiaries, that's an exchange of services. If a US company pays an EU law firm for assistance in setting up an EU subsidiary, that's an import of services, and so on. Basically, any time that an exchange is made that doesn't involve physical products.

Yeah, thats right, I forgot for example video games, music or movies. But it still seems to me that the US ones are sold much more. But its just my feeling, not numbers.

 

[Say it aint so]

Considering how many rumors and so much doomsday predicting and panic there was over Trump starting WW3 during his first administration, they should already be fully assembled.

Thank goodness the adults in the room his first admin kept him in check.

 

[ozso]

Thank goodness the adults in the room his first admin kept him in check.

Ah so that's what they call failed doomsday predictions.

 

[St. Helens]

ADVISOR HAT ON

Closed for Review
ADVISOR HAT OFF​

 

[linux.poet]

MOD HAT ON​

A cleanup was done to remove some off-topic posts. Let’s stay with discussing EU/U.S. trade here.​

​

This thread is being reopened.​

MOD HAT OFF​

 

[eclipsenow]

Thank you moderators. It's a tough job.

Back on topic:

I wonder if the call for a united European Army will nudge the EU a step closer to Federating. Some people think it should then be called "The United States of Europe" but I'm not a fan. It should just be called Europe - with states called France and Germany etc.

How likely do you all think this is given the way the USA seems to be lecturing them and betraying the old alliances right now?

 

[Vambram]

The deficit with the European Union increased $26.9 billion to $235.6 billion in 2024. Exports increased $2.6 billion to $370.2 billion and imports increased $29.4 billion to $605.8 billion.

U.S. International Trade in Goods and Services, December and Annual 2024 | U.S. Bureau of Economic Analysis (BEA)

The U.S. Census Bureau and the U.S. Bureau of Economic Analysis announced today that the goods and services deficit was $98.4 billion in December, up $19.5 billion from $78.9 billion in November, revised.

www.bea.gov