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Throwing out a Thought

Warptweet

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How can god exist?

Pretend this letter is existence: O
Within that "O" of existence, is the universe, matter, the dimensions, everything.

Apparently those who are religious beleive that god created that "O". Although, how ist hat possible?

You see, if god created that "O" of existence, where was god before existence existed? He would have to live outside of existence to do that. If he lived outside of existence... then he does not exist, therefore outside of existence.
 

Tinker Grey

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Another way of looking at it if there were only one universe: I'm not sure I've heard that the religious (of whom I'm one) say God created existence. Rather he created stuff. So one might say that prior to the creative act, that the only thing that existed was God.

The word existence describes a condition. I don't know that we can properly say that existence itself is a thing. Therefore it cannot be created.

(It may interest you to know that some modern scholars -- notably, Paul Tillich -- define God as the "Ground of being.")
 
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Warptweet

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Within that "O" of existence, is the universe, matter, the dimensions, everything.

That includes universe, but that sentence means that O includes existence, everything, absolutely everything.

And it is supported that god created everything, that means existence aswell. And that does not answer my "question".
 
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USincognito

a post by Alan Smithee
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This belongs in General Apologetics, not Creationism and Evolution.

If you need some advice on how to get to 100 posts so you can post there, please ask. Otherwise please don't post threads like this here.
 
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HypnoToad

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That includes universe, but that sentence means that O includes existence, everything, absolutely everything.

And it is supported that god created everything, that means existence aswell. And that does not answer my "question".
It's a false argument because Scripture doesn't say God created the state of existence, it says He created the universe.
 
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Tinker Grey

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That includes universe, but that sentence means that O includes existence, everything, absolutely everything.

And it is supported that god created everything, that means existence aswell. And that does not answer my "question".

I repeat, existence isn't a thing.
 
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AV1611VET

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You see, if god created that "O" of existence, where was god before existence existed? He would have to live outside of existence to do that.

Indeed --- God is transcendent.
 
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AV1611VET

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How can god exist?

Pretend this letter is existence: O

Within that "O" of existence, is the universe, matter, the dimensions, everything.

I submit that what is confusing you is the word "everything."

If you drop that word, it should read like this:

'Within that "O" of existence is the universe: time, space, and matter.'

Now you should be able to comprehend it.
 
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Ophiolite

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I submit that what is confusing you is the word "everything."

If you drop that word, it should read like this:

'Within that "O" of existence is the universe: time, space, and matter.'

Now you should be able to comprehend it.
Once upon a time there was a barrel. It was a substantial barrel, fabricated with care from staves of well-aged oak and bands of tempered steel. It never fulfilled its potential as a barrel, being filled with wine of questionable quality, from a grape of suspect stock. Over time, despite the tighness of the seals the wine evaporated, as wines will, leaving a non-descript sediment. And so it was that a person, spoken of for their great wisdom (mainly by themselves) came to the barrel and attempted to scrape the sediment from its bottom. A forlorn attempt, for the wine was long gone and vinter long departed.
Such is life.
 
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dlamberth

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I submit that what is confusing you is the word "everything."

If you drop that word, it should read like this:

'Within that "O" of existence is the universe: time, space, and matter.'

Now you should be able to comprehend it.
Existence points towards the physical realm which includes everything in the realm of "O". I know it sounds counter intuitive, but the sacred text of the various spiritual traditions point towards "O" (as I understanding the OP) as also existing in non-existence. Which from my understanding would include the word "everything".
 
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Meowzltov

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How can god exist?

Pretend this letter is existence: O
Within that "O" of existence, is the universe, matter, the dimensions, everything.

Apparently those who are religious beleive that god created that "O". Although, how ist hat possible?

You see, if god created that "O" of existence, where was god before existence existed? He would have to live outside of existence to do that. If he lived outside of existence... then he does not exist, therefore outside of existence.
This is an ancient thread, but since it's still circulating, I'll take a stab.

Traditionally (I'm leaving this open for the occasional person with an unusual view) God has been described as the Creator or the universe. This doesn't imply that this universe is the only universe or dimension or whatever that exists. Clearly if God exists, and God is not the universe, then there is existence apart from the universe.

As to the nature of God, I don't find it productive to argue about, given that we know absolutely nothing about God. We cannot even be certain there is a God (belief, as wonderful as it is, is simply not the same thing as certainty). How in the world would we go about finding evidence that God is this or God is that?

What most people do is put their faith in a particular book, whether it be the Bible or Quran or whatever... They appeal to the authority of that book, "It's the word of God." But this is a statement of faith. Again, very beautiful, but NOT the same thing as knowing. One cannot prove that any text is the word of God. So while someone may glean their own ideas about God from their religious text, they cannot use this text as evidence.
 
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The Righterzpen

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That includes universe, but that sentence means that O includes existence, everything, absolutely everything.

And it is supported that god created everything, that means existence aswell. And that does not answer my "question".
This assertion of your question sounds very nihilistic. Philosophically (and logically) one can't question existence if they don't exist. Thus God could not create "existence" when He is eternally existent.

Thus I agree with @Tinker Grey. Existence isn't a "thing" it's a state of being. (Which means a "being" exists or it doesn't.) Therefor God could not "create self" into "existence".

The question's assertion is nonsensical.
 
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