Translating the ancient Hebrew Alphabet

[Laureate]

6693 7219 859
TsQ R Sh Th
stress will poison you

Has any one out there ever seen or heard of anyone translating the ancient Hebrew alphabet?
It's sort of been a hobby of mine between my usual studies.

The letters which I have placed in (parenthesis) are either equivalent to traditional vowel pointing, or reveal a varient spelling or pattern found within the Masoretic text.

Masorah is abbrv. MS,
Google Translate is GT, and
Brown Drivers and Briggs is BDB, otherwise a strongs number is provided as a reference.

589 899 1930.2 2098
A BGD HW Z(W)
I will clothe them who

2338 2967.1
KhT Y
sow me

3637 5253.1/5375 5889
KLM(H) NS(H) O(Y)P
humbly to lift up the weary,

google trans. 3423-MS
Ts(W)Q YRSh-Th
the rock is your-inheritence

Loop and translate again

MS 898(MS)
A B G (Y) D
I will (make) the transgressors

1930.2
HW
who have

2182 MS 3637 MS
Z(N)Kh T(h)Y K L M (N) reject(ed) me ashamed; Let

5251 5774
NS Ah(W)P
the standard fly,

6680 7121
Ts(WH) QR(A)
send a messenger Summon

8352
ShTh
(the decsendants of) Seth;
(i.e., every living survivor of
ADM/Mankind)

Loop and translate again

1 1413-1886.3
AB GD(D)-H
The father will gather-them-together

871.1 4206 2916-3509.3 (W)V(B) (M)ZKh TY(T)-K
at the haven whose-soil is

3807.1 4498-5889
L MN(W)S - Ah(Y)P
for the weary-to take refuge

GT 3423-MS
Ts(W)Q (Y)RSh-Th
the rock is your-inheritence

Loop and translate again

1 5046 1886.3
AB (N) G D H
The father has declared it,

2050.1
W
concerning

209 2398 3605 3963.1
Z(W) KhTY KL M
whosoever sins, all who

5265 6310
NSAh P(H)/MS
depart from the commandments

6627 6980 7896
Ts(A) Q(W)R Sh(Y)Th issued webs shall be appointed

the following is an alternate direction from the context being followed.

2050.1 2098 2398
W Z(W) KhTY
...concerning whosoever sins,

3605 3963.1 5265
KL M NSAh
All who depart

6475
PTs(H)
shall be delivered

7119 8354 8353 178
QR ShTh(H) ShTh A(W)B
a cold drink [or] six pack

QR-ShTh-A(W)B
'a cold-six-pack', at first may seem humorous, yet it reflects a time period when such a term would be applicable; also the word for 'six' here, 'ShTh', though it was used by the ancient Jews, it is of Chaldean/Babylonian origin, hence it may be pertaining to the True Jews currently occupying modern day Babylon.
Just a thought.

the following is an alternate direction from the current context being followed.

3605 3963.1 5265 6475
KL M NSAh PTs(H)
...all who depart are set free

6980 7896
Q(W)R Sh(Y)Th
of the webs set in array

reiteration

6980 7896
Q(W)R Sh(Y)Th
the webs apointed
(Loop)

1 5046 -1886.8 2050.2
A B (N)GD -H W
by the father who-told them,

2186 2916
Z(N)Kh TY(T)
cast away the filth

3605 4480 5588
KL MN SAhP
completely from the thoughts

6694 7218-MS
Ts(W)Q R(A)Sh - Th
pouring out of your - head;

Loop and translate again from the previous context.

3605 3963.1 5265 6475
KL M NSAh PTs(H)
...all who depart are set free

7136 8352 1 5057
QR(H) ShTh AB (N)G(Y)D to meet Seth the chief prince

1886.3
H
of them

2050.1 2186 4297 MS
W Z(N)Kh (M)T(H) Y
who was rejected, injustly he was


3637 MS 3635-4480
K L M Y K L(L)-M
put to shame, they set-him-upon

5251
NS
a pole

5774/MS 6695/MS
Ah(Y)P Ts(Y)Q
to wax faint, that anguish may

3423-MS
(Y)RSh -Th
take-its-place.

