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Trinity and Protestantism

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Albion

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Starcomet said:
I believe such a tradition is absurd as there is no biblical grounds to assume that no one went to heaven until Jesus came. All we have is traditions about shoel and that is that.
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If no one was refused admission to heaven prior to Christ, what purpose would the Incarnation and the Cross have served? A "better offer" for those who come later?
 
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Duvduv

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It's a logical fallacy. The Book of Genesis was written long before the NT, and mentioned the lamb. Then along comes a reference in the later NT to Jesus as the "lamb of God" (without any actual sacrifice on an altar but only metaphorical meaning) and then they go backwards and apply it to the story of Isaac where the lamb was sacrificed instead of Isaac, which has nothing to do with the Christian metaphors!
 
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Albion

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Duvduv said:
For heaven's sake, none of this is stated in the Christian scriptures, and the question is why....!!
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Certainly it is. Most, at least, is right from Scripture. Jesus, the eternal Son of God. He became man in Bethlehem. The One God only. Three persona identified as God. And so on. All Scriptural.
 
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Albion

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Duvduv said:
Albion, can't you distinguish your doctrine from what is not stated in the Christian scriptures, including the Gospel of John? Aren't you following this at all?
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It does take two to have an exchange of views, you know, not just a bunch of harrumpfs and sneers every time someone answers a question.
 
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Duvduv

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Not only is it sad to read about the suffering of the Anabaptists at the hands of a conspiracy of the Catholic Church and the Protestants, but when looking at the situation of the Unitarian movements and Jacob Palaeologus. And all their teachings have basically been sidelined because as protestants themselves they simply wanted to look further than Luther and Calvin to question other dogma of the Church, and for that they faced the hatred of both the Church and the Protestants!
 
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Traveling teacher

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i was tought growing up
speak where the Bible speaks
be silent where the Bible is silent

it is best to only use Bible terms
if the word 'trinity" is not in the Bible it is best not to use it

we could probably have a real biblical discusion of the relationship between
Father Son and Holy Spirit
if we didnt debate non biblical terms

but that is 1700 years ago so it appaarently will never happen
 
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Duvduv

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If there were a non-hateful leader for Protestant Christians to follow one would think it would have been Francis of Assisi, John Wycliff and Jon Huss. Luther was after the Anabaptists as well as the Jews.
 
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Albion

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Duvduv said:
If there were a non-hateful leader for Protestant Christians to follow one would think it would have been Francis of Assisi, John Wycliff and Jon Huss. Luther was after the Anabaptists as well as the Jews.
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I don't think it is fair to Luther to picture him that way, but, that aside, the difference is that the Papacy was not back on its heels in Francis' day. The church could tolerate a rebel and oddball (that's what they thought of him) so long as he didn't criticize the Papacy.

But in Luther's day, the change was underway. The Lollards and Hussites had already made their presence known and social and political conditions were getting steadily darker with political rebellion, the Black Death, the Western Schism, and so on.

By the time that Luther raised his very reasonable protest--actually it was questions more than anything else--the Papacy was in no mood to give in even to the extent that it did in Francis' time, for the reason that the Papacy and the Medieval church were in a much weaker position than before.
 
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