transference of the anionting

[enoch son]

I say yes. It's like a chian reaction. Any thoughts?

 

[LynneClomina]

as in from one believer to another through touch?

oh yeah, i have been through too many fire tunnels to doubt that! well, at least for the anointing of joy...

 

[Jim B]

I say yes. It's like a chian reaction. Any thoughts?

If, in fact, this is true e.s. then surely there is scriptural precedent for it. Care to help me out here? In the NIV New Testament the word is only used 16 times (18 in the KJV) and not once does it refer to a special anointing on a person but as the seal of the Spirit on all believers.

So, is there such a thing as a "transference of anointing?" Not from the way I read the NT.

Personally, I think the term “anointing” is a hackneyed and much over-used (and often misused) word in Charismatic circles. Anointing, as it is most often used by modern practitioners, is not used in the same way in scripture.

An interesting thread might be “What does the New Testament teach about ‘the anointing’?”

\o/

 

[enoch son]

Jim and Jesus last name is Christ? When the women came and touch Jesus He say he felt the power leave him. That sound like a transference to me in less you believe that the power of God just went out into space.
I think it can be through touch, or just setting by someone who is under the anionting. It can just fall or be release in worship by the many.

 

[Ecclesiastes]

The Transferral of the Anointing

Are you referring to the Elijah-Elisha, Paul-Timothy, Moses-Joshua aspect? Or the power of God surging through the one person to the other resulting in the manifest power of GOd as in healing or such?

 

[Jim B]

The Transferral of the Anointing

Are you referring to the Elijah-Elisha, Paul-Timothy, Moses-Joshua aspect? Or the power of God surging through the one person to the other resulting in the manifest power of GOd as in healing or such?

This is probably going to be an exercise in semantics, but these are mentor-pupil relationships, not “transference of anointing.” In fact, the word “anointing” is not used in relationship to either Joshua or Timothy and I believe it is incorrect to apply the word in either a literal or spiritual sense to them. The anointing of Elisha (along with Jehu) in 1 Kings 19.6 was a physical anointing with OIL, not the Spirit, a ceremony to signify his official appointment as a prophet by God through his servant Elijah. All Old Testament anointings were ritual anointings with oil of people and holy objects, to signify that they were set apart and consecrated for God’s exclusive use.

It was Elishah’s own anointing, not a transference of Elijah’s anointing. The “double portion” of power was just that, an endowment of power by the Holy Spirit. A transference of "authority” may be in view here, but not a transference of “anointing.”

That God used Joshua, Elisha, and Timothy (and scores of others) mightily is without dispute, but the Bible does not refer to their power as an anointing much less “transference” of anointing.

While the term does have a spiritual ring to it, it is, in my IMO, unbiblical.

\o/

 

[enoch son]

Bull Jim! I move in dwell in JESUS THE ANOINTED ONE! I'm hidden in JESUS THE ANOINTED ONE! WE HAVE PUT ON THE ANOINTED ONE! WE ARE MADE ALIVE IN THE ANOINTED ONE! Do you have some other bible?
The word Christ means the anointed one it is used over 300 x's in the N.T. alone.
Do you not have the spirit of the anointed one? (Romans 8-9).
If you say you do not have the spirit of Christ then you are not one of His and I must rebuke you. You need to rethink you doctrine asap!

 

[Jim B]

Bull Jim! I move in dwell in JESUS THE ANOINTED ONE! I'm hidden in JESUS THE ANOINTED ONE! WE HAVE PUT ON THE ANOINTED ONE! WE ARE MADE ALIVE IN THE ANOINTED ONE! Do you have some other bible?
The word Christ means the anointed one it is used over 300 x's in the N.T. alone.
Do you not have the spirit of the anointed one? (Romans 8-9).
If you say you do not have the spirit of Christ then you are not one of His and I must rebuke you. You need to rethink you doctrine asap!

Wow, es. You are sure throwing punches at me these days. Are you getting enough sleep?

FYI, I have an English Bible. What kind do you have?

IMO, you are really stretching it theologically on this transference thing. Are you saying that because I am in the Anointed One I can transfer the anointing? Where does the Bible say that? All I have asked for was some scripture to validate your point of view. And I am asking again.

Or are you just hatching all this up as you go along?

And please, es, let me work out my own salvation? I do not think you are that concerned about me anyhow.

And stop shouting, please. My wife can hear you in the other room.