(Loop)

1 1413-1886.3
AB GD(D)-H
The father will gather-them-together
2050.1 2098 2398
W Z(W) KhT
and whsoever is reconciled

1961
Y
shall have

3637-3963.1 5265 6475
KLM-(M) NSAh PTs(H)
their-shame removed, get rid of

6980 7954/MS MS
Q(W)R Sh Th
the webs that you may have.

Come on you guys, pull out your lexicons and Masoretic skills and give me a hand with this, there is yet more comtexts to unfold.

The 1st 4 letters (when vowel pointed) define the word president, i.e., AB=chief+(N)G(Y)D=in command

 

[Laureate]

Shucks, The thread isn't holding the justification/alignment that I typed in, awwww!

 

[yonah_mishael]

I don't understand at all.

 

[yonah_mishael]

You translate words in sentences in contexts. You don't translate letters. There's something odd about this thread.

 

[yonah_mishael]

Come on you guys, pull out your lexicons and Masoretic skills and give me a hand with this, there is yet more comtexts to unfold.

So much easier to actually learn Hebrew. What in the world are you doing?

 

[Laureate]

Is not 'AB' a transliteration of a Hebrew word? and likewise 'NGYD'? then my next question is are you familiar with the many alternate spellings of Hebrew words in the Masoretic text? are you aware that 'NGYD' is known to appear without the 'N'?

 

[namakele]

x

 

[Laureate]

Well, I didn't expect to have to eat crow this early in the game, but...I just combed the entire Masorah, and the Strongs # 5057 NGYD doesn't appear anywhere without the 'N'. however in Nehemiah 11:11 'NGYD' is spelled without the 'Y'. I'm now searching to see the alternate spellings on NGD. a 'Y' is often inserted as an affix, and is usually translated as 'that' or 'make', this is probably the case where we have seen, i.e., NGD as GYD. The only place where GD appears in the context of NGYD is when the scripture pertains to the Canaanite/Babylonian deity, traditionally rendered, 'Fortune', compare with NGYD 'excellent things'. It would've been an abomination for an Ishraei to say that name, and know that at the same time you would be saying leader, prince, chief, captain, etc.
What I should have said is, it is common to find a 'M' or 'N' dropped from many words throughout the Masoretic text.

 

[namakele]

I'm so glad you brought that up. I'm working on a translation right now and I'm eager to check out what the dictionary has to offer when applying that rule. I'm not so well read in the Ancient Hebrew to say "Hey yeah I remember seeing that particular word 'NGYD' appear as 'GYD', but I can say I have seen alternate spellings of the Hebrew words in the Masoretic text . As one still relatively at a beginning level in understanding the ancient Hebrew text, I am so thankful that the interlinear has the Strong's Concordance numbers above the Hebrew words so I can look things up.
The Hebrew word NThN meaning to give, etc. would be a good example of what you're talking about, I came across a place -Proverbs 29:17- last night where 'NThN' appears without it's first 'N'.

 

[namakele]

x

 

[yonah_mishael]

Is not 'AB' a transliteration of a Hebrew word? and likewise 'NGYD'? then my next question is are you familiar with the many alternate spellings of Hebrew words in the Masoretic text? are you aware that 'NGYD' is known to appear without the 'N'?

You think that א is transliterated well as an A in English? No, I don't think that AB is a transliteration of a Hebrew word if you're being consistent in your system. Your system apparently represents only the consonants, and A is not a consonant. Most use ) or ' to represent א.

And, no, I am not aware of גיד as an alternative spelling of נגיד. The word גִּיד appears in the Bible on its own terms (from the root ג.י.&#1491. It has nothing to do with the word נָגִיד that appears in Daniel 9. גִּיד means sinew, nerve, bond, while נָגִיד (from the room נ.ג.&#1491 is some kind of leader, prince, nobleman. There's no connection. The latter is from the same root as לְהַגִּיד, meaning to tell, declare.

All that aside, even if A were a proper transliteration of א, even if גיד were an alternative form of נגיד... what in the world are you doing with the words?!? What are all these numbers and what is the idea of translating letters??

