True Justification, works of the Law of Moses, & Conditional Security

stuart lawrence said:

Don't resist the true covenant. I can categorically assure you it will give you far greater peace, far greater love for God if you accept it.

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Well, please do not take this the wrong way, but I don't believe your belief leads to peace and love at all. I know better. I have seen the bad fruits of it personally and thru the testimonies of others.

http://www.christianforums.com/thre...s-conditional-security.7914686/#post-68786429

Anyways, I need to sleep. I need to work in the morning.

Peace be unto you.


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Good night.


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Good night.
And God bless you.


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stuart lawrence said:

Why did the law get transferred onto you heart?

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Again, you think you are exclusively special in this regards. You are not. The Old Testament saint was told by God to keep the law in his heart, too. Putting the Word in your heart is to internalize it so that you may not sin against Him.

Psalm 119:11 - "Thy word have I hid in mine heart, that I might not sin against thee."

Deuteronomy 4:39, “Therefore know this day, and consider it in your heart, that the LORD Himself is God in heaven above and on the earth beneath; there is no other.

Deuteronomy 6:6, “And these words which I command you today shall be in your heart.”

Deuteronomy 8:2, “And you shall remember that the LORD your God led you all the way these forty years in the wilderness, to humble you and test you, to know what was in your heart, whether you would keep His commandments or not.”

Deuteronomy 11:18, “Therefore you shall lay up these words of mine in your heart and in your soul, and bind them as a sign on your hand, and they shall be as frontlets between your eyes.”

Deuteronomy 30:14, “But the word is very near you, in your mouth and in your heart, that you may do it.”

Psalm 37:31, “The law of his God is in his heart; None of his steps shall slide.”

Psalm 119:10, “With my whole heart I have sought You; Oh, let me not wander from Your commandments!”

Psalm 119:34, “Give me understanding, and I shall keep Your law; Indeed, I shall observe it with my whole heart.”

Psalm 119:69, “The proud have forged a lie against me, But I will keep Your precepts with my whole heart.”

Isaiah 51:7, “Listen to Me, you who know righteousness, You people in whose heart is My law: Do not fear the reproach of men, Nor be afraid of their insults.”

Psalm 40:8 “I delight to do Your will, O my God, And Your law is within my heart.”

Proverbs 3:1, “My son, do not forget my law, But let your heart keep my commands.”


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stuart lawrence said:

For sin shall not be your master for you are not under law but under grace
What then, shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? By no means! Don't you know that when you offer yourselves to someone to obey him as slaves you are slaves to the one whom you obey rom6:14-16

Who have you offered yourself to Jason? Jesus? Then you are not under law but under grace for you have chosen your master

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Actually, you left out an important word that shows up in Romans 6:1. It is the word "continue."

Paul asks the question: "
"Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?"

According to what you said so far, the answer would be a "yes" because you told me that you do not believe you can stop sinning or cease from sin. You also told me that Galatians says that we will be found as sinners, too.

However, what is Paul's reply to this question on whether or not we should continue in sin? Paul says, "God forbid." (Romans 8:2).


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stuart lawrence said:

But this what you are not understanding. You think if you remove a law of righteousness from the moral law people are free to break that law. If that were the case it would be pointless to transfer that law onto the heart and mind of the convert, nothing had been achieved. Paul is writing to people committed to God, to the church, they don't want a licence to sin, they need victory over sin. This point is what stops most accepting the true message.

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But is there victory over sin in your life? You told me that you do not believe in Sinless Perfectionism or that a believer cannot stop from sinning.

For can an alcoholic claim victory over alcohol if they say they cannot ever stop? Surely not.


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stuart lawrence said:

Absolutel
Absolutely. What is the core terms of the new covenant?

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That would require a rather lengthy reply with Scripture (Which would be deserving of it's own thread). But I believe I already expressed before what a person must do in order to be saved and what lies beneath in one doing that (Which is a love - that can only come from God).


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kingskid said:

We are to confess and then the son cleanses us.