\o/

 

[enoch son]

1. 2 Cor. 1-21 Could that be a transference? Oh- wait God Jim say's you can not do that so you have better stop it.
I'm not shouting Jim sometimes I don't think you can see my last post so I type it bigger. I will stop at just one. But there are many more.

 

[Jim B]

1. 2 Cor. 1-21 Could that be a transference? Oh- wait God Jim say's you can not do that so you have better stop it.
I'm not shouting Jim sometimes I don't think you can see my last post so I type it bigger. I will stop at just one. But there are many more.

e.s., It would help if you would take the time to print out the scripture so I don’t have to look it up. If you are trying to prove your point, it is unreasonable to expect me to look up every reference you use. The burden of proof is on you. If you expect me to take the time to look up your references, the least you can do is look it up yourself.

And the snide remarks don't help, either.

I will do the same for you.

Jim
\o/

 

[enoch son]

So that means one of us is talking of the side of our head. But lets not go there.
2 Cor. 1-21 Now HE who establishes us with you in THE ANOINTED ONE (Christ) and anointed us is GOD, 22. who also sealed us and gave us the Spirit in our hearts as a pledge.
Would you look at that 4 transferences in two vers.. God must like to transfer things. I wonder if it is part of His character!

 

[Jim B]

So that means one of us is talking of the side of our head. But lets not go there.
2 Cor. 1-21 Now HE who establishes us with you in THE ANOINTED ONE (Christ) and anointed us is GOD, 22. who also sealed us and gave us the Spirit in our hearts as a pledge.
Would you look at that 4 transferences in two vers.. God must like to transfer things. I wonder if it is part of His character!

Thanks for the scripture, e. It helps.

In context, the verse (says, completing the sentence, “Now it is God who makes both us and you stand firm in Christ. He anointed us, set his seal of ownership on us, and put his Spirit in our hearts as a deposit, guaranteeing what is to come.”

What does this have to say about “transferring” anointing?

As I said in post#3

In the NIV New Testament the word ['anointing'] is only used 16 times (18 in the KJV) and not once does it refer to a special anointing on a person but as the seal of the Spirit on all believers.

So, is there such a thing as a "transference of anointing?" Not from the way I read the NT.

As for the verse you mentioned in your quote above, it reinforces my position. It has nothing to say about one person "transferring" an anointing to another (which I believe is an unbiblical concept) and, unless I am mistaken (which is possible), that is the subject of this thread.

Maybe we are talking about two different things here, e.

\o/

 

[enoch son]

So the HE in the vers. is Forest Gump? So let me get this right something did not leave HE and come to us? LIKE THE ANOINTING!
Webster say's Transference an act, process or instance of transferring: TRANSFER: to convey from one person , place or situation to another.
Sound like everything we have and give in God is a TRANSFERENCE!
Nothing like using a different bible and saying I'm out of context because I used the NAS. that dog won't hunt jim.

 

[Ecclesiastes]

Remember,

Paul transferre the anointing and the gifts by laying hands on Timothy.

 

[Jim B]

Remember,

Paul transferre the anointing and the gifts by laying hands on Timothy.

I suppose if you want to call it a "transference of anointing" that is your perogative, but the Bible does not call it that. The anointing, to my understanding, is what happens to us when we are born of the Spirit, saved. Every child of God is anointed. It is designed to safeguard truth by "teaching us all things." By my understanding of the term, you are saying that Paul transferred his salvation to Timothy.

Apparently, we are defining our terms differently and that always makes for a difficult discussion.

\o/

 

[Ecclesiastes]

The anointing is the empowerment of the Spirit. Jesus referred to Him when said that the "Holy Ghost shall come upon you" and "you shall be endued with power from on high". The Holy Spirit's power is the anointing. The oil repersented the Holy Spirit and was a sign of Him anointing (rubbing off, "Mashach" the Hebrew word for it) the person. The anointing can be passed by the laying on of hands. In that instance it is used for service just as Paul was telling Timothy to stir up the gifts inside of him and when the first Apostles laid hands on the 7 at the church in Acts 6.

 

[Jim B]

The anointing is the empowerment of the Spirit. Jesus referred to Him when said that the "Holy Ghost shall come upon you" and "you shall be endued with power from on high". The Holy Spirit's power is the anointing. The oil repersented the Holy Spirit and was a sign of Him anointing (rubbing off, "Mashach" the Hebrew word for it) the person. The anointing can be passed by the laying on of hands. In that instance it is used for service just as Paul was telling Timothy to stir up the gifts inside of him and when the first Apostles laid hands on the 7 at the church in Acts 6.