 

[yonah_mishael]

Well, I didn't expect to have to eat crow this early in the game, but...I just combed the entire Masorah, and the Strongs # 5057 NGYD doesn't appear anywhere without the 'N'. however in Nehemiah 11:11 'NGYD' is spelled without the 'Y'. I'm now searching to see the alternate spellings on NGD. a 'Y' is often inserted as an affix, and is usually translated as 'that' or 'make', this is probably the case where we have seen, i.e., NGD as GYD. The only place where GD appears in the context of NGYD is when the scripture pertains to the Canaanite/Babylonian deity, traditionally rendered, 'Fortune', compare with NGYD 'excellent things'. It would've been an abomination for an Ishraei to say that name, and know that at the same time you would be saying leader, prince, chief, captain, etc.
What I should have said is, it is common to find a 'M' or 'N' dropped from many words throughout the Masoretic text.

That's because the נ is part of the root in the case of נגיד. The י is not part of the root. Where in the world did you get that י means "because" as an infix? You've got some really weird ideas about Hebrew. None of this is true.

 

[yonah_mishael]

The Hebrew word NThN meaning to give, etc. would be a good example of what you're talking about, I came across a place -Proverbs 29:17- last night where 'NThN' appears without it's first 'N'.

The נ of נתן always assimilates in the imperfect. This isn't "coming across." This is always. I really suggest that you study Hebrew – real Hebrew – instead of this nonsense that you're doing.

(1) Throw away Strong's dictionary. It's a lazy-making tool.

(2) Look for an online Hebrew study group for free that's about to start up. May I suggest that you join Hebrew Self-Study?

(3) Buy the grammar book that they want to work through.

(4) Learn Hebrew. Learn Hebrew. Learn Hebrew.

(5) Read the Bible.

Once you know Hebrew, then you can play around with gematria and other silly things. But, until you know Hebrew, you're just playing with things you don't understand and spinning your wheels.

 

[Laureate]

You translate words in sentences in contexts. You don't translate letters. There's something odd about this thread.

Two important things to point out about the original format of the ancient biblical text, 1) the original text has no spaces between the words, so the text appeared as the alphabet appears, like a bunch of letters: Isn't this why the scriptures are refered to as 'The Word of Aloah', and not as, 'The Words of Aloah'. Just one long continuous strand of (sacred) variables full of instructions.

2) Originally there were no so called vowel points/diacritic marks in the text to distinguish pronunciation, word breaks, or syntax.

Now, the adding of vowel points to the commandments given unto Moshe', is explicitly forbidden in Deuteronomy 4:2

Notwithstanding, In Isaiah 9:6 Aloah fore tells of the Masorah being upon one's shoulder. (see orig. text)

Job 31:35 Oh that one would hear me! behold, my desire is, that the Almighty would answer me, and that mine adversary had written a book. 31:36 Surely I would take it upon my shoulder...

My emphasis, He would take a book written by El Shdai and place it upon his shoulder.

In (the etymological section of) an older version of Strongs, ShKM, i.e., the 'shoulder' is referred to as, 'the place of burden', i.e., MShA, lit. burden, oracle, prophecy, etc. [4853]

When I asked HaQDSh RUaKh, Why the amendment was authorized, it was explained to me, that over time the Jews who were in Babylonian captivity, were on the verge of losing their native tongue via their dissemination, for 70 years!?! Wow its amazing they were able to hold on to what so many have lost (in a fraction of the time), being in the same situation, a clear case of Divine intervention.

Furthermore, I was reminded, that, to add unto a word, is also a means of diminishing from it; so I asked HaQDSh RUaKh, do the diacritic marks/vowel pointing diminish anything from the original nature of The Word?

And it was explained to me, that the original format was purer than the format with diacritic marks, but as a consolation, the diacritic marks reveal the diverse nature of the original text, showing us the many ways the same set of consonants could be punctuated under various contexts; the diacritic marks were never intended to limit the original text, the manner in which it was originally written is as sacred as what was written; for a single strand of text is able to be translated over and over again, intelligibly, never contradicting, and with so much clarity, all ambiguity is removed from the subject. When you vowel point a strand of variables the uneducated reader may (as a draw back) over look the fact that, there are more details within the very same set of variables.

So in essence HaQDSh RUaKh answer was, no the diacritic marks do not diminish anything from the original format, however an individual's understanding of them, and the lack thereof could easily limit their ability to understand the fuller messessage, thus only their perspective of the fuller message will be diminished.

I was told, that, Reading the ancient Hebrew text with vowel points is like riding a bike with training wheels.