1 John 1:9-10 KJV
If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. [10] If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

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Yes, but 1 John 1:9 is not a one time event in most cases for a believer. It is imperative that they continue to confess their sin or they are not forgiven of their sin and cleansed of unrighteousness.

In 1 John 2:1 (which follows a little after 1 John 1:9), John states, "My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:"

So John is telling us to:

(a) Not sin.
(b) If we do sin, we have an advocate that we can go to.

Furthermore, what does 1 John 1:9 say?

It says we are actually forgiven IF.... IF we confess our sin.

"If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness." (1 John 1:9).

For David had confessed of his sin to get God so as to stay right with the Lord (Psalm 51).

Proverbs 28:13 says, "He that covereth his sins shall not prosper: but whoso confesseth and forsaketh them shall have mercy."

Even before Christ's death confession was imperative.
Matthew 3:6-8 KJV
And were baptized of him in Jordan, confessing their sins. [7] But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees come to his baptism, he said unto them, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come? [8] Bring forth therefore fruits meet for repentance:

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But notice what John is really saying here. He says bring forth FRUITS worthy of repentance (or confession). In other words, as you said, it does no good to confess if there is no real change in one's life.

A lot of Christians are in bondage to sin because they are afraid of confessing the sin that plagues them. There is freedom in confession and belief.

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Not only are they in bondage to sin if they do not confess of their sins, but if they do not confess and they have backslidden into a life style of sin, they are not saved. They need to repent and get their heart right with the Lord to have life again.

The belief is important because the cleaning comes from belief.
1 John 1:5-7 KJV
This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all. [6] If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth: [7] But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

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But notice verse 7. It does not say "belief." It says if we WALK in the light as He is in the light, .....(then what happens)? It says we have fellowship and the blood of Jesus Christ cleanses of all sin. This lines up perfectly with 1 John 2:3-4 that says,

"And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him."

Our righteous prayers for others can avail much.
James 5:15-20 KJV
And the prayer of faith shall save the sick, and the Lord shall raise him up; and if he have committed sins, they shall be forgiven him.

So my righteous prayer for this board is that any Christian in bondage to sin should not be afraid of confession simply because others look so righteous. Our righteousness is not our own.
Amen

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Well, I know what James 5:19-20 says and you did not quote it. In fact, it is a passage I wanted to quote above, but you left it out. Let's see what it says.

"Brethren, if any of you do err from the truth, and one convert him; Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins." (James 5:19-20).

Many here will say that a believer's sins are paid for past, present, and future. However, James above here is saying that if one errors or slides away from the truth and another believer converts them back to the faith, they are to realize that they have converted this backslidden believing sinner from their error of their ways and have helped to save their soul from spiritual death (whereby their sins would be covered by their repentance towards Christ in coming back to the faith).


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kingskid said:

Of course there are confessions without a true repentance behind it.

I was reading where one person kept confessing an addiction to porn but then they would justify it by their age. Saying well I am a teen male so what do you expect?

I would have to believe that is not yet a true believer since they did not see the harm in their vice, as of yet.

I can only pray for them that they see the harm and believe someday.
The Lord's will be done.
Amen

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If this was their attitude towards sin, then I would say they it is possible they may have never knew God. However, sin can be a tempting master to be under and people can easily switch allegiance from one master to another (putting out their mind their former lord).

But if they were honestly struggling with sin and pleading with tears with God and the church to stop, then that would be different (of course).

However, there are people who have believed and followed Christ faithfully for a time but they fell away from the faith, though. The Parable of the Sower lets us know that those who have received the Word with joy into their hearts had fell away. One had fell away due to persecution and the other fell away due to the cares of the riches within this life. Even the 70 disciples were told by Jesus that they were to rejoice that their names were written in Heaven (See Luke 10:17 and Luke 10:20). However, later in John 6:66 (Which is not a good number by the way), they stopped following Jesus. But the 11 did not stop following Jesus. Peter said, where shall we go? You have the words of eternal life.

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