I too held that belief until I did a study of the 16 verses in the New Testament in which the word “anointing” is used. My study of those verses has taught me otherwise.

For your convenience I have listed below every occurance of the word "anoint/anointed/anointing in the New Testament (NIV):

Matthew 1:17
Thus there were fourteen generations in all from Abraham to David, fourteen from David to the exile to Babylon, and fourteen from the exile to the Christ.[ 1:17 Or Messiah. "The Christ" (Greek) and "the Messiah" (Hebrew) both mean "the Anointed One."] )

Mark 6:13
They drove out many demons and anointed many sick people with oil and healed them.

Mark 8:29
"But what about you?" he asked. "Who do you say I am?" Peter answered, "You are the Christ.[ 8:29 Or Messiah. "The Christ" (Greek) and "the Messiah" (Hebrew) both mean "the Anointed One."] "

Mark 16:1
When the Sabbath was over, Mary Magdalene, Mary the mother of James, and Salome bought spices so that they might go to anoint Jesus' body.

Luke 2:11
Today in the town of David a Savior has been born to you; he is Christ[ 2:11 Or Messiah. "The Christ" (Greek) and "the Messiah" (Hebrew) both mean "the Anointed One"; also in verse 26.] the Lord.

Luke 4:18
"The Spirit of the Lord is on me, because he has anointed me to preach good news to the poor. He has sent me to proclaim freedom for the prisoners and recovery of sight for the blind, to release the oppressed,

John 1:20
He did not fail to confess, but confessed freely, "I am not the Christ.[ 1:20 Or Messiah. "The Christ" (Greek) and "the Messiah" (Hebrew) both mean "the Anointed One"; also in verse 25.]

John 12:1
Six days before the Passover, Jesus arrived at Bethany, where Lazarus lived, whom Jesus had raised from the dead.

Acts 2:31
Seeing what was ahead, he spoke of the resurrection of the Christ,[ 2:31 Or Messiah. "The Christ" (Greek) and "the Messiah" (Hebrew) both mean "the Anointed One"; also in verse 36.] that he was not abandoned to the grave, nor did his body see decay.

Acts 4:26
The kings of the earth take their stand and the rulers gather together against the Lord and against his Anointed One.[ 4:26 That is, Christ or Messiah] '[ 4:26 Psalm 2:1,2]

Acts 4:27
Indeed Herod and Pontius Pilate met together with the Gentiles and the people[ 4:27 The Greek is plural.] of Israel in this city to conspire against your holy servant Jesus, whom you anointed.

Acts 10:38
how God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Spirit and power, and how he went around doing good and healing all who were under the power of the devil, because God was with him.

2 Corinthians 1:21
Now it is God who makes both us and you stand firm in Christ. He anointed us,

Hebrews 1:9
You have loved righteousness and hated wickedness; therefore God, your God, has set you above your companions by anointing you with the oil of joy."[ 1:9 Psalm 45:6,7]

James 5:14
Is any one of you sick? He should call the elders of the church to pray over him and anoint him with oil in the name of the Lord.

1 John 2:20
But you have an anointing from the Holy One, and all of you know the truth.[ 2:20 Some manuscripts and you know all things]

1 John 2:27
As for you, the anointing you received from him remains in you, and you do not need anyone to teach you. But as his anointing teaches you about all things and as that anointing is real, not counterfeit–just as it has taught you, remain in him.

 

[Jim B]

Disregard this post.

 

[Ecclesiastes]

So how does this disagree from what I posted? I said the anointing is the empowerment of the Holy Spirit. Yes, when we are saved we receive Him on the inside, but when we are Baptized with teh Holy Ghost we receive Him upon us. In addition to that the Anointing can rest upon us for service beyond jus thte Baptism. The Offices of the 5-Fold Ministry Gifts have specific anointings. Jesus said that He was anointed to preach the good news. The anointing was so strong upon Peter that he walked down the street and his shadow touched people and they were healed. The Anointing was so strong upon Paul that he layed on a dead boy and the boy got up; the anointing was also so strong that hankercheifs were taken away from him and people were delivered. The Anointing can rest upon and within. We have received an unction (the anointing) from the Holy One and we know all things. It's double inside and outside. Praise God! We get double the power! Praise God!