 

[yonah_mishael]

I'll get to the rest of your post later, but what is "HaQDSh RUaKh"? Have you ever read Hebrew at all that you should lecture me on Hebrew? I assume you were trying to put together רוח הקודש. You don't even know how construct chains work in Hebrew, yet you're going to tell me about how ancient Hebrew worked? This is kinda funny....

 

[Laureate]

I am sorry if I appeared to be lecturing, In my mind, I was trying to show accountability, give a testimony, and take into account the other members or vistors that might be viewing this discussion, again pardon me, for I did not mean to preach to the choir, what the choir already knows.I am also very familiar with the Hebrew construct, and find it prevalent through out the Masorah: therefore I am well aware that RUaKh HQDSh is read contrary to how the Hebrew voice appears to the ear, i.e., The Holy Spirit, and that HQDSh RUaKh is rendered, (the) Spirit of the Holy (Saints). I'm always trying to speak poetically, my implication is, that The Holy Spirit is also the Spirit of the Saints, I did not mean to throw you, and I hope it does not offend. I do have a Biblical Hebrew text and work book published by Yale University Press maybe your familiar with Bonnie Pedrotti Kittel, Vicki Hoffer, and Rebecca Abts Wright (the authors). Please clarify for me, why the Strong's, and other references say that the letter 'aleph' represents the Schwa sound, which is an unstressed vowel sound, as the 'e' in 'the'. Thank you for pointing out my use of 'A' as a transliteration for the letter aleph. It would have helped if I would have mentioned that this is the only sound (the schwa sound), that I ascribe to the letter 'A' when using it to transliterate the letter aleph. Besides the letter A is the alpha that once shared its roots with Aleph. As for the 'A', 'Y', and 'W' that I placed in parenthesis, (as I prefaced before my attempt to lay out my translation as an interlineer), they represent the only diacritics in my system of transliterating; as a vowel my (W) only represents the 'U' sound. as the 'u' in 'due', likewise the (Y) only represents the 'ee' sound; for from these three vowel sounds come not only all of the vowel sounds, ( I look forward to demonstrating this, perhaps on another thread), but in combination they create the Y and W sound, i.e., when 'ee-ah' is pronounced the Y sound appears in the midst, likewise when 'uu-ah' is pronounced the W sound appears in the midst. the numbers you asked about, are the strongs reference #, they (from my perspective) had nothing to do with gemetria. yea, yea I ate a little crow concerning NGYD, rub it in already,lol Thank you for confirming my notion concerning the Y having nothing to do with the actual root of NGYD.There is nothing lazy about spending hours at a time in the Masorah, Strongs is a decent reference, but far from exhausted, as it claims to be, and anyone who totally relys on it is lazy to a degree, on that I must agree, they should jump into a place where the words are being used in context with other words. I have learned so much with HaQDSh RUaKh guiding me through the Masorah and lexicons, that unless the same spirit guides me to do otherwise, I feel it would be an insult to seek someone with less credentials than his, besides, who was the Word inspired and authored by men or the Spirit of Aloah?! I see nothing wrong with receiving a formal education, shucks I've graduated with honors from every school and accademy (x3) that I ever Attended; My 1st scholarship offer came at age 12. I have no problem with attending any school, I prefer to be guided from on high, and the moment I believe he desires for me to enroll, I will not hesitate.Perhaps that is why I am here, maybe that is what He has in store for me, i.e., join a formal study group, personally I have yet to be directed to do so, yet an invitation would surely be one of the two or three indicators that I would be sure to incline my heart to.

 

[yonah_mishael]

 

[Laureate]

O.k. In Judges 14:12 I found a case where the 'Y' is in the midst of 'GD' 'AM HGD Th-GYD-W AWThH LY', I translate, If you can make it clear, declare it's symbology to me...: The same 'GD' appears in verse 15 'WYGD' without the 'Y' inserted.This is one of many cases I have found the 'Y' inserted in a root, and in each case it was consistent, lending either, 'make', 'that', and if Im not mistaken, 'cause(-ing)', to the context. Im looking for more cases in the Masorah where I have seen the 'Y' inserted in other roots, and appears to have the same effect on the root. Thank you for being patient with me Yonah I don't mean to be difficult.

 

[Laureate]

I do have a genuine question Im sure you can help me with, when the 'W' is prefixed to a root to mean 'and', is it pronounced with a 'V' sound or a 'U' sound? I honestly do not know!

 

[namakele]

'