 

[Jim B]

Check out this article:

"The Anointing"
Checking the Scriptures​

The only New Testament passages which talks about Christians and does not talk about rubbing physical, material things are 2 Cor 1:21 and 1 Jn 2:20-27. All other passages are either about Jesus being anointed (which cannot be extrapolated to Christians any more than verses about His holiness cannot be interpreted to mean that we are without sin) or about physical anointings (rubbings). So if these two passages don't define or explain 'the anointing' according to the current popular usage, then that usage is unbiblical.

2 Cor 1.21-22
Now it is God who makes both us and you stand firm in Christ. He anointed us, set his seal of ownership on us, and put his Spirit in our hearts as a deposit, guaranteeing what is to come.

The context reveals that it couldn't be talking about 'power', 'special blessing', etc. Paul is talking about why he didn't make it as promised to visit the church. He then cites how Jesus anointed (consecrated) him to be an apostle and thus can be trusted to be 'yes' (rather than 'yes' and 'no' in the same breath) just as Jesus was.

Try substituting your definition of 'anointing' here and see if it fits in the context of this passage. Forcing a 'special power'-type definition of 'anointing' here makes for a situation that doesn't flow or make sense.

1 Jn 2:20-27
But you have an anointing from the Holy One, and all of you know the truth. I do not write to you because you do not know the truth, but because you do know it and because no lie comes from the truth. Who is the liar? It is the man who denies that Jesus is the Christ. Such a man is the antichrist--he denies the Father and the Son. No one who denies the Son has the Father; whoever acknowledges the Son has the Father also. See that what you have heard from the beginning remains in you. If it does, you also will remain in the Son and in the Father. And this is what he promised us--even eternal life. I am writing these things to you about those who are trying to lead you astray. As for you, the anointing you received from him remains in you, and you do not need anyone to teach you. But as his anointing teaches you about all things and as that anointing is real, not counterfeit--just as it has taught you, remain in him.

The first thing you might notice in this passage is that John says ALL believers are anointed. This that blows away all the mysteriousness of "anointed" preachers or "anointed ministries" because ALL of us as Christians are anointed.

But anointed in what way? Again, context shows it couldn't be talking about 'power', 'special blessing', etc. John is contrasting backsliding or people who aren't even Christians anymore with Christians.

So this also has nothing to do with 'power' or some mystical 'anointing'. Instead, this is about how all Christians are consecrated to God.

Common actual (and unbiblical) explanations
and uses of the phrase 'the anointing'

Alleged objects of 'the anointing'​

Roles:
"Continued sinning has certainly limited Jimmy Swaggart's effectiveness in his God anointed role."

Ministries:
"The voting members (men included) have thus recognized a definite anointing for ministry on her life and have voluntarily placed themselves under her pastoral authority."

Ministers:
"Both are anointed ministers, one credentialed with the A/G, the other in Four Square or Church of God, Cleveland - I forget which."

Leaders:
"Pastor Bill and Benny Johnson are two of the most wonderful, loving and anointed leaders (and friends) to be found anywhere."

Preachers:
"Dr. Harvey R. Brown Jr...Anointed preacher, college administrator, and father of an "all-American" family-what more could a man want?"

Preaching:
"Disciples are made not just in Sunday school and home prayer meetings and Bible studies--they are made during Sunday services when the Pastor is supposed to be utilizing the gift of teaching and the anointing of preaching."

Teaching:
"There was wonderful, anointed teaching and preaching of the Word."

Men of God:
"Your website needs alot of prayer. I've never read so much pure baloney about an anointed man of God that does not conform to traditional churchy stuff. How sad that nobody seems to have met the Holy Spirit in person except Benny. All of the "authorities of the church" have missed it all if they can't even recognize the anointing that is on Benny Hinn."

Musical performances:
"The worship takes you directly into the Holy of holies through wooing, intimate love songs and anointed instrumental improvisation."

Songs:
"Two teen-age Slovakian girls linked arms and began sort of a Slovakian line dance as the music ministry continued to play an anointed song of praise."

Worship:
"The worship was heavenly. I have experienced greatly anointed times at Stoneleigh Bible Weeks and at other conferences, but I think our worship at Eaglescliffe reached new heights."

Drums:
"Now the bass drum begins to pound with a single stroke, slowly repeated over and over. Awesome, the anointing is on the drum! Cries of "ho-oh" and "huuh" punctuate the air, as the finger of the Spirit touches first one, then another. Robert sings...'into the river we go...'"

Sounds:
"Extended instrumental worship now. The keyboard player launches off into some kind of anointed sounding thing I've never heard before -- I couldn't even begin to identify it, but it was dripping with God's glory."